"We have lost our ambition, our imagination, and our willingness to do the things that built the Golden Gate Bridge" - Barack Obama (aka President Malaise)
A New Jail For Illegal Aliens
By Greg L | 26 September 2007 | Illegal Aliens, Virginia Politics | 120 Comments
The Virginia Crime Commission is apparently considering building a detention center specifically to house illegal aliens awaiting deportation, which predictably has the illegal alien lobby up in arms, and a lot of the electorate sort of scratching their heads. It’s pretty clear that there’s not enough prison space in Virginia, but the rationale for a detention center for illegal aliens hasn’t been adequately explained.
First, the uninformed rantings of the illegal alien lobby:
Mukit Hossain, a founder of Project Hope and Harmony, a nonprofit group that established a day-laborer hiring center in Herndon that recently closed, called the detention center a “very, very scary proposal.”
“If they need more detention centers, then by all means build more detention centers. But to categorically set aside something which is going to be a detention center for ICE and immigrants, it opens up a very problematic notion, including possibilities of human rights violations. And it will create fear in all immigrant communities,” Hossain said.
And now for the real story here.
Our prison system is designed to rehabilitate inmates to the extent that’s possible by providing educational, recreational and vocational opportunities. The rationale behind this is that if you can open the door to something other than a life of crime, the recidivism rate among released convicts would be lower. Whether that’s the case or not, that effort is a commitment that Virginia has made, and it’s invested substantial resources to carry through on this commitment. As a result, it’s not that cheap to house inmates. Hopefully that investment is paying off.
With inmates facing deportation, the rationale for rehabilitative services just isn’t there. Although an illegal alien could re-enter the country after being deported, the intent is to remove someone from the United States and as much as possible prevent their re-entry into the country. A facility narrowly tailored to holding those awaiting deportation doesn’t need the additional infrastructure needed for rehabilitation efforts, doesn’t require the staff that performs rehabilitation services, and as a result the per-inmate costs of operation are significantly lower than they would be for a prison that is required to provide these services.
Through a few programs such as the State Criminal Alien Assistance Program, the federal government reimburses localities for the costs of holding illegal aliens by paying a per-diem subsidy per inmate held. For those inmates held in the standard prison system, this per diem often results in a small loss. With a less expensive to operate detention center solely for illegal aliens awaiting deportation, this can actually be a money-maker for the state. Willacy County, Texas does this now under the Federal Secure Border Initiative, and the Stewart Detention Center in Stewart County, Georgia is a private for-profit prison run by the Corrections Corporation of America, so the business model here is pretty mature and proven. Mecklenberg County, which was an early adopter of the Section 287(g) Program, has plans for a 1,500 bed facility in Charlotte, North Carolina to take advantage of this as well.
While this is an unusual, and welcome change for Senator Ken Stolle to start talking about effective approaches to deal with the problem of illegal aliens in Virginia, this probably has more to do with creating a revenue source for the state than actually doing anything that would help fill this proposed facility with illegal aliens awaiting deportation. I’d never considered trying to sell the idea of cracking down on illegal aliens as a financially rewarding activity for the state, but to the extent a case can be made for this, if it gets folks like Stolle on board perhaps we’re going to have to start crafting this kind of value proposition for our recalcitrant Republican State Senators. They do seem to like additional revenues.
You can’t recoup the costs of building a facility like this unless you can fill it to about 80% of capacity, anyways. If they can get Fairfax County to actually process for deportation the 4,500 illegal aliens it’s currently housing, that wouldn’t be very difficult. All it would take is that Gerry Connolly get off his butt and enroll Fairfax County in the Section 287(g) Program which would allow a good portion of these folks to be deported rather than released back into our communities. SCAAP funds are only available for illegal aliens that are awaiting deportation, so if we’re going to ensure that we can fill this facility, we better start actually working on some deportations.
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Excellent reasoning. By the same logic, there’s no incentive to provide the inmates with adaquate nutrition or even roofs since they’re technically not our responsibility at all.
Greg,
Your points about the purpose of our state correctional facilites are well-taken and I agree 100%. However, regardless of the rationale, if the facility gets constructed and it houses illegals who eventually get deported, I am for it. If Stolle wants to run it as a profit-center for the state, I couldn’t care less. I support the goal of removing as many illegals from our state as possible.
When are the illegal alien apologists going to get it? Can’t they read the writing on the wall? Little by little local, state and even the fed to some degree are getting in-line with what 80% of Americans want: Secure Borders and Immigration laws enforced, and a sensible legal immigration policy.
I would rather put the illegal aliens in that facility to await deportation than to release them back into the public hoping they will show up for their court appearance on good faith!
Virginia has a burgeoning prison industry, I am very sure this also factored heavily into the decision.
I, too, am in agreement that this a great suggestion. An inmate awaiting deportation will most likely not get involved in actively pursuing rehabilitational needs said jail may provide, so (in my humble and admittedly largely ignorant opinion) the additional money there is wasted anyhow.
I will, however, ask this question: If the Deportation Detention Centers are approved, built and opened do you all think that police or perhaps jail officials will become more apt to profile prisoners, ask more questions for more reasons than what they reasonably should or go further in order to find if someone is illegal so that they can be sent to this other jail, if not so much for deportation as for profit? (holy run-on sentence)
**Note that I am an occassional poster here who wants illegal aliens gone, at the same time I’d like to make sure its done in as much a responsible manner as possible**
What do you mean “ask more questions?” There is only one question to ask…”are you here illegally?”
Great idea and hope it’s built soon. Off topic somewhat, Big Red Liquor Stores will no longer accept Virginia Driver Licenses because to many are believed to be forged by illegals. This story just cameout and is all over the internet.
Lock up all illegals now!
I think a 1,000 bed facility is a GREAT idea.
The Patriot brings up a very good point..
The Patriot said on 26 Sep 2007 at 1:26 pm:
I would rather put the illegal aliens in that facility to await deportation than to release them back into the public hoping they will show up for their court appearance on good faith!
These illegals must be held in a detention center. The are criminals afterall, why would trust they will show up to court?
I’ve suggested it several other times. How about a “tent city” for holding the illegals at the Armory and The Fair Grounds in Manassas.
Illegal aliens must be held while awaiting deportation plain and simple!! We must remember this is about the RULE OF LAW!!
LEGAL AND ILLEGAL!!!
Let’s get it built, ASAP. I don’t mind a tent city like Sheriff Joe Arpaio has in Arizona for additional overflow.
Deportation doesn’t have to be a laborious process. Charter a plane and return them to their home. No need to make such a big deal out of it.
Sounds like something Hitler would’ve constructed.
I don’t think the tent city will do any good, how would you keep them there. They already know how to scale a fence.
NO it doesn’t,Hitler was an exterminator trying to wipe out a RACE, not enforce the LAW.
The State sold a perfectly adaptable facility in Surrey County a couple of years ago. Asking price was less than what my townhouse is appraised at. I should have bought it and leased it back for this purpose. Darn. Another woulda coulda shoulda.
reallyfedup
We keep them in there with Correctional Officers and/or The National Guard. I’m sure there are quite a few that have served, and currently serving that would love to work at the tent facility.
It’s called the Rule of Law. To enter our great nation illegally is BREAKING THE LAW!! LEGAL AND ILLEGAL, that’s it.
I’m reallyfedup2, fed up with illegal aliens breaking our laws.
Anonymous 3:03pm was me LAFAYETTE!
Hit the space bar accidentally.
Advocator,
Here’s another possible option…
What’s the status of the “new jail” built in Fairfax County, is it still sitting empty? I remember seeing news reports on this facility sitting empty, and not being used. Meanwhile, they continue work on the new part of their courthouse. Do the taxpayers of Fairfax County realize the sat empty for years, and may very still be sitting empty.
Does anyone know? Fairfax residents, perhaps?
Maybe it could be used instead of building a new facility.
corr
Do the taxpayers of FX Co. realize that this “new jail”..
While the illegal aliens are in the detention center….they can work as part of a clean up crew picking up all the trash in the Sudley Manor area as payment for their housing in the facility and food.
The Patriot
Right on!
“While the illegal aliens are in the detention center….they can work as part of a clean up crew picking up all the trash in the Sudley Manor area as payment for their housing in the facility and food.”
Sadly Patriot your brilliant ideas don’t work. Once you pick up a citizen from another country, legal or illegal, you have to deal with the governments represent those aliens.
You cannot force them to do anything just deport them but since you want to keep them at this new facility then the lawyers will be there to see that you respect the rights of this illegal alien like you would for any foreign citizen.
American citizens captured in another country are not forced to do anything against the law. It doesn’t matter if they violated the law first. It applies here for illegal aliens.I know of Mexican and Central American Governments hiring lawyers to deal with these issues. This new facility will open a can of worms. Just an example, about 1200 people were captured during the Swift raids. Only half of them were illegal aliens, the rest were innocent and are suing the government. These raids were conducted by ICE who in theory have more experience than the local police officers. I see the State loosing money rather than profitting from this new enterprise. One mistake is all you need to get in court.
It is not as easy as you think but of course in your world Patriot everything is easy. See your option about identifying illegal aliens “Just ask are you here illegally?” For you is easier because you have said it in this blog: illegal immigrants can be categorized into one race only.
By the way you haven’t answer patriot to my question about your comments on the Dream Act. Were your comments racist?
Just say yes or no.
Why not build yet another facility for those who forget simple things like displaying county stickers, like that idea Lafayette? We could have them pick up trash in the rest of the county as payment for the administrative cost of their failing to pay for county decals or county taxes. While we’re at it, lets build yet another facility without amenities for those legal residents who fail to appear. As they obviously don’t want to appear for their crimes, why bother to rehabilitate them. Maybe we could deport them as well, I would suggest sending them to France in lieu of the gratitude they owe us, or to Russia in exchange for forgiving their “Great Patriotic War” debt. But before the first stone is set, I want to know who will be paying for these magnificent edifices.
Mom
Maybe, we can have the criminal illegal aliens build their own jail. Now, wouldn’t THAT be great!!!!
Mom,
I like the idea of a new facility. However, I did offer 2 suggestions “tent city” and perhaps use the unused jail in Fairfax. There are plenty of legal citizens who work full time and support their family that might not have A/C in the summer, warm house during the winter, and three square meals, but those inmates in our jail have all of that. I think a “tent city” would be very cost effective.
Who’ll be paying? The same ones that always pay.
It’s like this you don’t like my ideas, and that’s your OPINION!
However, I’m not mean spirited like you. I actually can agree with somethings you say.
Too bad you are so critical, and before you say anything I do listen to constructive criticism.
Have a nICE day!
anon, how is paying for their detention by working illegal??? They would be working until the time of their deportation. Please point me to the law that says they are not permitted to work!
“It’s like this you don’t like my ideas, and that’s your OPINION!” - In this instance I’m not criticizing “your” ideas, rather, I’m questioning the practicality of the whole premise from the GA on down
“I’m not mean spirited like you.” - Maybe not, but when serve as a cheerleader (although “right on” is just sixties/seventies) for Patriot’s largely immature comments, you should expect a few rocks thrown in your direction, nothing personal.
BTW, I don’t consider myself mean-spirited, just intolerant of overly simplistic “solutions” to complex problems, “solutions” that often ignore the unintended consequences. (Besides, you will upset NOVAScout if you continue to chide me about my demeanor, after all he is the Miss Manners of the blogosphere and seems to have a curious interest in my prose.)
Mom
Mom,
I’m just LOUD AND PROUD! I have had a few stones thrown my way, that’s to be expected here(bvbl). I’m truly not the enemy here. Somehow, I think you already know that.
Mean spirited might’ve been a little out of line. I’m intolerant of many things. Can’t we all just work for the good of our community?
Thanks for the comments. (I am serious)
Mom…once again…just like all the other liberals………NO PROOF! Just emotional statements!
Anon….please….show me (via proof) how this is a “complex” issue????????? It is really simple……illegal versus legal. Period. You liberals “try” to make things seem complicated to push your socialism, communism, marxism, etc. type of agendas! However, we have now caught on to your tricks and you don’t like it! We are not playing in your “pc” world of deceit….and….you don’t like it! Well get over it. I don’t care if you don’t like it!
Anon…did you know that some of the most effective solutions to problems are the simple ones? What a concept! Ever heard of the KISS principle?
Patriot, I’m just to the right of Mussolini so you can forget the liberal BS. You might want to read a little more carefully, I said overly “simplistic” not simple, although both apply to you. Why don’t you go dig up a few more links and let others express thoughts for you, although it makes you appear like you have too much time on your hands it also seems to reduce the number of immature comments you make.
Mom
Patriot,
AGAIN, Did you make racist comments two weeks ago? Why do you hide? I am fine with you calling me Zapatist, Liberal, Communist, apologist. By not responding, all I can say is that your opinions are motivated by your RACIST bias.
Until you answer yes or no I will be calling you RACIST and …. Red Neck Apologist.
anon…again…you failed to show any proof…why?…because there was none! You are ridiculous!
Here is for you Patriot:
Under Article 36 of the 1963 Vienna Convention on Consular Relations (VCCR), local authorities must inform all detained foreigners “without delay” of their right to have their consulate notified of their detention. At the request of the national, the authorities must then notify the consulate without delay, facilitate unfettered consular communication and grant consular access to the detainee. Consuls are empowered to arrange for their nationals’ legal representation and to provide a wide range of humanitarian and other assistance, with the consent of the detainee. Local laws and regulations must give “full effect” to the rights enshrined in Article 36. The USA ratified the VCCR without reservations in 1969; so fundamental is the right to consular notification and access that the US Department of State considers it to be required under customary international law in all cases, even if the detainee’s home country has not signed the VCCR. As of March 10, 2006, 169 countries were parties to the VCCR.
In March of 2004, the International Court of Justice determined in the Avena case (Mexico v. USA) that advisement of consular rights “without delay” means “a duty upon the arresting authorities to give that information to an arrested person as soon as it is realized that the person is a foreign national, or once there are grounds to think that the person is probably a foreign national.” In most cases, police in the United States would become aware of a suspect’s probable nationality through routine identity confirmation and computerized background checks, done either during the initial investigation, upon arrest, or very shortly thereafter. The State Department has interpreted the term “without delay” to mean as soon as practicable (i.e., without undue delay) and normally by the time the detainee is booked for detention.
See Patriot, once you involve a consulate then even the m inor mistreatment will be a very delicate matter.
Show me the statement that you call racist! Correlating illegal immigration problems (and benefits they are getting or might get due to breaking the law) to a particular group of people (using published research) is called criminal profiling. It has nothing to do with racism. So quit trying to muddy the waters like always.
Here is proof of what you said about the Dream Act:
“Bottom-line….no one should get any kind of advantage based on race! By having a policy like the Dream Act…it is giving an advantage of one race of people over all other races of people which is detrimental to equality for all.”
Her is your proof, no are you going to answer? Is this a racist comment?
Your credibility is lost until you give an explanation about how the illegal alien issue now is a race issue. Above you calimed that it was an illegal vs legal issue but you are the one posting against anyone that doesn’t look red neck like you.
anon…how is making them work a “delicate matter”? That is ridiculous. Nowhere does it say anything to that effect! You are spinning!
You forget easily. I don’t You posted that stament when we were talking about the Dream Act.
anon….I already addressed that above!
Criminal profiling is the correct term…not racism! Get real!
You have no credibility Patriot but I will answer. It is a delicate issue because the punushment for entering illegally to this country is deportation not forced or free labor. If this is difficult for you to understand, I don’t know what to say. Virginia will be liable for any punishment that the law has not specified. I though you were about the law in the US not the Gulag of the commies you hate. I guess that being a red neck has something in common with the red Russians of the past
anon…seriously…I will NOT lose any sleep over what you say…why? Because it is ridiculous and even you know it. Now, as far as working in jail/detention…they are NOT working for free…they are working to pay for their keep (food and bed).
Criminal profiling is racist when you target a race as the source of a problem. Ifg that is tha case, just put in jail all latinos you see because they are criminals. Include Bill Richardson, Alex Rodriguez, Manu Ginobli, Pele, Shakira, etc.
Are you saying…anon…that prisoners cannot mop floors, cook food, clean, etc.? You make no sense.
Seriously, Are you Racist?
The problem is that you see them as prisoners. The facilty is not designed for prisoners just as a a place to wait while ICE picks them up.
anon…criminal profiling is what it is. If you knew a dog was in the area biting people would you look for a skunk? Or, would you look for a dog! You know nothing about LE do you!?! What do you think the news does every day when a suspect is at large! Do you not see the news?
anon…they are technically prisoners because they are criminals who got caught.
The choices for foreign national illegally are; Deport them right away, release tehm, or keep them in a waiting facility. You have to protect them not make them your slaves, but in your world that is right. Seriously, Are you Racist?
how is working for your keep being a slave?
Yes they are criominals and the punishment is deportation not forced labor. Why is that hard for you to understand? There are rights that you have regardless of a crime.
I think we should deport immediately. But if resources are limited they must be detained until they can be deported. Since they would be housed and fed…I see nothing wrong with them “paying” for their keep by working.
Because what you need to do is to deport them. Virginia wants to keep them while ICE is busy so you pay for it. Virginians see a potential business , I see legal battles.
So are American prisoners being “forced” to work while be detained? They work for their keep do they not? Oh….does your version of the law only apply to poor illegal aliens!?!
YOu “don’t see” anything worng… well it is illegal according to the treaties ratified by the government you defend as a Patriot.
I say deport asap! I am sure most people on here would say the same! If ICE gets their crap together maybe this could happen.
Where is the proff that Americans are forced to work abroad? That is the discussion:foreign nationals, not just prisoners.
anon….I saw nothing in their that said that they could not work to pay back their keep.
The foreign nationals you are referring to were caught breaking our laws…therefore…they fall under our jurisdiction of the law. Just like if an American went abroad and broke laws in another country…that person would serve time abroad!
We finally agree. I think they should be deported immediately and then you avoid problems. You see if we get to the bottom of the things we agree on certain issues. I am in favor of deportation. Is that realistic? well that is for another conversation
Again, the crime was entering illegally. The punishment is deportation not forced labor. If you want to keep them in Viriginia yoiu are responsible for everything.
anon…the strategy I have proposed for the longest time is:
1. Enforcement of existing laws.
2. Deportation of known illegal aliens.
3. Attrition (cracking down on the employers that hire illegal aliens and cut all benefits that illegal aliens are receiving). This cuts the incentives.
All three items must be done.
Still not following your “forced labor” argument. They would receive (food and a roof) for their work. That is an “exchange”.
Why not for EVERY criminal, not just ILLEGALS?
Sounds good to me! Possibly, a lot of money to be saved and not so many second time offenders.
http://www.cnn.com/US/9907/27/tough.sheriff/
anon…many of the illegals do much more than merely enter illegally. They are involved in aiding and abetting, identity theft, stealing social security numbers, forging documents, and stealing benefits that only legal citizens are entitled to. We are talking felony type crimes here.
I agreed with you when I read your plan before. I think that we are concentrating a lot on the effect of the problem and not the source. Why don’t we buy a facilty to house the employers of illegal aliens? Why don’t we make the employers of illegal aliens pay for all the expenses of illegal aliens while waiting for deportation?
What do you think we need to do with Employers?
What groupos such as HSM are doing to target employers?
redawn…the legal criminals do do this already! That is why I say it should not be a problem.
Those who committed serious crimes, as I understand it, won’t be sent to this facility. They will face a different sentence and after payingb their debt to society then they will be deported.
Again not all criminals are the same or just from one race. If we avoid absolutes, then we can deal with this problem effectively
anon…now I agree with making the employers pay for the expenses too! That sounds like a great plan! As far as employers are concerned, I believe we should permanently revoke their business licenses (basically…shut them down permanently). Once this happens a few times in the local area and it hits the news…..we should see results.
When criminals are forced to some work is not just for punishment but as part of their rehabilitation program. It is not an exchange even for serious criminals. They don’t work to pay for their food but to do something fgood for society or to learn anew trade.
I wish we could do more with employers. You see there were no major penalties for Swift. They are back in business without paying for their crime.
anon…actually…the prisoners earn money to buy things in prison for themselves by doing the work. So it would fall into the “exchange” category.
“The Patriot said on 26 Sep 2007 at 7:31 pm:
redawn…the legal criminals do do this already! That is why I say it should not be a problem.”
YES and I agree, I have been following this for sometime and think that we should just do this MORE. Take the money saved, etc. There is more than one way to solve a problem and this is why this has so much attention. I think it is a FABULOUS concept.
I posted this on another thread: the question is why?
redawn said on 26 Sep 2007 at 7:50 pm:
The questions that I have that keeps getting attention in my mind:
WHY?
WHY have they not secured our borders? Why do they keep coming up with more excuses/ attempts, i.e, NIGHTMARE act? Why NOW at election time do they CONSIDER illegal aliens as a SUBJECT? Why has this not been done 40 some years ago, skip to 1986 i( before, in between / after) WHY NOW? WHY has NOTHING been done?
These are all questions, but the bigger question that I have is there any truth to the North American Union?
WHY? I understand “WHY” is the greatest question ever asked….but WHY?
I think the question is why, we exert a lot of efforts to have our voices heard and they do, only to be presented in some other way.
Patriot, you’re right–anonymous makes absolutely no sense. He/she is all over the place. Totally unfocused. Bringing in this point, that point, whatever pops into his/her head mainly create a diversion. Anonymous is really not worth the time and effort, in my opinion, because he/she is not here to learn.
Anonymous, you are fighting a losing battle with TP. I don’t think he realizes the domino effect of things. Do this, and this happens, and then this, and this and on and on. No act stands alone. It always causes an effect, either wanted or unwanted.
You seem to know a lot about legal consequenses, which is something most contributors to this blog are not even willing to consider. Their cure is Pick’em up, Send’em back. Fortunately, we live in a country that believes in human rights, and hopefully will continue to do so, while we try to settle the problem of illegal immigration.
# anonymous said on 26 Sep 2007 at 6:58 pm:
Patriot,
AGAIN, Did you make racist comments two weeks ago? Why do you hide? I am fine with you calling me Zapatist, Liberal, Communist, apologist. By not responding, all I can say is that your opinions are motivated by your RACIST bias.
Until you answer yes or no I will be calling you RACIST and …. Red Neck Apologist.
[Ed note: comment edited. Last warning.]
Anon: I happen to know Patriot personally, and Anon, you are WAY out of line.
“Anon, you are WAY out of line.”
Sorry Greg, I am tired of seeing the “racist redneck” label being thrown around so freely. It is offensive to many of us hard working Americans who grew up in the country and are stereotyped as a bunch of illiterate morons who are full of hate. If those comments are left unmoderated I feel the need to respond on a level that people of these mindsets can understand. I am more than happy to debate the topics without all of the racist conjecture being thrown around more and more freely here.
There are too many Anon’s and name callers around here. What the hell’s going on here?
Anon said, “Why don’t we buy a facilty to house the employers of illegal aliens? Why don’t we make the employers of illegal aliens pay for all the expenses of illegal aliens while waiting for deportation?”
This is not a bad idea! Fine the employers of these people, as they are the enablers of this entire problem.
Also, the country of origin should be billed for all costs related in repatriation of these people, and then maybe they would deal with them on the other end as well, thus encouraging the people to not return to the US.
Greg - I’ll try it again, since my comment last night seems to have been dropped. You know Patriot personally. I’m beginning to believe that he is a full-time employee of this blog, since he is all over at all times. Certain standard phrases keep being used as if he is parroting a “party line”. Batty is just plain NASTY.
Krutis
I hope Greg L drops your repost too!! My,my don’t you think you’re clever. You sure have a lot nerve. How childish can one be? You are a trying to be a trouble maker, and then have to resort to name calling. I’ve seen your comments, calling people nasty, fiesty, red neck, etc….
Ooooooooo, aren’t you the tough one!!!
kru & problem child anon, should be ignored…they have nothing worthwhile to contribute, just constant nagging and baiting.
Anon said: “Sorry Greg, I am tired of seeing the “racist redneck” label being thrown around so freely.”
Anon…there are so many “anons” I don’t know who is who….why don’t you research these posts and others. I have never called anyone anything other than a liberal (which is a legit term by the way)! The “other side” have called those of us who disagree with the illegal alien lobby that ridiculous phrase you mentioned in your quote! I questioned them about it! Get your facts straight.
The Patriot,
I’m glad to see you are up and at ‘em. Enough of the “other side”. Now, how’s that IGNORE button?
Lafayette, IGNORE is ON. How are things? Oh…I do have to address one outstanding item….I am on this blog because I am on vacation this week! When I am not on vacation…I have the ability to multi-task! Did you call our Senators today to say NO to the Dream Act?
Lafayette, I had a GREAT time at Mount Vernon the other day! It just motivated me more than ever to reclaim our country from illegal alien invaders and those that want to divide our nation with their socialist, communist, marxist, etc. agendas! These are things that George Washington would never have tolerated!
Just one thing Greg. Is it OK for one person to offend others as long as you agree with them? Well it is your blog so you can censor any way you want it. Patriot call people names whenever he wants it ans you don’t care about it. Batson called people a lot of names and his/her post are there.
If you want to be fair you should start censoring the posts whenever people start using the name calling strategy.
I think that a debate starts with arguments and not using names such as commies, boy lover, zapatists, etc whenever people disagree with some of the comments. I read Patriot comment and I think it is a racist comment, maybe a faux pas. If I were him/her I would respond I am not a racist. Why does he/she have to wait for you to come in his/her defense?
I see you Greg using the same strategy but soimetimes I forget that you own the floor.
The Patriot,
Multi-tasking, here too. Some just don’t get it. Call and faxed ourSenators. I got new fax last night. On vacation, good for you!! Remember the last week of June when I was on vacation? I devoted my vacation to change around here, and spent a lot of time on bvbl. Let’s forgot Anit-illegal, I’m sure that one has a “new name”. Not, to mention we’ve seen an improvement. Don’t you think?
http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/localnews/stories/092707dnmetirvprotest.112105a91.html
We need this kind of action right here in our local area!
corr
Let’s NOT foget Antil-illegal. Although they did apologize.
Improvement in WestGate/Sudley of course!
Lafayette, I have noticed a minor issue….those that support illegal immigration have trouble reading English on this blog (I guess that is the product of our bi-lingual education system). That is why they cannot seem to put all the information together and then make ridiculous statements based on emotionalism (and not facts or proof). Additionally, since it appears that they cannot read English, they don’t even know that questions have been addressed already and people have moved on from tired arguments based on no merit. Anyhow, keep up the great work!
Lafayette, the Sudley area is still a huge dumping ground! Both sides of the road and the center median along the entire stretch looks the the PWC dump (actually, the dump might have less trash on the ground!).
The Patriot,
We’ve gotten some really huge trash heaps taken care of. There’s still plenty of work to be done. I always am on the look out and I think you are too. Are you familiar with WestGate? I think you are. I’ve got my vote for Worst street in WestGate. We must stay productive!! Thanks
Lafayette,
I bet to differ. I vote for King George as the WORST street in Westgate.
Patriot, I don’t see the trash in the median strip on Sudley Manor. What are the cross streets? Perhaps I am not looking in the correct spots. I know that we get littering from those using Ben Lomond Park. That has been an on-going problem for years.
Dolph & The Patriot
I vote for Henrico as the worst. Although King George is running a real close second. Have you seen you favorite #16?
The garage now has siding. The garage looks much more suitable for living in. Maybe, let’s call them are “favorites”.
What say you, The Patriot? I’ve seen you don’t like to answer questions on here.-lol
Dolph, once you enter the “trash zone” you will see it. It starts at the 234 intersection (by KMART) and when you head East on Sudley Manor drive. Oh..its there!
Nice one Lafayette!
Patriot,
I was thinking more of the residential area. I haven’t seen anything significant down here other than the usual beer bottles and chip bags from the soccer/baseball/splash down crowd. That problem has been on-going.
Dolph
The Patriot is right. I’ve seen that mess.
Geez…where’s neighborhood services?
Dolph, that is a residential area! There are houses on both sides of the road!
What mess? It sounds like somewhere there is an area that looks like the landfill. I don’t know where it is. Specifics please.
I don’t have the best vision. I will look if you tell me where it is. There is a lot I don’t pick up on.
Dolph,
We shall go on a “field trip” later this afternoon. You can use my binoculars if you want.-lol
If I need binoculars to see it, then it doesn’t exist. I would probably get arrested for being a voyeur.
Sudley Manor drive Eastbound. Start from the intersection from the 234/Kmart. Trash is on all sides of the road and in the median. I see it all the time. I cannot remember a time when it looked clean. Cups, wrappers, papers, bottles, etc. You won’t need binoculars!
Names
I believe that calling someone a ‘liberal,’ ‘illegal apologist,’ or a ‘redneck apologist’ are equal in tone and derisiveness. As a moderate, I would like to think I am not any of these terms.
If a person’s argument is strong, the labels aren’t necessary and the reader can draw his or her own conclusions.
Anon#13 - My statement re Patriot was asking whether he/she grasps the idea of the domino theory. Is that considered troublemaking? Reiterate - the US is a great country that believes in human rights and is living up to those rights while trying to solve the dilemma of illegal immigration. I’ve never said that illegal immigration is not a problem. IT IS! Where we part ways is how to deal with it and with the illegals already in the US. Troublemaking? I ask you! I’m looking for a somewhat sensible solution that won’t hurt the US people or the US’ standing in the world community. Isn’t that what most of you are doing? I would hope so!
I also hope that my ESL (not) doesn’t draw out any of the small nitpickers.
Our standing in the world community??! Why should we care what France, Syria, Cuba, Iran, Venezuela, Mexico, etc. thinks about us? Our standing in the world community is just fine–that’s why illegal aliens insist on sneaking in here and not leaving. I don’t see them squatting in Canada.
“I’m looking for a somewhat sensible solution that won’t hurt the US people or the US’ standing in the world community.”
LOL! Have you looked into France’s new immigration laws lately? How ’bout the UK’s? Germany’s? How about Canada’s crying about 200 illegals they caught recently!
If you’re comparing us to other countries as far as immigration policies, you’ll find that we’re quite the pc pansies of the world.
monticup, what france is doing regarding taking dna of immigrants sounds like a great idea - especially when so many border-crossers use multiple and fake names. Another suggestion for the newly-formed immigration commission or the va crime commission to look at?
Here’s a domino effect of blanket amnesty for ya:
1. Amnesty
2. Millions of new citizens having to pay income taxes like the rest of us schmucks.
3. The same businesses formerly employing these new citizens refusing to hire them for the same reason they didn’t hire tax paying citizens before.
4. Millions of new citizens now requiring wellfare and other forms of public assistance because they are now unemployed.
AND
5. Millions of new illegals swamping the country to fill the vacuum left by the former illegals.
Why do the democrats want this?
6. Millions of new voters dependent on the goverment.
The last domino to fall:
7. The USA becomes the USSA (the United Socialist States of America).
Mando - I believe we’re searching for a STRONG yet LEGAL solution to a definitely big problem. I don’t know very much about the UK and Germany’s immigration laws except that Germany has tightened them considerably. However, how they compare to those of the US, I do not know.
I do know of a family where the son’s father-in-law, a Vietnamese who worked for the US Army during the VN war, was turned down three (3) times, a year apart, for a TOURIST visa to come here together with the son and his wife for a ONE MONTH visit; everything guaranteed. Speaking of pansies!!!!!
k o’toole: I was referring to France in general. Now with Sarkozy, France may clean itself up. I don’t think OUR policies should be made with the opinions of other countries in mind. We need to do what is in our best interest. Right now, it is in Mexico’s best interest (short term) to send their least accomplished citizens here. It is in Mexico’s interest to erase the border between us. That is not in our best interest. In the long term, Mexico (a very wealthy country in terms of resources) needs to get rid of its systemic corruption but I don’t see that happening.
anyone see the story in the news about the dishwasher from guatamala? he saved up 59,000 and tried to board a plane with it. The government snagged all his money and started deportation proceedings. A couple things here:
one, his money wasnt for consumption/spending in the united states.
two, he broke the law twice. Once by illegally crossing the border and two by carrying more than 10,000 in cash without filling out the customs forms.
He mentioned that he wanted to buy land (in guatamala) with his money. This is total BS, yet more proof they come her not to be productive members of our society but only for themselves. This person made no attempt to become a citizen. I’m glad they took his damn money, he deserves it.
And if he never paid taxes, someone should be going after his employers as well.
The word liberal is far different then the word Redneck. It is just that folks who otherwise get their panties in a bunch over names for minorities, don’t see a problem using the word redneck to describe whites, and to justify their double standard, they will attempt to explain the word has not history of use, and or will attempt to lump it in with words such as liberal.
The liberals who used to love the word liberal and were proud of being called one, now realize that after connecting the word liberal with their policies it is now better to not use the word liberal to describe themselves. The word they use now is “progressive” to discribe their vision and liberal policies.
Liberal can also be used to discribe any number of different folks, not just a particular race as the word redneck is used. So, I would say using the word liberal to discribe someone is name calling. Certainly calling someone a conservative is not name calling, so why should calling someone a liberal be considered that?
‘The word liberal is far different then (sic) the word Redneck.’ Ya think? Nooooo, tell me it isn’t so!
The Patriot said on 27 Sep 2007 at 8:07 am:
“Anon…there are so many “anons” I don’t know who is who….why don’t you research these posts and others. I have never called anyone anything other than a liberal (which is a legit term by the way)! The “other side” have called those of us who disagree with the illegal alien lobby that ridiculous phrase you mentioned in your quote! I questioned them about it! Get your facts straight.”
Patriot: My post was in defense of you because of the names you were being called, not the other way around.
OH OH OH, Dolph strikes back. Hold me, I’m scared. Of course like any good liberal, you will not answer the questions asked of you, but you sure will point out a mistake made by someone else.
Sorry liberal try again.