Just as one door opens another closes…Help Save Manassas is opening the door for us LEGAL citizens to SLAM SHUT those who are not~

redawn said on 23 Jun 2007 at 8:00 pm:
BETTER YET….UNCLE SLAM….INSTEAD OD OPERATION SLAM~

Those were my comments on another thread ” SECRET SANCTUARY POLICY UPDATE”
Layfayette,
It leads me to beleive that (AI’s) attack on you was NOT for our cause ( MY OPINION) otherwise, he / she would have attacked me first.

We, being life long residents and PROUD to call you my friend ,have seen 1st hand the historical changes in our community.

Did WE attack other comments on different threads about how the area has been know(opinions) for white trash, rednecks, hicks, etc…..????????????? NO, beacuse we know that our community HAS ALWAYS BEEN THE UNDER DOG and that is how other’s view our community , sad, but true.

We started the stir-up , on THIS website about STORM DOORS, people, life long or new to the area AND not in our area ARE and HAVE been talking about it AND CONFIRMED IT.
Looking @ the “good” in something “bad”…..EYES AND EARS ARE OPEN….”LET’S GIVE THEM SOMETHING TO TALK ABOUT”
hmmmm, would it be a redneck statement to say” GET R DONE”?

Entering the country illegally the first time is a misdemeanor.

Forging false documenation for ID (pretty much required if one is going to operate in this country as an illegal alien) is typically a felony.

A statement borne of total ignorance of economics, by illegal alien apologists.

People use that excuse(economy) because they can’t just come out and say they support law breakers, so they attempt to distort the debate and scare people into believing without illegals are Nation just would not survive.

Anon 1740: I did not equate entering without authorization and traffic violations (including DUI). these are obviously very different sorts of misdemeanors or violations. I said that if one classifies all unauthorized entries as being perpetrated by “criminals” in order to establish the crime rate among illegal immigrants is high, then one has to compare this to all misdemeanor/felony violations that are at large in the population as a whole. This sweeps in everyone who has ever driven over 0.8 (or whatever the limit is these days), anyone who has cut corners on a tax return, etc. By that standard, the “criminal” population among us is very high indeed, perhaps universal. But I think the better measure is to try to pin down the violent crime rate among immigrants to determine whether their presence in our midst is causing a threat to health and safety that would not exist in their absence.

OK. Come to think of it President Bush did the same.

My post indicating that the 287g program is complex… is the totality of it all to include the training. And by the way you may want to double check on the fact that every one that receives an ICE detainer is deported that is not the case as I understand it. As a matter of fact they go to Federal Court and it is there determined whether or not they are actually deported…alot won’t be and alot will be only to return to the US in a very short amount of time…imagine the statistics on that one…How many illegals return to the US after being deported????

You mentioned you work with a number of legal immigrants. Maybe I took it the wrong way, but in many cases I see of people defending illegal immigration is they have a vested interest, i.e., they make a living that is connected to legal immigration.

Well, of course every illegal immigrant is a criminal. The difference between them and us, though is that while we may get caught speeding, we pay the fine, but that does not mean we are are free to speed anytime after that and not have to worry about getting caught again. Illegals will continue to benefit from breaking the law, which is to say they will be able to stay in the Country.

If we do not have security, we can forget about our economy.

Re Patty’s Muhammed/Malvo question: Killing people in cold blood is a fairly serious criminal offense in every localities that I’m aware of. I have no problem with local police going after it. Not sure why you would think otherwise. That’s what the local police are there for. When it crosses state lines (as was clearly happening during the sniper murders), I have no problem with the feds pitching in.

re those who say the crime rate is high or even 100% among the illegal immigrant population because they came here illegally, if that’s how you define crime, you can’t lose that argument. But those folks are “criminals” the same way any of you who has driven while intoxicated (even a tiny bit) or gone significantly over the speed limit are criminals (I know, you didn’t get caught, but they didn’t either). I suspect that, by your definition, the crime rate generally is close to 100%.

I thought the discussion here was whether the incidence of violent crime, the kind of crime that preys on and threatens the lives, safety and peace of the community, is higher among the illegal immigrant community. Maureen asked me if I was aware of data on this, specifically DUI data. Good question. I told her I didn’t know anything about DUIs in particular, but that the data I’ve looked at show that the crime rate in immigrant communities nationwide is lower than in the general population. That’s all. I don’t believe this shows any greater pre-disposition to moral rectitude than the rest of the population, but instead probably reflects the idea that if you’re someplace you have no legal right to be, you keep your head down. Just assume the situation was reversed and the US economy was totally down the toilet, Honduras was booming, and a lot of us decided we had no choice but to brave the Sonoran desert and the jungles of the Yucatan to get to some menial jobs in Tegucigalpa. I suspect we would be fairly careful about how we conducted ourselves once there. (BTW, if any of you ever find yourselves in that situation, and take those risks for the sake of the survival of yourselves or your families, I will be the first to say that you violated some laws to get to Honduras. I might also say you are causing significant social problems, making the locals nervous as hell and threatening traditional Honduran ways of going about things. But I would never call you a “criminal.” I hope you would extend me the same consideration. Let’s hope we are never in that situation.)

I always like a good policy discussion and thought it might help to inject a little different perspective here. But I’m getting the feeling that it’s more fun at this party without me so I’ll confine my comments in the future to other subjects. Greg does a great job with this site and has taken on many issues that are well worth addressing. This is one of them. But it’s not as easy as just telling us how angry you get everytime you see “illegals” (still don’t know how you spot them on sight) or how radically your neighborhood is changing. Data are as important as anecdotes. Many of you have legitimate concerns. I share some of them. My pitch would be to think through thoroughly some of the policy ramifications, both for the local community (e.g., police functions) and for the Nation (e.g., economic and security interests). I’ll take my finger out of the socket now.

What a crock of slaw! How about this: THe crime rate among illegal ALIENS is 100%. Every single one of them committed a crime to get here, and is part of an on-going conspiracy to a crime, as long as they remain here. Furthermore, no one really knows how many are in this country. The most realistic estimates put it somehwere aroung 20 million. However, if the Fed can’t even agree on the number, or is intentionally low-balling it, how can you quote statistics? Garbage in…garbage out

As far as all of Nova Scout’s argument regarding local police enforcing immigration law, because it will drive up taxes, come on. Give me a break. Illegals are driving up taxes by over-populating our schools. Illegals are driving up the cost of health care, since they aren’t paying for the care they get in the hospitals, and the hospitals charge those of us who can pay, more to cover the difference. Children of Illegals, who are the product of a crime, are driving up the cost of all public assistance programs.

We are already getting socked. Our property values are crashing, and this is especially true when the Illegals move into a neigborhood. Trash on the streets, overcrowded homes.

You and mom need to wake the hell up, NoVa Scout, and quit waiting for the Fed to bail you out. If you do, you’ll end up like those poor saps in New Orleans. Citizens must take action, demand change, and hold their electeds accountable. Groups like HSM can focus citizen efforts to pressure those who make the laws, to enforce them.

I still hold to my previous point. I suppose Charles Moose and the Montgomery County police should have sat back and let the FBI find John Allen Mohammed and Lee Malvo.

All governments local, state and federal have the basic responsiblity to protect its citizens. You must of skipped government class in high school.

Well, the truth comes out… You have a vested interest in seeing illegals gain Citizenship.

Keep making excuses. If someone(kids excluded of course) does not pay State income tax, they are getting services they should not receive. Do you really think the cost of a driver license really covers the entire funding of the DMV? Of course not, that is why I said illegals are getting another tax supported
benefit.

I guess you have not paid attention to the real ID act that was passed by Congress. It was put into place after the September 11 terrorist attacks.

Besides just having a license does not do a thing to prevent any type of crime other then driving without a license. All it does is give illegals another incentative to stay here.