Glen Hill
By Greg L | 4 June 2007 | Prince William County | 141 Comments
Glen Hill is the incumbent Sheriff for Prince William County, and rode into office in 2003 on a wave of dissatisfaction with Democrat Lee Stoffregen. It was an upset victory that gave Hill near-hero status for not only beating someone who was reviled by many at the time of the election, but for then cleaning up a huge mess involving unaccounted for deputy badges and firearms, financial irregularities, and open hostility between the Sheriff’s Department and the county Police Department. I would expect that polling data would indicate that across the electorate, Glen Hill may have the highest positive numbers of any elected official in the county. This man is loved.
This shows up in Hill’s endorsements. Glen is endorsed by the entire Republican contingent of the Board of County Supervisors, Delegates Jeff Frederick, Scott Lingamfelter and Jackson Miller, four councilmen on the Manassas City Council, Congressman Tom Davis, and even Virginia Attorney General Bob McDonnell. (note: he is the only candidate who actually has published endorsements) The Prince William County Republican committee adores him, and gives him standing ovations almost every time he speaks. His stump speech is that he has kept his promise to the voters to clean up the mess, and it plays right into the reason the electorate helped him to crush Stoffregen in 2003. He has cleaned up the mess, healed the rift with the county police department, and refocused the Sheriff’s Department on it’s core responsibilities. By all rational accounts, Glen Hill has done an excellent job in his first term, and there’s not much of a convincing argument that he should be replaced.
Hill’s detractors claim he’s not a true conservative and that he’s wasted money on things like the golf cart at the courthouse. The golf cart is pretty useful in shuttling the elderly and disabled to the parking lots which are spread out quite a bit and running over to the Police Department to ferry records, and is a minor quibble that’s gotten hugely overblown. As for Hill’s conservative credentials, that may be a mixed bag. Hill is clearly a social conservative, but I don’t envision him leading the charge on conservative hot-button issues such as concealed carry and other second-amendment rights. These criticisms have been mis-framed to the point that reasonable discussion on this point is nearly impossible, and has so far it has been nearly ludicrous. As for the claim that he raised the department’s budget by $3 million dollars, there is not a shred of evidence anywhere that backs this claim up, and county budget documents prove this claim is false. A significant portion of the criticism of Glen Hill has been absolute hogwash, which has raised the passions in this debate to the level of complete hysteria at times.
The elephant in the room which everyone conveniently ignores that Glen Hill is a minority Republican. Candidates like these are a godsend to the Republican party, which allows the party to steadfastly ignore that Hill has previously been a Democrat, has a former Democrat as his Chief Deputy, and while he has worked on behalf of Republican candidates before, he doesn’t want to be a political animal who runs around championing Republican causes. He wants to be the Sheriff, focusing on the Sheriff part of the job rather than the “elected official” part of the job. For political animals like Jim Fotis, and to a lesser extent Mike Messier, this is the opening they’re trying to run through. It’s not smart. Republicans will forgive just about anything in order to have a respectable minority candidate and elected official in the party, as long as he’s a good team player, and Glen Hill certainly is one. Elected officials like this get significant support from across party lines, help encourage minorities to join the party, and embarrass local Democrats who haven’t run a credible minority candidate for office in recent memory. The “so what?” response to Hill’s past as a Democrat has largely shut off this discussion, and that’s probably the right thing. As an officeholder, Glen Hill has demonstrably been a good Republican, somewhat along the lines of a few others who started out in the Democratic Party and turned out to be pretty decent, such as, well, Ronald Reagan.
An incumbent, with a good record, and who helps fill in the “minority gap” in the Republican party should be unassailable from a political standpoint. He should be running much stronger than he is right now, which would seem to indicate that he hasn’t been working as hard as Mike Messier. This last week should be Hill’s opportunity to close the door on Messier’s strong attempts to close the gap, which may be more about appearance than substance. This race is Glen Hill’s to lose, and I’m not expecting that he will. There shouldn’t have been much of a question about this, but with it strongly competing for the title of “wackiest election of 2007″, perhaps a more dynamic race than was expected shouldn’t be all that surprising.
Also in this series:
Current Election Overview
candidate Mike Messier
candidate Jim Fotis
The opinions expressed here are solely the views of the author, and not representative of the position of any organization, political party, doughnut shop, knitting guild, or waste recycling facility, but may be correctly attributed to the Vast Right-Wing Conspiracy. If anything in the above article has offended you, please click here to receive an immediate apology.
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141 Comments
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Ronald Reagan had the courage to lead. Reagan was great on defense… including the Second Amendment.
Ronald Reagan was, in many ways, my hero. He is sorely, sorely missed!
The incumbent Sheriff is, by all accounts;
a good guy (nice guy)
is a minority
has not ‘made waves’
better than the bad Democrat he replaced
But, Republican Primaries give conservative voters the chance to ‘trade-up’.
Reagan was great on defense, including the Second Amendment. Hill has been silent on many issues but not on this one. Hill is terrible on this issue. He is the most Anti-Gun, anti-Self Defense candidate of the three. James J. Fotis for Sheriff is the best on this issue… he has all the endorsements.
Reagan was a great leader on many other fronts, willing to stand out front and preach a message of vision and passion to bring others along to his ‘bandwagon’ (that not only was ‘right’ — as in correct — but was also very conservative).
Fotis beats the other two candidates on this issue hands down. Hill has not led on hardly any ‘political issues’. Fotis has led on all kinds of them. Here in the County, Fotis in engaged on the hot Immigration issue….. Hill has done virtually nothing… (just one example, but it does make the point).
So, in the Reagan spirit, lets work to a noble dream, a dream of a better, safer Prince William County…. vote Fotis for Sheriff
Remember, when Reagan first ran many who stood in defense of the ’status quo’ stood against Reagan and his vision.
www.fotisforsheriff.com
(I am not trying to say Fotis is Reagan…. it was Greg who opened this line of comparison.)
As someone asked in a comment to Greg’s post about Fotis, what do the political beliefs of someone who is running for what is basically almost an exclusively administrative position have to do with anything.
Agree or disagree with Hill, Messier, or Fotis, but it really doesn’t matter does it ? Whether or not they’re a competent administrator is what really matters.
In my profession, I’m at the PWC Courthouse almost every day and Hill has clearly done a good job running the place and making changes that needed to be made.
Why change ?
“Glen Hill has done an excellent job in his first term, and there’s not much of a convincing argument that he should be replaced.”
You might want to look at our current sheriff’s record a little more. Glendell has raised the budget of the sheriff’s office over the years he was in office while reducing his workload by cutting services to the people and the community.
I would not call that an excellent job. And there are very good reasons why he should be replaced.
I do agree The incumbent Sheriff is, by all accounts;
a good guy (nice guy)
is a minority
has not ‘made waves’ (been a puppet)
better than the bad Democrat he replaced
“You might want to look at our current sheriff’s record a little more. Glendell has raised the budget of the sheriff’s office over the years he was in office while reducing his workload by cutting services to the people and the community.”
Anon 2:40 is a punk-assed liar. The budget has gone down over the last three years. Greg has verified this.
Easy does it BB. You tip off your IQ when using euphemisms such as that. It also give the impression that you are wounded and desperate. Might I suggest counseling on the subject of anger and denial? You seem to suffer from both. Angry because Hill is better than your candidate and denial because you have somehow convinced yourself that anyone but Hill has a chance. Get with IP after the election. I am sure you can get a group discount.
pundit-106,
please re-read my comments. I am 100% supporting Hill. Anonymous 2:40 is a liar indeed. Greg L. has proven that the budget has decreased each year that Hill has been in office. Anonymous (Norfolk resident) is a punk-assed liar, because he keeps floating this ridiculous claim, even after he has been categorically disproven.
The ridiculous claim that I am refering to is that Hill has increased his budget, while decreasing services. This is a lie that Messier supporters have thrown out there, on blogs, and in LTE’s in the MJM and PN.
The Sheriff’s Dept. is a “shared service” of Prince William
County, Manassas, and Manassas Park. In my
community, I know Glen Hill has been highly
respected since his days a Manassas City police officer
and then head of the Adult Detention Center. He
has been a first rate professional in every position he
has held - including Sheriff. His job isn’t to be a
political hack, but to be excellent Sheriff - and that he has
done.
Does being an ‘excellent sheriff’ in your opinion include being anti-gun, anti-self defense?
That is Hill’s record… anyone want to try and deny that fact.
Fotis has the support of the Second Amendment community — and they do tend to be a pretty active group of voters…
I did vote for Glen Hill. I understand that he has done a fine job. I still would like to know if he actively supports 287G.
I wish we could vote for PWC police chief. Things would be different don’t you think.
IP,
What does it matter what Glenn Hill thinks of RKBA ?
1. He has no real authority to do anything about it.
2. It would be inappropriate of him to use his position as Sheriff to lobby on issues that are unrelated to the job he performs.
IP
Ronald Reagan had the courage to lead. Reagan was great on defense… including the Second Amendment.
Ronald Reagan was, in many ways, my hero.
And Ronald Reagan was President of the United States, not Sheriff of Orange County, California.
There’s a difference.
Wow, your ‘candidate’ for sheriff, while in office, creates a ’secret’ form for a would-be gun owner, asks invasive, unnecesary and in my opinion terribly inappropriate questions. Then Sheriff Hill refuses to sign the gun forms. When cornered and pressed about this reportedly either lies or shades the truth and thats all A-Okay with you?
The Sheriff uses his official website to advance anti-gun content; uses his office to the detrement of the Second Amendment and you hardly care….
What kind of conservative are you… the type who sides with Senator Chuck Schumer or President Clinton? Was attorney general Janet Reno your role model for law and order issues… come on!
Do you want an anti-gun sheriff to be the R candidate?
And one other thing… If you want to see what Hill supports while wearing his badge of office why don’t you go to the Independent candidate for Clerk of the Court website and you will see that the main image for her campaign is Sheriff Hill and his badge of office…
And this is while there is a Republican Candidate for that office.
Will you skip over anything/everything just to support your guy? I think PW Co. voters want a little more than that!
IP — What question on the “secret” gun form do you so strongly object to? That invasive question about criminal records or mental competence?
Why don’t you take this rant in a brochure form door-to-door instead of taking over this blog as if YOU own it. I’m sure you’ll do as much good for your candidate out in the neighborhoods as you are doing for him right here.
I agree IP, and don’t forget to tell the people where you’re from…I’m sure that will go over great.
Anon -
Among other ‘conservative values’ I support the Second Amendment. It make me furious when an elected person, like Sheriff Hill takes a rabid, anti-gun stance and then makes matters worse by trying to hide it/mislead folks about it.
Elected officials should not be using their office — and taxpayer funds — to do the bidding of gun control whacko’s.
Sorry if you disagree…. at least now it becomes clear why you seem to support Hill….
Nice jab about the mental compotence… do you really think such comments do such an important issue justice?
AWCheney -
The fact is that Hill is anti-gun and his record on that score is, finally, being revealed for all to see.
The gun community is lining up behind Fotis for Sheriff.
Hill’s failure to lead for four years is finally being discussed (like on immigration) and all you can do is throw one liners attacking me. Shame on you!
I do believe that voters in PW Co. are tired of that kind of politics as usual. I hope the truth continues to come out!
An informed electorate will vote James J. Fotis for Sheriff. I hope your attempts to distract them and to play the dirty game of politics as usual fails and fails miserably.
Interested Party, my problem with you has largely been how you are continually saying the same thing over and over again, and thereby hijack threads…even those that had absolutely nothing to do with the Sheriff’s race (previous threads), and you have admitted that you don’t even live in Prince William County. If you want a campaign blog for Fotis…go start one! You have said nothing here that you haven’t said numerous times before and it really has begun to annoy me, as you can tell by my comments. And I should like to point out that the First Amendment gives me the right to express my annoyance.
I have investigated the claims that Hill is anti-gun, and they are not accurate. While Glen Hill is not an RKBA stalwart, and could reasonably be challenged by those who are, the characterization that he is anti-gun is disingenuous and detracts from what could be an honest debate.
As such, IP and a few others have entirely poisoned this argument by overreaching. I cautioned commenters in the opening post on this about this behavior, and clearly they haven’t gotten it. This diatribe is absolutely indicative of the garbage I have been putting up with for months on this race, and reflects poorly on the candidates who are supposedly to benefit from it.
It’s a shame one person had to ruin the exchange and discussion we could have had about this important race. It kind of reminds me of somebody else in all the threads on the race in the 51st.
“Wow, your ‘candidate’ for sheriff, while in office, creates a ’secret’ form for a would-be gun owner, asks invasive, unnecesary and in my opinion terribly inappropriate questions”
“The Sheriff uses his official website to advance anti-gun content; uses his office to the detrement of the Second Amendment and you hardly care….”
Please provide a link.
“The budget has gone down over the last three years. Greg has verified this.”
Even Glendell would say you don’t know what you are talking about. The budget has gone up evey year except 2008 budget, where he is going to cut $100K out of the pork he has built up over the past years.
You have to get to know your candidate before you can talk about his record. However, it is good you know he reduced his workload by cutting services to the people and the community and we still gave him $460 thousand dollars.
Batson Belfrey, regarding your post @3:30, I believe there is
a complete misunderstanding as to Hill’s budget, inasmuch as
the fleet of vehicles has NEVER been included in the budget and
this is just wrong. Shouldn’t the vehicles be considered in the
budget?
Naked Republican, are you talking about NEW vehicles or inventory? If you’re talking about inventory, somebody needs to give you some lessons in budgeting.
“Fotis has the support of the Second Amendment community”
What?!?!?
Glen Hill is endorsed by Bob McDonnell, Scott Lingamfelter, Jackson Miller, every Republican on the Board of Count Supervisors…
Everyone of these folks is a supportor of second amendment rights.
Fotis, if you are reading this, be aware that your friend here is delusional.
Greg L. - I have been a Second Amendment activist for over two decades and with all due respect to you, I know an anti-gunner when I see one. Hill is an anti-gunner!
Apparently major gun groups and leaders would also disagree with you; they seem to see a stark difference in favor of Fotis over Hill when it comes to this issue. Fotis has been endorsed by VCDL, VSSA, CCRKBA, etc. etc.
Fotis is an Benefactor level, Life Member of NRA.
As I udnerstand it, Hill has even refused to complete ANY of the candidate surveys sent to him that would place him publicly on record as the anti-gunner I now know him to be. Fotis has completed his surveys…. not surprisingly, from the gun owner perspective, he completed them ‘right’!
Hill’s record on guns (the part he has made public) is for all to see.
Greg, you have seen the secret Hill gun form and I have seen it. I have been told directly with first person testimony from multiple individuals — those who have personally felt the sting of Hill’s anti-gun sting (refusal to sign forms) of his hostility to gun owners and refusal to sign. If you wish to post the form in quesiton for all to see and judge only you can…. it is your site.
Unless I am mistaken — and I invite you to correct me if I am factually wrong — when you asked Hill about not signing gun owner’s BATFE forms he was, uh what word best fits… disingenuous…. not ‘forth coming,’….. I don’t know what word you would use but I sure know what word I would use. You tell us, Greg, did Hill directly refute the form in question?…
Is Hill now publicly ready to claim that the form in quesiton does not exist and never did? Is he now ready to publicly claim that he has suddenly (now almost a week before election) flipped his position and become a Second Amendment supporter? I bet not a chance.
I will cede the point that you believe this issue is as you have said previously, “but even if that’s true, it’s not likely a big deal to most voters. Compared to all the good he’s done in office, this is real down-in-the-weeds stuff.”
To me (and I suspect for thousands of voters) the Second Amendment, and how the Sheriff uses the power of his office to covertly deny Prince William County residents of their rights is not “down-in-the-weeds stuff”! If that is still your take on this than we will have to agree to disagree….
Hill has staked out an open anti-gun record; his campaign website is completely silent on this issue (the only reason I can see why he would hide his record is that it confirms his anti-gun pedigree). Hill has put it in writing, he has put stuff on his Prince William County Departmental website that I believe are not only anti-gun in their origination but are inteded to thwart gun ownership and gun use for self-defense.
Hill has NOT EVER that I can find any evidence of — again I invite you to correct me if I am wrong on this — NOT EVER said or done ANYTHING as Sheriff to support or defend the Second Amendmnet nor advance or support legitimate self-defense!
So with all due respect, when everything is added up I think it equals Hill being actively anti-gun and Fotis being way, way better on this issue than him.
The question is: Do you or do you not want a more pro-Second Amendmenet Sheriff?
On the endorsement front… yes Hill — as an incumbent seeking reelection, long before Fotis entered the race — got the endorsement of key political figures….
I suspect had Fotis been in the race as long as Hill has been running, things on this score would be quite different.
And you can point out all the politicans you want, but the gun groups are behind Fotis not Hill…. just go to the Hill campaign website and look at endorsements and you will notice they are not there!
I would have to put Interested Party in the same category with Naked Republican. Greg already addressed this with you IP, and slapped you down. And I notice that Naked Republican isn’t responding to my question regarding the Sheriff’s Department vehicles. I suspect he/she doesn’t know what he/she is talking about either.
Greg,
It’s your site, do what you want… but if there was ever anybody posting here who deserved to be banned, it is Interested Party.
It is one thing for there to be a difference of opinion in the interpretation of data - for example, in the Faisal Gill affair. I believe the evidence puts him in a very bad light. His supporters say it is all guilt-by-association. I can see where they are coming from; don’t agree, but I can see their position.
“Interested Party” on the other hand appears to be an out-and-out liar. He states things like the Sheriff’s county website is anti-gun and filled with anti-gun rhetoric. Where? I looked. I don’t see it. I’ve never seen it previously. IP was asked for a link - just one to support what appear to be lies. Can he provide one - apparently not.
What “form” is he talking about? He was asked for a link, but can’t provide it. There is a form on the Sheriff’s website - it links to the Virginia State Police for a concealed carry permit.
And this garbage about Hill is “anti-gun” because he hasn’t been championing pro-gun. What kind of crazy logic is that? Well, with that kind of twisted logic, how about this — I haven’t seen Fotis on the stump doing anything to specifically stop wife beating, so he must be in favor of it.
It is one thing to have a difference of opinion in regard to the interpretation of information, but it is quite another to blatantly make up lies as “Interested Party” has done.
To all who have asked for a link to Sheriff hill’s anti-gun in question:
Greg L has suggested that the form (and presumably those gun folks who complained to me personally about Hill’s anti-treatment) are somehow not true.
I have directly asked Greg to state some support for that conclusion. I am providing him time to do so.
I have asked Greg, since as I understand it, he and he alone can post a graphic image of the Hill form in quesiton to this site for all to see, to do so.
I am awaiting some kind of response.
“Interested Party” you have done the absolute worst job of promoting your candidate that I have seen anyone do in Prince William County elections so far this year. Do you realize how high the bar had to be to pull that off?
Thank you for helping to further energize and untite the re-elect Glen Hill forces !!
Lars -
If you are a Hill supporter and you needed someone like me to point out your candidate’s terrible track record on the Second Amendment in order to energize and unite the forces that support a candidate with such a pedigree/history, I really don’t know what to say.
If you are saying that it is okay with you, for your R primary candidate to use the Office of Sheriff to advance a gun/self-defense hostile environment for PW Co. voters than I wish you would just come out directly and say so.
There are people who run on an open anti-gun, anti-self defense platform. All I am asking for is a little honesty. If Hill is trying to claim suddenly that he is not Anti-gun I want that honestly on the record and I, for one, will demand some kind of proof of that change of position (beginning at least with a public admission of his past anti-gun activities/actions/positions).
If ,on the other hand, you are saying that Hill’s bad record on this issue does not matter than I think it would be more honest to simply admit that Hill is running as the worst candidate on this issue.
Regarding just the Hill ’secret’ gun hostile form, Greg L. said, “…. even if that’s true, it’s not likely a big deal to most voters. Compared to all the good he’s done in office, this is real DOWN-In-THE-WEEDS STUFF.” {My emphasis added.}
I — and I think many other Second Amendment activists — strongly disagree with this concept. It is like saying he isn’t anti-gun and anyway whats the big deal if he is… no one knows, no one cares, its all ‘down in the weeds’. Of course no one knows, and without knowledge, few can care; that is precisely why getting the truth out matters so greatly.
Voters, if they learn of Sheriff Hill’s anti-gun record, will care… BUT ONLY IF THEY KNOW.
IP,
YOU know how to use the internet.
YOU have claimed that the sheriff’s public county website is FILLED with anti-gun rhetoric.
LINK it.
If not, YOU are a LIAR.
AWCheney, there is so much posting done by IP, it’s sort of
difficult for me to get in here and respond to your 6/4 posting.
No, it wasn’t inventory vehicles I was talking about, I was
thinking about all the NEW cruisers (not to mention the 2 golf
carts) that have been added to the fleet since he took office.
Thank you, but there is no need for you to bother with budgeting lessons for yours truly.
IP — Once again you missed the point. I meant that when we see what Fotis’ supporters think passes for effective campaigning, we all begin to question what’s wrong with this guy when perhaps we didn’t before.
I had hoped to be able to actually have an intelligent give and take discussion on this campaign, but now you have ruined it.
At the very least, your rants have caused everyone to tune out completely. Thanks to you, even if anyone was remotely inclined to examine what good qualities your candidate may possess, you have taken that opportunity away by your bizarre and increasingly irritating way of spreading his “message” (He should be very proud of you right now).
Please, do yourself and your candidate a favor by ceasing to dig the hole deeper than it is already (that would be the hole you’re in, in case you missed that point too).
“No, it wasn’t inventory vehicles I was talking about, I was
thinking about all the NEW cruisers (not to mention the 2 golf
carts) that have been added to the fleet since he took office.”
Like I said Naked Republican…go get some lessons in budgeting. IF THEY ARE ALREADY IN THE FLEET, THEY ARE INVENTORY. Should I “say” that slower. Those items would have been in previous inventories as capital investment (or purchase of equipment), as any new equipment purchase proposals would be in the NEXT (or new) budget. If there are none, that means that Glen feels they have what they need through the next cycle. Did I explain that simply enough for you NR…anyone, think that was understandable enough for this person.
I meant “in previous budgets,” not previous inventories. I should be more careful, especially when explaining something to this person. “Assuming they will understand” is a BAD assumption.
Okay someone needs to say it.
Unless he can produce a link proving otherwise, IP is lying about the “secret” gun form.
Go to the Forms section of the Sheriff’s website and the only forms related to CCW permits that you’ll find are links to the PDF copies of the official Virginia state forms.
I don’t know who Jim Fotis is, but I’ve got to believe he doesn’t appreciate losers like this backing him.
Lawyer -
Are you seriously suggesting that the lack of a link effectively ‘proves’ that Hill created/authorized/used such a form to the detrement of County residents gun (and fair treatment) rights?
Come on now….
Does anyone wish to go out on a limb and on behalf of Hill state that this form does not exist and that Hill did not authorize it / use it….
Come on now, I double dog dare someone on make that claim on Hill’s behalf! Provided of course that when the truth is proven … that you will switch votes to Fotis or at least admit that Hill has an anti gun pedigree….
Why do I suspect that when this issue is ‘proven’ true those who are covering for Hill and misleading the people about his anti-gun bias will never admit the truth….
Time will tell
This sounds like the Stevie Chapman/Faisal Gill argument, doesn’t it gang…”I don’t have to prove it, everyone else does!”
AWCheney - can you read? That is not even close to what I said… If you are gonna slam what I wrote… please at least make it relate to what I wrote…. (was that slow enough for you to understand)?
I take the fact that your response failed to have you ‘bet the farm’ on your confidence that Hill did not create/use/authorize such an offensive and invasive anti-gun form means you are admitting to yourself and others that such could be true….
Anyone on the Hill side willing to ‘bet the farm’ that I am wrong about Hill’s ’secret’ anti-gun form?
IP, you’re the one insisting that evidence exists which no one can find, and yet you are continually demanding that others find/provide this phantom link, whose very existence is suspect. I would make a rude remark, but that’s Jimmy Young’s department.
AWCheney, I will ignore your pathetic attempt at being such
a superior intellectual. You need to get over yourself!
These are IP’s quotes from this thread:
“The Sheriff uses his official website to advance anti-gun content; uses his office to the detrement of the Second Amendment….”
“Hill has put it in writing, he has put stuff on his Prince William County Departmental website that I believe are not only anti-gun in their origination but are inteded to thwart gun ownership and gun use for self-defense.”
And when asked to provide a link to said “anti-gun” information on the county website, IP gets all pissed off and says he doesn’t have to prove it.
Seriously, there are some neurons misfiring there, buddy. YOU SAID HILL HAS ANTI-GUN STUFF ON THE COUNTY WEBSITE. PROVE IT. Unless, of course, you’re just pulling stuff out of your a$$.
It is interesting to note that Fotis counts a blatant LIAR among his friends. I bet he’s mighty proud of that, if he even knows you.
Only a person with serious issues could claim that there are in fact anti-gun documents on a county website and then lash out at others when the documents don’t exist.
Get help. Was that slow enough for YOU to understand?
NR, I will concede to being in a rather bad mood and responding accordingly…but the facts are what they are, and not what you want them to be.
IP,
You are the one who has made the allegation about a secret form and an anti-gun agenda. Based on the fact that you haven’t provided any evidence to support the allegation, and the fact that the available evidence does not indicate that such a form exists, I don’t believe you’re allegation.
If you want to convince me or anyone else, you’ll have to provide proof.
If you can that is.
[…] Black Velvet Bruce Li, who has provided background information on the race as well as profiles of incumbent Sheriff Glen Hill, and challengers Mike Messier, and Jim Fotis. So, if you’re a Prince William County voter in […]
I doubt that most of you are aware:
I recently learned that Sheriff Hill had two staff members just graduate with their Masters degree and has sent 5 (over a period of time) of his supervisors to the highly respectable Administrative Officers Management Program at North Carolina State University. Sheriff Hill encourages his staff to seek additional training to advance the department and bring an exceptional amount of skill and leadership to the office. Sheriff Hill is a leader and dedicated to his staff, citizens and the Sheriff’s office. There is probably so much more of this type of training and education that we are not aware of, but I thought this was worth sharing! Kudos to the Sheriff and his staff!
VOTE HILL June 12
I am surprised to not see posts yet about Louis Dominguez’s independent run for sheriff… or Judy Feder’s announcement today that she is going to run against Wolf again. I would think, Greg, that you might have a little something to say about that.
[Ed note: Oh, I’ll get to it. Swamped is an understatement for my situation right now.]
Reference Mike Messier yard signs “Many of these are in the yards of members of the law enforcement community, which also seems to have a group of active volunteers pushing Mike’s candidacy”
The law enforcement community tends to be a tight knit group. Since the law enforcement community is pushing Messier for sheriff, they are telling to people, there is a lack of leadership in the chief law enforcement officer (Sheriff) and are giving him a vote of no confidence.
As VCDL member, I have not received any notification from leadership that VCDL has endorsed anyone at this point. While they may intend to, touting a VCDL endorsement is nothing but a LIE at this point. I have done VA-Alert search for all VA-Alerts with name of Fotis and I have zero hits. I have them all the way back from 2003. If Greg L would like email contact for VCDL man in charge, he can find me but I imagine he can locate Phillip himself.
Grayson and IP as usual what county are you from must be from another state
as usual the politics dont apply; Hill is the Sheriff not a Political animal just a Sheriff
one that does a great job. He gets along with his peers and cares about people.
I am a republican but the Sheriff in Prince William County is just that a Sheriff not the one and only example of Conservative values in the state.
He is the best leader for the day all the rest are just a joke with an ugly punch line.
And Grayson , the dumb arses were the non trained reserves from the stoffy days they are just a joke and hello they all want Messier back in Office,
makes good sense So Messier Make a joke of the Sheriffs Office Yet again.
[Ed note: comment edited]
With all the people jumping in to run for sheriff, it seems the sheriff’s office is a joke now and not very well ran. There’s an air that Glendell’s days in office are short and numbered. The people want and public servant not just someone who thinks the sheriff is just a job to collect a paycheck.
Anonymous,
Are you kidding? You must be…there is not an air that Sheriff’s Hills days are numbered….how can you possibly substantiate that Hill is simply in office to collect a paycheck? You are a complete liar and have not done your homework. Hill took a significant pay cut to run as sheriff to unseat the rebel with a mission…remember him…your good buddy Stoffregen/Messier. Good try though…VOTE HILL JUNE 12
Grayson,
I suspect that the group you are referencing is a very small group. It really is not about yard signs…Messier is a nice guy no doubt about that but he was the weak link in office. He knew everything that was going on and the way I see it is that he chose to go along with it or he was to weak to confront Stoffregen on it. Trust me when I say the law enforcement community does not want to go back to the ways under that regime. So I highly doubt Messier has a large support system in place for the law enforcement community. By the way what evidence do you have that the law enforcement community is pushing Messier to Sheriff? I caution you to answer carefully as this thread is read by many folks and I would suspect a great many of them are members of the law enforcement community.
VOTE FOR HILL JUNE 12
Grayson must have attended the same school that IP has attended. That being the school that Chris Angel (Mind Freak) resides over. Your smoke and mirrors have done nothing more than add entertainment value to what is otherwise a settled election. It is a well known and regarded fact that Hill is a superior administrator and very successful leader. No matter how hard you try, you cannot create the illusion that our sheriff is anything but a well liked, very popular leader who is held in high esteem by almost everyone. Everyone but those who wish they were him or had what he has. Voete4hill is correct in asserting that this rising up amongst the law enforcement community is a farce. It is the latest in a seemingly desperate attempt to give the appearance of dissention amongst our tight knit community. The same community that ousted the last sheriff and overwhelmingly endorsed the current.
vote4hill posting on 6/5@6:11, re the continuing educational
feats. I applaud those folks, and the tax payers who paid for
those accomplishments. Has Hill’s educational background
been questioned? Maybe it should have been Hill and Collier
seeking out some degrees but I suppose that is not a priority.
PUNDIT, there is no desperate attempt nor is it a farce that
the law enforcement community is pushing for Messier. Some
deputies have told me that they had Hill signs forced upon them
whether or not they wished them to be displayed in their yards.
Makes one think of Hitler, doesn’t it?
Oh my god.
I can’t believe somebody actually compared political signs in yards to the Hitler regime.
Talk about a lack of perspective.
I can’t believe people don’t know Glendell is a thug.
[Ed note: I can believe, however, that readers are more likely to support Hill after seeing his critics behave like this.]
1:23 — People don’t know because he is NOT. By the way, you can’t be taken serously if you just make a crazy statement like that without backing it up. Reminds me of your candidate…uh..Stoff…um Messi…um..whoever.
For all we know you had to eat bad food when you were in his jail and that makes you bitter.
1:33 I have not heard that before. Are you saying Glendell made the inmates eat bad food when he was a jailer? ?
More murder and more robbery is Sheriff Hill’s legacy.
Check the stats yourself (http://www.pwcgov.org/docLibrary/PDF/005943.pdf)
The department is closing fewer violent crime cases and property crime cases…that’s not good.
The murder rate…up more than 20%
Robberies…up 40%
Aggravated assault…up 9%
Rape is down…that’s good…but measured against these other facts…I don’t think anyone should sleep well tonight…or any other night until the badge is passed from Hill to Fotis on June 12th.
It’s quite a stretch to blame Hill for changes in the county’s crime rate. Before we start slamming him for this, how about we talk about Chief Deane?
Perhaps someone should talk to Paul Ebert about the increasing crime rate and the inability of cases to be closed. Then there is also the ever increasing rate of illegal aliens, undocumented and oblivious to our laws, flowing into the County. Then someone should look at the job description of our County Sheriff…which is administrative and does not include enforcement, adjudication or any of the things which would affect these rates.
Hey there nude republican, or should I say blind republican. Are these the same deputies that were told by Lee to tear down Hill signs during the last election? The fact that a sheriff asks his deputies for their support isn’t a shocker. The fact that you find it offensive is. You and blueline billy are under the impression that the Sheriff is accountable for the crime rate in a county exploding in population. Uh….. there are several police jurisdictions in this county in case you didn’t know. I guess we’ll blame Hill for world hunger and the gas price hike too. And anonymous gives the impression that he spent time in Hills brig. Another disgruntled ex-con speaks out against a sheriff. Imagine that. Is there a couple of rogue cops out there not in support of Hill…. maybe. Truth be known, they were probably turned down a job by the Sheriff due to not being qualified.
It is my observation that much of what is alledged here about the incumbent are simply false, unsubstantiated bold face lies. I suppose that may be the way of the blog, but come on - really….
I just recieved a mailer from Fotis - just another pack of lies. He, as IP does, aserts Hill is anti-gun claiming there is some “secret” form to fill out before you can buy a gun. The rest of that story is the guns in question are machine-guns, sawed off shotguns, and silencers. I, for one, appreciate the fact I can own a gun, and further appreciate that somebody is at least investigating the people who are looking to purchase these particularly destructive weapons.
Not finding this “anti-gun” form in the web, I went to the Sheriff’s Office and asked what I needed to do to purchase a firearm - they instructed me there was a Federal form one has to fill out to purchase a gun available at the dealer. I was also advise that if I wanted to purchase or transfer an automatic weapon, I needed an “ATF Form-4″ This form needed to be signed by a law enforcement person(Chief or Sheriff). I further found out that the Police Chiefs will not sign this form, but the Sheriff will, IF he can determine the person(s) having access to the weapon is not a mental patient, criminal , or garden variety terrorist. The questions on the “Sheriff’s Form” are the same questions that are on the ATF form-4. The Sheriff’s Form looks like it was desigend to actually help one fill out the AFT form properly.
There is a line in the Fotis flyer that states “[The Sheriff] will not sign gun purchase forms” - seems he the only one who will.
Another line about not wanting people to keep a firearm loaded for self-defense - I remember my instruction from the NRA was to keep the ammo and gun seperated to avoid accidents - seems reasonable to me.
IP seems to have quieted down - I suppose busy with that flyer which is full of his misdirection and mis-truths. But he was right about one thing - engaging me. Superior intellect should be feared….
And I agree with your last comment Greg L - blaming the Sheriff for what the PD does/does not do, is like me blaming IP for sinking the Titanic
Maybe he did Henry.
Is Fotis that old
To follow up on Anonymous 1:33 comment he sounds like he is trying to tell us about Hill making inmates eat “bad food” does anyone know anything about that? The comment he made does not sound like it is something made off the cuff.
Grayson, you might want to refresh your sense of humor when it comes to sarcasm…or perhaps all sarcastic remarks should come with a “sarcasm alert?”
Making someone eat “bad food” maybe funny to you and Hill, but it is a sick policy.
And perhaps, Grayson, your neural synapse aren’t firing on all cylinders.
NR,
Taxpayers didn’t pay for those masters degrees and what makes you think that Hill or Collier wasn’t one of them that received the degree. (speaking slowly so you can understand) Grasping my dear!
Grayson,
What are you asking? (speaking slowly so you can understand) If you have a question ask it…there are intelligent people that post on this thread that can help you.
BB,
I feel sorry for you. You need educated on the way the policing is done in this County. For your information Hill’s responsibilities are the security of the courthouse. You know that place where all the bad guys go to see the judge after the POLICE catch them. (speaking slowly so you can understand)
ANON,
Define thug please….then walk to a mirror, spin around in circles and say I am a moron three times. (speaking slowly so you can understand)
I hope the citizens of Prince William, Manassas and Manassas Park are following the Fotis and Messier supportes and their sick attempt to defame Sheriff Hill.
Grayson, BB, ANON and NR, you all need to learn to play nice with others. 1st graders could probably teach all of you some lessons in name calling and lying you know those important values that teach and instill good citizenship. Look up the big words in Webster.
VOTE HILL JUNE 12, 2007
AW,
You inspire me…thank you.
VOTE HILL JUNE 12
Grayson and 2:02…get a grip! I (1:33) was just yanking the chain of 1:23’s ridiculous “thug” comment. I thought it would be funny to ask him if the bad jail food made him bitter (jokingly implying he might be the type that might know firsthand what the jail was like — oking that it made im angry).
The fact that you all can’t even pick up on this…then go the amazing step of trying to start something over “possible bad food in the jail” makes me understand why it is like banging one’s head into concrete to reason with you over common sense topics.
IMPOSSIBLE.
Thumper said on 5 Jun 2007 at 10:21 pm:
As VCDL member, I have not received any notification from leadership that VCDL has endorsed anyone at this point. While they may intend to, touting a VCDL endorsement is nothing but a LIE at this point.
Thought you might want to know that the Fotis mailing that was received by some today states that in fact the Virginia Citizens Defense League is endorsing Jim Fotis. I am sure this mailing was sent out two days ago which would put that at a day before you above post.
I just found that of interest and thought you might as well.
VOTE HILL JUNE 12
So now a Hill supporter is actually seeing the Sheriff’s open, tax-payer funded opposition to anyone having a loaded gun, ever,… no exceptions… not even for Self-Defense, not even for CHP (permit holders)
seeing the fact that Hill spins his gun guidelines to county residents to follow the anti-gun, guns are bad…. emphasis that gun owners can be prosecuted, HCI styled schtick (not one word of gun friendly material, no balance at all for those who cherish the Second Amendment)
admitting that Hill has created a secret, invasive (potentially ‘extra-legal?’) form for prospective gun owners to fill out
AND surprise, surprise it is all just okay by him… and by extension all Hill supporters?… that Hill is gun hostile…
No wonder that NRA, VCDL-PAC, VSSA, GOA, LEAA and gun leaders like Alan Gottleib of CCRKBA/SAF have all come out publicly to support Fotis for Sheriff and the oppose Hill’s anti-gun pedigree.
Guess that just about proves my earlier post that they will never admit the truth. Sadly, even Greg L. did not have, what in my opinion was the bad graces, to admit publicly that he was DEAD WRONG when he said I was wrong/lied about Hill’s secret gun form.
If you’all want a Sheriff who is this gun-hostile then we will have to agree to disagree…. At least now, FINALLY the Hill camp are beginning to begrudginly admit his Anti-Gun, abusive and gun owner hostile adminstration.
IP Ip IP IP Pleaase wwwwaaakkkeee up your dreammmmmming
Who the hell is Collier, and why does this IP dude fail to talk straight? Is he Fotis ???
IP,
Good try…if you think for one second that the citizens are going to believe your outrageous post, after seeing the Fotis mailing that is full of lies you are much less intelligent that I had originally suspected. See IP what you have a problem understanding is that the citizens are absolutely done with lies, egos and out of control power hungry people like Fotis. Fotis has went against his own statements to the public on his own website and has lied. Fotis’ and his gun movement will not get him voted into office. I do not hear any citizens complaining about their 2nd Ammendment rights being violated. So what is this really about? Well it is about a last ditch attempt on one issue that the citizens are not questioning. It is the only issue that Fotis seems to know anything about…there is a word for people like him. Fotis knows nothing about running a Sheriff’s office unless of course the Sheriffs office focus will be legislation for gun rights. What happens to the core functions of the Sheriffs office? Prince William residents will not stand for it. The citizens have expectations and those expectations are exceedingly being met by Sheriff Hill…
VOTE HILL JUNE 12
Jason,
Collier is the Chief Deputy under Sheriff Hill and yes IP does have a habit of not talking straight. You know talks in circle after circle..us bloggers have dealt with this for awhile it actually seems like forever. He is relentless and he probably is Fotis. What we do know about him is that he pees standing up. His post not mine….
VOTE HILL JUNE 12
OK….. That may have been too much information ( re peeing) - but , we don’t vote for a deputy, only the Sheriff, so why throw that other guy into this mess?
Jason,
I call that last ditch attempts because it is down to the wire…this is where it gets ugly.
Sorry about the (pee thing) that was simply out of the babes mouth (IP)
VOTE HILL JUNE 12
‘Out of control ‘, ‘power hungry’… seems to just about clearly define a Sheriff who for no discernable reason and without any statutory authorization that I can find, creates a form for a would-be gunowner to complete that asks questions about what you do for a living, if you have kids in your home AND want to get this particular gun and, best for last, sign an authorization for what, warrantless, limitless searches?!?
That may be fine by you but when an elected official singles out a would-be gun owner for “Special Processing” and uses the authority of that office — without legal standing — that sounds pretty much like power hungry and anti-gun to me….
Does anyone really think that is okay for Sheriff Hill to do.
And, if it is okay, why did this form stay secret for so long….. Why did Greg L. mislead us all on this? Why didn’t hill put it on his departmental website and take ‘ownership’ for what he created. (His name is clearly on the top of the form!)
If it wasn’t wrong, if it wasn’t going to hurt him politically then why didn’t Hill and his supporters just admit this form’s creation, use / existence, explain their rationale (if they could) and then let the voters decide.
Why the attempt at deception….?
And if you have not heard gun owners complain about being ’screwed’ by Sheriff Hill than I suggest you go to where some are (like the next gun show in Dale City) and you will trip all over them… I know I did… and boy were they ticked off at Hill! One by one they told me about how Hill misled them and then refused to approve/sign their forms!
Now I guess we’ll see how many gun folks are mad and how many will vote…
I sure do hope its a whole bunch and that they, to a person, vote for change from an anti-gun power hungry, form hiding, Sheriff Hill!
OK but I still don’t understand why we are talking about somebody who is not in the race - looks to me like attacking associates should be off limits - but if you are already a looser, I guess that is what you do….
Isn’t there some other issue(s) than guns ??
VCDL-PAC is endorsing Fotis in the June 12 election. There are only so many hours in the day and we had to get the cards for this election and others in the mail - plus we all have day jobs too.
The email announcing our endorsement of Fotis should be out this evening.
Mack Elliott
Chairman
VCDL-PAC
Damn IP you need a little anger management … according towhat I have read, you are talking about machine guns but you fail to mention that - I don’t want some nut job living next to me having a machine gun - I believe they have that problem in Iraq and you see how that’s going… and sorry, I did swear that time….
It sounds like some of you are saying “they were only inmates” who cares if Hill made them eat “bad food”? Well, these so called inmates are people, sons, daughters, wives, husbands,mothers and fathers and they deserve better then Hill making them eat “bad food” just so he can get a laugh.
Jason — I am not the one swearing, you are.
Kinda a typical liberal (and anti-gunner) thing to project onto others what you yourself are feeling… Oh, by the way, I am a Second Amendment supporter….. it ain’t about duck hunting you know.
So for you it is perfectly okay that Hill creates special forms for some folks who want to get a ‘legal’ gun…. just not the one you are uncomfortable with…. just not if they happen to live in your town/neighberhood
Let me check:
Greg L. Do you agree with this theory… its okay to screw honest gun owners IF it is one of those very scary looking, black guns?
Is that the reason Greg that you said that this issue didn’t matter….?
I could not disagree more strongly… gun owners will either hang together or we will surely not have a Second Amendment…
I am so GLAD that this issue is finally gettting out..
Come on all you Hill supporters — who share this hatred/fear of ‘bad’ ‘ugly’ guns and think that for those particular gun owners its pefectly okay for Sheriff Hill to abuse his office and his power to screw them…
They are too few… they are unpopluar… their guns are scary…..
Unreal! Thank God we have a Constitution and soon the voter can elect a new Sheriff who won’t abuse Prince William County Gun Owners any more!
Clever - you still avoid calling then fully automatic guns - I think you should get a reality check IP - Again, I will have to confirm this, but Henry said Hill does sign those federal forms when nobody else will - so I cannot figure why you are so anti HIll - he seems to be the only guy on your side —–
By the way Jason, IP has admitted that he doesn’t even live in Prince William County…so he has no vested interest in this race (unless he’s been promised a job) and is not likely to get stuck with his boy for four years. To me, this makes his arguments all the less compelling.
And IP…YOU kept insisting that there was a mysterious link to some phantom secret form online which you refused to provide, demanding that others prove it didn’t exist. When someone did some research and dispelled all your original allegations, you spin it into something else. I hope you realize that the greatest majority of the people who comment here have IQ levels far greater than their shoe size and can easily see through your rhetoric. You might want to try some new lines.
IP I beleive the form in question has been addressed…it is not secret and it is available at the courthouse…in addition Hill signs them….Deane does not. If the question about kids in your home when you are applying for a fully automatic weapon is a problem for you then so be it. These are class three weapons we are talking about and that form you are referencing is covering ONLY Class III weapons. Please stop misleading the citizens into thinking this is about any gun or a violation of your 2nd Amendment rights because it clearly is not. You have lied and threw mud tonight and you have absolutely accomplished nothing.
AW,
Fotis has definately underestimated the citizens in Prince William, Manassas and Manassas Park….It appears Fotis’ intent is to use the Sheriiff’s office for his own personal agenda…guns, guns, guns, and more guns. The Sheriff’s office is NOT the appropriate place for you IP I mean Mr. Fotis….
VOTE HILL JUNE 12
Wow, guys….
- Fotis has more education than does Hill
- Fotis has a proven consevative record when Hill does not
- Fotis is a highly decorated (many people say, ‘Hero’) retired officer, Hill does not even say what he was/charactorize his service
- Fotis has been out talking, listening and leading on the immigration issue and Hill with 4 years has yet to even begin to ‘engage’ in this issue
- Fotis VOLUNTEERED TO SERVE in the US Military in a time of war, I haven’t seen hardly anything about Hill’s military service
- Fotis has had the courage to fight for his ideals and beliefs — and the ideals, beliefs and concerns of those whom he has ‘represented’; Hill has utterly failed in this regard
Fotis has been a leader…. what has Hill been?
The Fotis campaign has been about political issues, the Incumbent’s compotence in office and candidate Fotis’ vision for the future that includes having a Sheriff who supports, defends and helps protect the public’s interest in law and order issues (issues that sometimes have life and death consequences — like illegal immigration, self-defense, etc.)
Now, in the 11th hour, as the Second Amendment issue really heats up Hill supporters want to ’spin’ the gun issue as if to suggest its all, only been about this one issue…. simply amazing AND TOTALLY MISLEADING.
Fotis supports the Second Amendment when Hill appently wants to pick and choose which part of it Hill is not going hate/oppose on any given particular day. (Apparently so much for any oath to support and defend the ENTIRE constitution!)
When Sheriff Hill first ran for election he proudly promised… and I AM QUOTING HILL NOW, “I will provide the service and REPRESENTATION that citizens deserve and expect.” (Emphasis added.) {Quoting the very top, first commitments to the public, contained on Sheriff Hill’s campaign website, 2003.}
For weeks now Hill supporters on this site have made much to do that when Fotis for Sheriff talked about how Fotis would ‘represent’ the folks differently than did Hill, that Fotis was overreaching, trying to expand the office/duties of the Office of Sheriff. That because Fotis merely mentioned this concept it proved (somehow in their twisted world) that he was out of touch, not fit for office because he did not “get-it” that voters did not want that kind of ‘representation’.
It seems to me that the more likely ‘real ‘ reason why those who support Hill want to re-write history/avoid the ‘truth’ at all costs, is because Sheriff Hill has failed in this simple promise that he made to voters four long years ago!
Where is Hill’s leadership on illegal aliens…. show me one public act, one public commnent one piece of testimony or political ‘representation’ that Hill has done in any of his FOUR YEARS on this critically important issue!
Same, same for the issue of self-defense and or the Second Amendment…. I dare you to show one actual example when Hill has done something public, something decisively to support the Second Amendment or any Prince William County, law abiding citizen’s Second Amendment/self-defense rights. Just one example.
Heck, when you fail on those specifics, Show me ONE example where Hill — ON ANY ISSUE — has gone to ‘bat’ for those he is supposed to represent? One example where he ‘rocked the boat’, went toe to toe to tell some politician that they were full of crap or to passionately fight for the rights/interests of those who elected him and those to whom he gave his solemn promise to provide ‘representation’ to.
On second thought show me many examples of each…. You would think that after four years in Office, if Hill were going to make good on this promise, the record would be replete with examples…. come on you Hill supporters ’show me’ I’m wrong on this… show me the RECORD, NOT RHETORIC!
On a personal level Hill is a ‘nice-guy’ by all accounts. I suspect that voters might want someone more interested in actually ‘representing’ their law and order interests/concerns than in someone like Hill who appears more concerned about not doing ‘anything’ of substance perhaps due to fear of ‘offending’ politicans or helping to hold them accountable.
Hill broke his promise… it is that simple…
Correction / update / supplemental
My bad, I apologize:
One correction…
There is one other example that after weeks of research I have found where Sheriff Hill has “led boldly” where he has thrown his considerable political weight, the strength of the badge of office for Sheriff of Prince William County out into a ‘hot’ political battleground…. when he appeared, proudly behind his badge of office, endorsing/supporting/mugging for the camera with the Independent candidate for the office of the Clerk of the Court…
The office where the endorsed Republican candidate is harmed by his leadership.
Now I know Hill apologists will say, but when he stood up with her — using his badge of office and the political weight of the Sheriff’s Department endorsement — she was not yet an ‘independent’ candidate. True. But, AFTER she became an announced Independent, Sheriff Hill pledged to withdraw this support and get behind the Republican Candidate for Clerk of the Court…
Another pledge easily made and still not done by Incumbent Sheriff Hill
Hill made that promise among a group of republican/conservative activists and from all that I can see he failed… worse yet, not one word was made public by him in any public forum, no letter to the editor, no update to his website, heck, not even a public ‘counter endorsement’ to announce that he is now supporting the one, only R candidate.
I guess that sometimes leadership (or the lack of it) can be shown by inaction. Inacton alone would not be so bad… except when Sheriff Hill promises something better, something more, and then fails to make it a reality.
Go ahead, check it our your self…. http://lucy4clerk.com/
Then look for where Hill ‘publicly leads’ and makes good on this leadership promise to switch sides and get behind the R candiate (hint you won’t find it): http://www.hillforsheriff.com/
Now, weeks later, go to the R candidate’s site… and look for Hill’s endorsement, look for a photo of Hill with his badge of office standing with the R candidate… once again, Hill MIA on leadership (hint, its not your eyes, you won’t find it here either):
http://www.mcquigg4clerk.com/campaign/endorsements.htm
“I guess that sometimes leadership (or the lack of it) can be shown by inaction”
Glendell has been a puppet sheriff lacking leadership and management skills.
Well IP, I know that Fotis joined the “Help Save Manassas” group…the question is when. Greg would know exactly when and, if Fotis did not join at the very beginning, it is reasonable to assume that he recently joined in order to provide more fodder for your rantings on this blog. That would be the political thing to do. Let’s see how active he gets after he loses the nomination.
Grayson — I’m going to try one more time. I (1:33) brought up bad food in the jail as a JOKE. It was in response to a “thug” comment. So, I drew two conclusions:
1) Food must not be very good in any jail, and
2) Anybody that would throw out that unsubstantiated “thug” comment, in my estimation, may have just sampled some of that food during a stay in said jail.
I’m not going to explain this any more to you. Question: How do you watch a TV show, or movie and follow a story line when your brain will not process information like a normal human being?
Please, stay off this blog unless you’ve taken your meds first.
Jim Fotis and his wife joined at the first opportunity they had. I didn’t even have to ask them. Jim also offered assistance in helping us file as a 501(c)(4) organization and with the other paperwork that needs to get filed. I haven’t taken him up on his offer because I know he is engaged in some other stuff right now.
I would not at all characterize Jim’s signing up with Help Save Manassas as a political ploy. I am convinced he and his wife would have jumped at the opportunity to get involved regardless of whatever else is going on. Jim has also attended every meeting since he joined, was with us this week when we addressed the PWC BOCS, and is absolutely supportive of our mission.
If he was trying to score points, he would have certainly spoken during citizen’s time with us. I would have welcomed that regardless, but he chose to be recognized as one of the members and not try to promote his candidacy through this advocacy to the BOCS. He’s a class act, all the way.
Thank you Greg.
I wonder if this time your weighing in will help stop these pointles ad-hominem attacks and perhaps we can get back to a good old fashioned political debate… talking about records not rhetoric, vision not vitrol.
Nope…. I don’t think Ghandi weighing in would help your cause. Your candidate isn’t suited for Dog Catcher in this county. If he were the Knight in Shining armor as you state, he would have run for office in his home state and wouldn’t have to introduce himself to the community. You and your ilk will go back home on the 13th with tail tucked firmly between your legs! Just make sure you leave us one last posting to remember you by. Bye bye!
I am a proud member of Help Save Manassas and I encourage everyone to join this organization. This group has the GUTS to stand up and be counted in the fight to stop Prince William County from becoming a sanctuary for illegal aliens. We can not afford to stand idly by and watch from the sidelines any longer. I encourage everyone to take a minute and call your Congressman TODAY and ask that they defeat Senate Bill 9, the Secure Borders, Economic Opportunity and Immigration Reform Act of 2007. This bill which is on the fast track in the United States Senate is flawed from top to bottom and is bad for America. Together we can stop it in its tracks and bring some common sense to this critically important debate.
Contact your lawmakers at (202) 224-3121.
Maybe YOU’RE the one who should be running for office, Mrs. Fotis.
Based on a review of the media reports, the Hill website, the Hill campiagn literature, the results of various internet searches and eye witness accounts of various poltical meetings, I can’t find a single example of any record that Sheriff Hill has led/represented those who voted for him on this key issue.
Those facts give rise to this question:
Why has Glendell Hill, with 4 long years in office refused to weigh in and take a leadership role, reprsenting those who voted for him on what is, in my opinion, the hottest law and order issus facing the residents of Prince William County?
**representing**
Darn, in trying to be more brief I forget the line…
On the key issue of illegal criminal aliens….
Greg,
I guess my questions got pushed aside a bit with the back and forth on Fotis and Hill. I just wanted to know if Hill supports 287G. Doesn’t the Sheriffs Dept. process inmates? Wouldn’t they also need to inquire about a person’s legal status? If that is the case it would be nice to know if Hill supports 287G. I got a flier from Fotis yesterday and it looks like he would support it. Thank you.
Patty,
Hill is on the Jail Board the Jail Board approved 287g
Vote Hill June 12
Kim Fotis is posting on the Hill thread about HSM and IP is posting on the HSM thread about Sheriff Hill….there seems to be quite a bit of confusion about how all of this works…do I need to speak slowly again? Oh no I get it these are political strategists at best….please help us all………I see where this Fotis camp is heading and I have a very distinct memory of something very similar that came to a boiling point just about four years ago. Then Hill rescued the citizens of this great community!
VOTE HILL JUNE 12
IP just won’t stop. The 8 percent in the primary that Fotis was going to get has dropped to about 3 percent now that IP has become the campaign mouthpiece.
Wow the Fotis family came out of the closet. Interesting lets really examine this.
so funny !!!!!!
BTW IP, your statement, “…when he appeared, proudly behind his badge of office, endorsing/supporting/mugging for the camera with the Independent candidate for the office of the Clerk of the Court…,” is another example of your spin, and outright prevarication. The picture with Glen on the front page of Lucy’s campaign website was there when the site first went up, long before she announced as an Independent and, if you follow the link to the “Endorsements,” you’ll see that the many endorsements (including Glen’s) that HAD been there when she was running as a Republican have been taken down, and the page is “under construction.” In other words, for those politically challenged, the endorsements have been WITHDRAWN. Obviously, the website has had little update, although it is not uncommon for candidates to post pictures of themselves with prominent people without their permission.
And with regard to your statement, “It seems to me that the more likely ‘real ‘ reason why those who support Hill want to re-write history/avoid the ‘truth’ at all costs, is because Sheriff Hill has failed in this simple promise that he made to voters four long years ago!,” you know NOTHING of our history here and YOU wouldn’t know truth if it slapped you in the face. You have offered nothing but spin, blatant (and proven) lies, half-truths (disinformation), and the most incredibly obnoxious behavior I have ever seen on a blog (well, except for a couple of other commenters who have found themselves banned at one time or another)…but I have still seen no real facts from you to support your opinion of Glen Hill. You, Mr. Interested Observer, are at best a kook and at worst quite insane. Your constant repetitiveness is designed to either create your own version of truth where none exists (repeat the same lies often enough and some people may start to believe them) or to simply make us as crazy as you are. Do your candidate a favor…get a life and go away.
Greg L - you gonna do something about this IP???
AW — Here is what I said… It is plain as day that I made it clear in my post that the timeline that Hill endorsed before the party switch, here is what I said,
“Now I know Hill apologists will say, but when he stood up with her — using his badge of office and the political weight of the Sheriff’s Department endorsement — she was not yet an ‘independent’ candidate. True. But, AFTER she became an announced Independent, Sheriff Hill pledged to withdraw this support and get behind the Republican Candidate for Clerk of the Court…
Another pledge easily made and still not done by Incumbent Sheriff Hill
Hill made that promise among a group of republican/conservative activists and from all that I can see he failed… worse yet, not one word was made public by him in any public forum, no letter to the editor, no update to his website, heck, not even a public ‘counter endorsement’ to announce that he is now supporting the one, only R candidate.”
As you can see, in my post I said it was true that the endorsement happened before the switch. What you chose to skip over was that after the party switch, Sheriff Hill pledeged (promised, comitted) whatever word you want, to make it right, to withdraw his support and get behind the R candidate. As I write this Hill still has not made good on that promise!
That was yet another Sheriff Hill pledge/promise, made in the heat of an upcoming election where Hill failed to follow through…. I would say, another irrefutable example where Sheriff Hill lied.
I defy you to point out to ANY public act wherein you can show that Hill lifted a finger to make good on this promise…
Hill could have made it public on his campaign site and he did NOT
Hill could have gotten the message out in the media and he did NOT
Hill could have endorsed the R at a public function and he did NOT
Hill could have made this a part of his speech at the Republican convention and he did NOT
etc. etc.
And one other point AW, just because the Independent candidate took down her endorsement page does not automatically equal the endorsement being ‘withdrawn.’ It means that page is down.. that is all that can be inferred from that fact.
If Hill had only publicly announced that he withdrew that endorsement then he would have at least have some defense. Hill chose to not even do that… despite his promise to the contrary.
I did not make Sheriff Hill make this pledge, Fotis for Sheriff did not prevent him from following through on it, I am only reporting the FACTS of what I believe is one more in a series of ‘provable’ examples where Sheriff Hill makes commitments and then fails to honor them…. Commintments/pledges that seem to be associated with trying to win votes in a campaign.
I think this is the kind of record of which the voters should be aware BEFORE they vote on Tuesday!
OK, and…? Your lack of reading comprehension is only is exceeded by your lack of charm. As I said…the endorsements were withdrawn, as indicated on Lucy’s site. Talk about revisionary history…you are “revisionary” by your very nature IP. Like I said…get a life.
I love (NOT!) the way you skew everything to your own mindset IP. Get your training during the Cold War at the Soviet Embassy from the “Cultual Attaches?” That would explain a lot.
Conservative/Republican Primary Voters:
Before you vote for Hill for a second term, please consider the fact that although Sheriff Hill is not reluctant to support political candidates from his position of Sheriff of Prince William County
(to use the badge of office or his bully-pulpit to politic), the public record seems to clearly show that Sheriff Hill did not do anything of substance to support Senator Allen when he was battling for re-election againste Webb.
I have exhaustively examined all the records I can get my hands on, I have asked Hill supporters to augment my research and invited them to provide contrary data… none has.
I believe it can be fairly asserted that Sheriff Hill did not do anything of consequence to help Senator Allen. Republican/Conservative voters should bear this in mind. The new Senator Webb seems to be on a path to vote against the side of law-and-order advocates (most of us?) on what is possibly the most important law-and-order issue to Prince William County residents, the issue of criminal illegal aliens.
I believe, but can not prove, that had Sheriff Hill worked hard to support the republican/conservative candidate in that race Allen might have won! Had Allen won, I belive we would all be better off — our communities safer.
Sheriff Hill failed to seize this opportunity, failed to lead. Sheriff Hill in 2003 pledged to represent us — this is an example where he failed to and the price we will have to pay may be very steep!
AW -
Does that mean you too did not see Sheriff Hill do anything to make good on his promise to withdraw support from the Independent and publicly come out on behalf of the R?
FYI: My part of the cold war was spent supporting a guy named Reagan and in service to my county (just like my dad before me) fighting against the Bear!
Would you please stop attacking me and address the political issues/the candidate’s record?
Please?
Greg, I echo Henry’s plea…PLEASE do something about this total expletive deleted!
IP — We’re all tired of this purist crap!!
Glen Hill IS supporting a Republican candidate for Clerk of the Court — Lucy Beauchamp. Her Republican credentials have been unquestioned for years. She would be running still as a Republican, but she was not the chosen candidate of the crooked Kopko/Gill club, so as they did to Julie Lucas, they changed the rules to “fix” the nomination for their hand-picked choice, McQuigg.
You see, that was the payoff. Fix the rules to make Michelle McQuigg the nominee, and in exchange she would participate in the “fix” to get Gill the nomination in the 51st.
Glen Hill and Lucy Beauchamp just want to serve the citizens honorably and build the Republican Party, not blow it to pieces. Neither of them care to participate in the deceit and lies that has become so commonplace among the PWCRC leadership.
Glen Hill is a man of honor, integrity, and he is loyal (yes loyal to the local GOP as well…just not it’s current leadership). If we drive him out too with this crazy, crooked insanity that passes for local party business, then we as Republicans will have nothing left but a pile of rubble and lots of Dems running Prince William County again.
Fed Up - I’m not trying to say anything about the two individual candidates, or their respective qualifications. My point was about Sheriff Hill and his failure to act to fulfill his promise.
Glen Hill HAS fulfilled his promises. I can recite by heart every campaign piece he put out in 2003 (I produced it) and I can tell you he’s kept his promises and then some. In fixing the mess left behind by Messier/Stoffregan, he has gone far beyond what anyone thought was possible in just less than 1 term.
To you people who are talking about change…Hill IS the change. The citizens of Prince William need him for another term to help clean up the county. I thank God he’s running (and will successfully) for re-election.
More so than anyone in alot of years, Glen Hill has restored my faith in the political system. We CAN have good government in Prince William if we just had more officeholders like Glen Hill.
For those who have not seen the more recent post outing Interested Party, he is now posting as Not Again…and his REAL name is Ted Deeds, whose boss over at the LEAA is none other than Fotis. He’s busted!
A few comments from experience………….
I worked for the P.W.C. Police for several years. During my employment I observed several head scratching decisions by Charlie Deane. He has become such an abstract decision maker based on power plays within the county, it has lead to the majority of department members to refer to the Chief’s Office as “the puzzle palace.” So how does this impact the Sheriff’s Office?
When our previous Sheriff was increasing the involvement of his street deputies in routine traffic enforcement, county park security checks, and back-up for county police officers, Charlie Deane became angry. Instead of embracing these efforts as help for a police department which struggled just to keep up with calls for service, the Chief publicly addressed the Sheriff’s Office efforts as, “duplication of services.” But within the department he was directing police supervisors to make sure they “protected police turf” by keeping deputies away from police calls and county parks. As a police supervisor for Charlie Deane I only wanted more patrol officers to keep from drowning from the demand for police response(s). I welcomed the involvement of the Sheriff’s Office.
Many do not know that it was Charlie Deane who encouraged Glen Hill to run for Sheriff during the last election. It was a classic power play move on Deane’s part to rid the county of a law enforcement official who refused to answer to him.
I like Glen Hill. I found him to be very helpful while conducting investigations involving the county jail. But I never thought he would be an effective elected offical. To point to how much Charlie Deane influences policy over Glen Hill, you only need to count the number of staff members appointed to the Sheriff’s Office coming directly from Charlie Deane’s staff.
Collectively, their first order of business after the election, was to have radar units collected from deputies, and memorandums issued which ended the involvement of increased enforcement and protection. This doesn’t sound like progress to me. The only achievement this action created was to give the Chief of Police the absolute power he craved.
I have worked with Mike Messier. I find him to be a very fair and smart person when dealing with internal issues. His past decisions inside the Sheriff’s Office as the Chief Deputy have shown he posesses the common sense necessary to deal with other agencies at both local and state levels. Under his direction deputies had few complaints, and all the deputies I know who are currently in the Sheriff’s Office support him.
I would love to see our current Sheriff debate Mike Messier. It would leave voters with no doubt making him Sheriff would improve law enforcement in Prince William. The influence that Charlie Deane has on the Sheriff’s Office has to be broken. I have heard Charlie Deane say, “I make decisions based on the potential headlines they create.” Based on the current morale and retention problems he has this statement does not include right & wrong and a sense of fair play. The staff of the Sheriff’s Office has had too much exposure to “fire first, ask questions later” mentality of our current Chief.
For Glen Hill’s lack of proactive measures on the street, and keeping a troubled Police Chief happy, he should expect to lose his current position. Prince William needs deputies helping an understaffed and inexperienced police presence on the street. This will never be achieved with our current Police Chief or Sheriff.
Disclosure: I do not currently hold a law enforcement position, nor desire it.
Good Time Charlie
A few comments from experience……
I would like to compare the retention rates of the PWCPD compared to neighboring law enforcement agencies. When I speak to officers who are retired or close to leaving the department, the information I receive is that morale is so bad that trainees are leaving the department immediately upon academy graduation due to the stories they are hearing from sworn officers regarding the Charlie Deane administration. I think there is a story behind the length of stay for new hires. I witnessed so many morale issues while wearing a badge for Charlie Deane I am surprised his officers would want to risk being fired by getting out of their police vehicle to initiate contact through proactive police work.
There is other data I think would expose how effective Charlie Deane is as a leader. Arrests numbers through self-initiated contact. When he became C.O.P. the PWCPD was a great place to work, and few sworn members turned in their badge. Street officers used to pride themselves in finding criminals in the act of committing crimes. Slowly I watched Deane change the street mentality of enforcement measures. He immediately changed the direction of internal issues by having the Internal investigations Unit report directly to him instead of being independent from administration influence. More power and influence was achieved by this move. He could now direct and influence the outcome of any investigation. Over time, several great public servants have had investigations work against them for what appears to be a simple lack of regard Deane had for them. But it appears his personal campaigns against his officers has caught up to him. After observing several “good cops” get insanely disciplined for acts which should have produced positive recognition or valor awards (Andrew Cornell fighting for his life while immigrants attacked), it appears street officers have gone into employment survival mode by staying in their cars.
My understanding of this incident from reliable sources was that his first back-up remained with his police car waiting for additional help while Cornell was getting beaten by numerous hispanic subjects. The unwillingness of the initial back-up to get involved was a major factor in the need to use deadly force. While defending himself during the investigation, Cornell demanded that charges of cowardice be placed against the back-up officer. But investigators refused, deciding instead to place procedural charges against Cornell. The fall out from this incident. Andrew Cornell who was an outstanding cop, became disgusted with the manner this was handled and quit. Another head scatching incident brought to you from the desk of Charlie Deane.
But many cases of “Good Time Charlie” investigating off duty personal and/or marital issues have left several officers looking for another department or another line or work (both voluntarily or by firing). When I worked for Deane the department’s citizen/officer ratio was well below both recommended F.O.P. staffing levels and ratios of surrounding jurisdictions. I bet those ratios haven’t changed much.
While at a briefing, I witnessed Deane engaged in a topic involving police retention. I heard Deane remark, “police officers no longer have loyalty.” I immediately realized that someone needed to clue this man into the actual problem………….loyalty is a two way street. When your reputation as a leader suggests that you are finding ways to fire your officers for minor incidents on or off-duty, department members will desert you for no other reason but self preservation. But the great looking women and “yes” men he has surrounded himself with would not risk their career by informing him that he might be the problem.
But things look great from the outside. I’m sure he will get support from the PWCPD Police association. And why not? He has promoted almost all association presidents for their cooperation and support of his internal policies. Another smart power play. The truth surrounding the leadership of the association (which I was a member) is that if you stay out of the way, vote on the Chief’s personnel decisions he presents to you, and not worry about representing department members, you will be rewarded. A message to all promotion oriented newer officers. If you want those sergeant strips, get on the sergeant’s list and become an elected position with the police association and just do as Deane tells you.
I could continue to expose “the puzzle palace” with numerous incidents involving this man. But the citizens of PWC need to embrace this thought. Charlie Deane is a very powerful man. He sits on the jail board, has undue influence in the Sheriff’s Office with the election of Glen Hill, and doesn’t forget those who question policy within his police department. If you feel safer in PWC than you did 20 years ago, then Deane is your man. But I drive the streets of the county frequently and only see a police car when it is rushing to a call. My opinion based on inside observations, as long as Deane remains the C.O.P. you need additional law enforcement. That will not happen with Glen Hill. I suggest if a candidate for Sheriff presents you with a platform that includes additional street presence and enforcement, you should consider it a vote for your safety. Don’t fall for the “duplication of services” garbage that Deane will feed you when he supports Hill in the upcoming election. His support is simple……..he is “protecting his turf.”
This election is not a referendum on Chief Deane. I might add that while Deane was certainly a solid supporter of Glen Hill, he was not a key player at all in getting Glen to run or in any decision made during the campaign. There were, however, many dedicated volunteers who happened to be Manassas City and Prince William County Police Officers mainly because of the “duplication” of enforcement issue.
I might also add that the voters do care about public safety, and in 2003 they had enough. The key issue WAS the turf battles that Messier/Stoffregan created. The voters demanded that to stop and that the Sheriff’s Dept return to concentrating on the sworn duties that the Department was designed to do….not those duties that look good on a press release.
Oh yea…then there was the “little” matter of selling badges for campaign cash that Messier stood by and witnessed (or participated in?) for years, but that came to the public’s attention primarily after the election.
I was also there with Glen from the beginning and I echo what the previous commenter said (you’ve got to find a shorter pseudonym), however, that does not preclude the validity of the information about Chief Deane that Anonymous is putting forward. He has been attracting some public attention himself lately with his lack of support for the ICE training and control of the illegal alien problem, as well as this ridiculous policy granting criminal illegal aliens greater rights than the citizenry (they can check a citizen out, up one side and down the other, but can’t check out possible illegals??). “Sanctuary” my glutious maximus!
Anyway, back to the subject: Any problems here with assistance from the Sheriff’s Department in supplementing enforcement fall squarely on the shoulders of Chief Deane, and not Glen Hill. The official policy for the Sheriff in this county is that he is to provide deputies only at the request of the head of the local law enforcement agency (City or County Police). This is precisely to prevent redundancy; however, if there are needs in the County Police Department, it should be incumbent upon the Chief to request that assistance. Glen is doing exactly what he should be…to do otherwise (as Stoffregen did) would create chaos, and did (I witnessed quite a few examples of that during the last Sheriff’s race, with Deputies and County Police competing with each other).
I would not be at all surprised to hear that Deane should be replaced…actually, I’ve heard it from more than one person. You need to address this to the County Board of Supervisors, and an election year is a really good time to do it, but don’t lay this at the feet of Glen Hill…it doesn’t belong there.
AW said, “Any problems here with assistance from the Sheriff’s Department in supplementing enforcement fall squarely on the shoulders of Chief Deane, and not Glen Hill.” and AW also said, “You need to address this to the County Board of Supervisors, and an election year is a really good time to do it”
From all that I have seen there are some areas where Sheriff Hill could have decided to lead on — and represent the people’s concerns on — law and order issues (such as criminal illegal aliens) and Sheriff Hill has decided to hide rather than lead!
Other Hill supporters have suggested that Hill needs to be given a second term in office - that he needs more time to begin to learn to lead - to begin to address some of these ‘other’ concerns. The problem with that is this: It 2003 then candidate Hill pledged to represent the people if he were entrusted with the job of Sheriff.
Four years later there are NO examples of — and I’ve done pretty exhaustive research, and even asked Hill supporters unsuccessfully to provide single example of — NOT ONE example they of Hill leading/representing the people’s concerns on any particular law and order issue.
This includes Sheriff Hill being completelyh MIA on the criminal illegal alien issues(s).
As the elected representative on law and order issues, as the CLEO (Chief Law Enforcement Officer)combined with his 2003 campaing pledge, by now Sheriff Hill should have done something/have some record of leading on law and order isues (like criminal illegal aliens) and representing the people’s concerns, even if that meant putting a little good ole political pressure on the Chief to help ‘encourage him’ to do what needed doing to protect the people and make them safe!
For people who want more from their elected law and order leader (Sheriff) I would commend to their attention: James J Fotis for sheriff.
www.fotisforsheriff.com
- Unlike Hill, Fotis has the support of virtually all of the Second Amendment community; Hill is anti-gun
- Fotis is already engaged on the criminal illegal alien front ; and,
- James J. Fotis as Sheriff is willing to ‘lead’ in political oriented battles that have a direct impact on YOUR SAFETY!
Not Again, AKA Interested Party, AKA Ted Deeds, nobody believes a word you spew…haven’t you noticed that? People have already started following those links to the investigative articles kindly provided by your former LEAA members who were tired of being sucked dry by you and Fotis. Is that what you have in mind for the Sheriff’s Department here in Prince William? Or were you attracted to all that side money Stoffregen made while he was Sheriff? Whatever the case, the lack of administrative expertise of you and your boss Fotis really is not needed here.
Ted,
Please state for the record where you have read or heard that Hill is anti-gun or is this just another delusional vision that you have had?
And for the record please state what you know about Hill’s involvement as a Jail Board member, with the approval of the 287g for the Adult Detention Center ?
Please state for the record what you mean by political oriented battles that will have a direct impact on the citizens safety?
Please stop talking in circles and say what you have to say which so far has not been much at all.
Did you have a nice day at work, (LEAA) yesterday? Jim Fotis sign your paycheck yesterday?
You are unbelievable to think for one second that the citizens of Prince William, Manassas and Manassas Park are that ignorant to you, Fotis and the lies that have been told on Sheriff Hill. Please don’t under estimate the citizens here….they may be that way in Fairfax where you live not here by a stretch!!!!!
VOTE HILL JUNE 12
“Or were you attracted to all that side money Stoffregen made while he was Sheriff?” You know this is a VERY VERY real possibility. We have seen how they have both benefitted very nicely from the membership of LEAA. Fotis #1, Mr. and Mrs. Deeds as #2 and #3.
This is a repost from Mike Messier’s site. I want to make sure that I am heard from each candidate’s form:
Greg L,
I have no issues with Glen Hill except for his relationship with Charlie Deane. Like I mentioned before. I like Glen personally. Professionally…….I believe his intentions are to support the citizens of PWC to the best of his abilities. But the facts surrounding deputies and the use of radar enforcement have been misrepresented. All of the deputies who conducted radar enforcement received the same state mandated training from regional academies as PWC police officers. There was no duplication of radar enforcement because deputies were submitting their enforcement plans and results to the PWCPD Special Operation Commander. This was a solution presented by Mike Messier to avoid any potential duplication issues.
There was more coordination between the Sheriff’s Office and the Police Department than within the police Department itself.
When I was employed with the PWCPD there was NO coordination between Special Operations or the Patrol Division for radar enforcement locations. Each division conducted radar enforcement independent of each other. This problem could have been easily resolved by putting enforcement dates and locations on the patrol roll call board. But the Chief’s Office received complaints from citizens regarding officers speeding while on-duty. The C.O.P. decided not to inform patrol officers where the radar stations were established because he wanted them to get caught and the incidents reported to him. One specific incident I remember was radar enforcement on officer traffic in and out of the police academy. In my opinion, the only duplication of services came from with the same department (apparently due to “iron hand” Deane’s internal enforcement).
Giving Glen Hill credit for bringing the Sheriff’s Office and the Police Department together on the same radio channels is misleading. For years Charlie Deane was tasked with fixing a grossly outdated emergency communications system. It wasn’t until Deane faced losing coordination of the program from the BOCS for delaying the project that something was done. A police lieutenant named Scott Dillon was appointed as the head of a radio committee and worked directly with Mike Messier to establish the needs of the Sheriff’s Office within the replacement system.
I don’t want to mislead the public so correct me if the facts told to me by street deputies are incorrect. When Glen Hill came to the Sheriff’s Office, street deputies were ordered to turn in the uniform traffic summons books that were issued to them. The effect of this action was for traffic violators to once again speed past on-duty deputies and commit red light violations with deputies helpless to enforce the observed violation. If this is true, as a citizen of Prince William County, I would be looking to elect another candidate.
My issues with Charlie Deane would not be tied to this election if I knew deputies were at least enforcing observed violations. It is a complete waste of existing assets to have civil process deputies without enforcement authority. They are able to completely enforce state criminal & traffic laws by state constitution. A policy to give street deputies the authority to use their enforcement authority while on-duty would at least show that Glen Hill isn’t controlled by Deane’s vision of the Sheriff’s role in county law enforcement.
I am not advocating the Sheriff compete with the police department. The Memorandum of Understanding (M.O.U.)regarding primary enforcement duties agreed to by the C.O.P. and Sheriff establishes an outline of duties of the two agencies, and it was agreed to by the BOCS. But it does not revoke enforcement authority of deputies. The BOCS does not have the authority to rewrite the state constitution. I am pleading for whoever wins the election to put radar enforcement cabability back into the hands of the Sheriff’s Office.
Before Glen Hill came to office, deputies were stopping and arresting wanted people, suspended drivers, finding drugs in vehicles, and causing drivers to slow down in the presence of deputies. All at no cost to taxpayers. The equipent was obtained by grant money from the state, as well as obtaining money for enforcement details. What a waste not to utilize such an enforcement asset.
I know if Mike Messier were elected, the Sheriff’s Office would begin enforcement of observed violations. I am not that familiar with Fortis but would support him as well if enforcement were part of his platform. I would support Hill if he broke off his current relationship with Charlie Deane and put enforcement back into the hands of deputies. But that cannot not occur until the current M.O.U. expires. And under Glen Hill there have been no guarantees that he will change it.
Good Time Charlie
Some of what you say may be credible, but the blurring of the lines as far as enforcement practices go was started and brought to a boil in the Messier/Stoffregan years. You are absolutely fooling yourself if you think Messier will do anything as Sheriff other than to bring us back the Stoffregan mess that the voters resoundingly rejected in 2003.
As far as the current campain, this is Police Department insider ball that really has no bearing on what the voters care about in the Primary election for Sheriff. Before Hill, the average citizen just saw Law enforcement departments not cooperaing with one another, a duplication of services, and turf battles.
blah blah blah…
Interesting facts to bring out, Good Time Charlie, why in the
name of God would anybody object to having additional
law enforcement out there? Makes no sense to me, but
“Never argue with an idiot; they’ll just bring you down and
beat you with experience” (anonymous)
Given the comparative intellectual quality of the comments here, NR, I’d be careful who I call “an idiot” if I were you.
AWCheney, you know that NR has been scratching his head every since you posted. He is still trying to understand what comparative intellectual quality is. Vote4hill has stated in the past that you must speak slowly and use basic english for this crowd. NR said he didn’t understand why no one would want more law enforcement. He obviously wasn’t around for the truf battles Lars was referring to. Let me explain it to you NR. When you have an egocentric Sheriff who over steps his bounds and begins to encroach onto police functions that are not typically handled by your department, you have wasted man power. It was all about power instead of productivity. The same power that Fotis so desperatly wants.
Pundit and Cheney, you are too funny for words!