Supervisors Respond To Citizen Demands
By Greg L | 4 October 2007 | Illegal Aliens, Prince William County | 73 Comments
I’m hearing that lots of folks who contacted their county Supervisors prior to Tuesday’s meeting of the Prince William Board of County Supervisors are getting some interesting responses. The gist of the responses seem to indicate that there are a few supervisors that believe that funding the county’s initiatives to reduce the number of illegal aliens in our community ranks a little lower on the priority scale than some other ideas they have. Personally, something that has the potential to reduce county expenses by about $4 for every dollar spent (or more) would seem to be a pretty high priority.
What are you hearing back from your elected officials?
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Can you provide more information on your cost savings of $4 for every dollar spent? How/Where do you come up with those numbers? Thanks.
After contacting all of them, the only response I got was some pablum from Wally Covington to the effect that this issue has “certainly sparked some thought and dialogue in the County.” Well, no sheiss, Sherlock. I replied that if they didn’t get it right, he’ll see some sparks other than thought and dialogue. Do these guys and gals really know what they’re playing with? I watched Supervisor May acting disengaged while citizens were addressing him. Good thing that I wasn’t speaking while he was yawning and pencil tapping. If the guy doesn’t want to put up with the requirements of the job, one of which is listening to citizens, he should un-ass the chair.
I emailed them ALL yesterday, and I just got done faxing the same letter to each Supervisor. I want to make sure the letter makes it there, and not lost in cyberspace somewhere. One office has a busy fax line now. Well, this should be very INTERESTING.
Let’s not forget that we have the opportunity to put a candidate who actually “gets it” in the Woodbridge seat this year. Chris Royse is the only Woodbridge candidate to recognize that something needs to be done about this. He has addressed the Board at Citizen’s Time three times already since July 10 to urge them to act now.
While he may not be running in the district that everyone lives in, his vote on the Board can affect how other Supervisors vote and how the City of Manassas and Manassas Park proceed on this issue.
Everyone Help Elect Chris Royse!!
We need to remind them they are elected by their Districts, however they MUST act in the best interests of the ENTIRE county. THE LEGAL VOTING CITIZENS OF COURSE! We also, need to question the 7,000 letters Ricardo Juarez and Nancy L, seem to be so proud of. How many of those signatures are from legal, voting residents of Prince William County?
Mr May and Ms Caddigan’s fax lines are BUSY!
I have not heard from Stirrup with regard to anything I have sent him in the past two years including congratulating him on his resolution in July. He appears to be just like the former Gainesville supervisor, Wilbourn — doesn’t answer phone or e-mails. Won’t forget it in November.
This whole thing looks like it was a scam from the beginning. The BOCS had no intention of passing the resolution last Tuesday and mark my words, it will not be passed on the 16th. All bluster, no ba..s!
Concerned in Woodbridge,
Twenty years is a very long time. Chris Royse, addresses the PWCBOS frequently, and it’s very clear he is the ONLY choice the Woodbridge District. We as a county NEED Chris Royse!!!
http://www.chrisroyse.com/
Anon @ 3:45
Why not try giving Mr Stirrup’s office a call at 703-792-6195(6)
I’ve had great luck with both of those numbers.
“This whole thing looks like it was a scam from the beginning.” It might have been scam for a few supervisors but I can guarantee you that at least Stirrup and Stewart mean business.
me-n-u on 4 Oct 2007 at 3:52 pm:
As I said above, there was no intention of this being passed on Tuesday, and highly doubt it will on the 16th. Two votes are not good enough and that is probably the most the resolution will get when/if it is voted on. They falsely got the hopes of the community up only to pull the rug out from under us.
When Ricardo Juarez was giving instructions to his people at the All Saints rally a few months back, his instructions were that if you were a legal resident, that you should provide your full street address. If you’re an illegal, he said only to put your name and city. I’d like to see how many of those pieces of papers they turned in seem to have come from illegal aliens.
It’s pretty outrageous that illegal aliens would be petitioning the government asking that they don’t enforce the laws.
It would be even more outrageous if Supervisors took the requests of illegal aliens and gave them more weight than the calls they’re getting from their own constituents, who can vote!
“It might have been scam for a few supervisors but I can guarantee you that at least Stirrup and Stewart mean business.”
Bwah, hah, hah, hah…
Stirrup is using the issue as a springboard for Wolfe’s seat and Stewart is using it to get re-elected, the funniest part is that they may end up shooting each other in the foot.
This federal government excuse is such a cop out too, that is to some extent what i got back from Covington. Listen, if a meteor falls on Prince William county, shall we wait for the Solar System Government to fix it? We have a problem here, which has local remedies and we need action.
When I call Stirrup’s office I always get a response back. He may have his assistant call back but that’s okay with me. His office always responds. When my neighbor and I had a problem with Building Code Enforcement, John Stirrup set up a meeting with BCE and us in his office (John Stirrup was present). I’ll bet you don’t get that kind of service from the Fairfax County Board and the Fairfax Board gets paid at least TWICE as much as PWC Board members.
If you called my office to call me names, I wouldn’t call you back!
Do you call Stirrup just to curse him out?
Everyone should call the Supervisors before the vote on 10/16. Let each Supervisor know how you feel.It will take 5 votes to pass, Those that vote “no” need to be voted out of office. Nohe, Caddigan ,and Jenkins, as they have no opposition, will have to live with their votes if they vote[ no] . Voters will know who is looking out for them. It may cost money now, but in2-5 years it will be double or more.
Anonymous said on 4 Oct 2007 at 4:42 pm, you are absolutely right.
I mean, Anonymous at 4:42 pm, you are absolutely right.
Now not even Stirrup is responding? He played with you!!!! He was your savior and Greg’s buddy.By the way Greg how did you calculate the savings?
PWCHomeowner (4:58)
Using the Fed Govt as a cop out is not limited to the BOS.
My neighbor just showed me a big 4 color piece a la Pandank
this one from Colgan. Postage? Courtesy of the citizens who
subsidize these infernal pieces of mail. Strange, how Mr Colgan
suddenly against illegal aliens, and he’s also against “amnesty”
but he can’t do anything about something which must be
decided in Washington. Colgan voted for a loophole which would make it possible for illegals to register to vote. He has
failed to step up to the plate in any way shape or form to help
solve the illegal problem. Now suddenly, he is pandering for
votes. According to my neighbor (who is a life time Dem) Mr
Colgan’s pandering is too little, too late.
At least Bob Fitzsimmonds has a plan! He wants to punish
employers who hire illegals, he also wants state benefits to
illegals cut out. I could go on and on about Bob, but since
all who participate in this blog probably know his plans, I don’t
think it necessary to go on.
Anon’s
There are too many Anon’s on here these days.
Please, pick a screen name or number.
You gotta see this video on ABC’s 6:00 evening news (a few minutes ago) about a Federal National Crackdown on illegal immigrants. The feds are finally doing their job. This is the way the problem should be handled! Tell your Congressman that we want to see this in Virginia!
http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=3690250
Retiredwg,
Thanks for the link. We NEED AND DESERVE this kind of action in Virginia.
Governor Kaine,
We also need a statewide 287(g) program to include Troopers and DMV.
The argument that we should not be paying for what is obviously a federal government commitment rings hollow when you go back and review what all of these supervisors said when they quickly and in a self-congratulatory way voted to raise our taxes to build roads to respond to the transportation crisis. I would love to know what the tax tab is for this as compared to the road bonds we have been and will be paying for.
FYI..
link to an article “Senate OKs border funds”, mentioning $3 billion for border security including 700 mile fence for the border…
http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071004/NATION/110040082/1001
While we are paying for Federal action, I somehow feel better thinking it’s Federal money instead of County money. I’m comfortable with the trade-offs occurring at a different level. A Federal solution requires no compromises regarding where we spend our local dollars. Now, if they would just come calling here. If given a choice, I would rather build roads, libraries and ball fields while watching the Feds take care of enforcing the law. I recognize the choice may be hypothetical.
Considering the publicity Prince William County has received (much of it thanks to this blog) and Republican worries about Virginia becoming a blue state, I wonder if we are “on the list” for future enforcement. An occasional sweep coupled with a statewide 287g program would probably do the trick.
“The argument that we should not be paying for what is obviously a federal government commitment rings hollow when you go back and review what all of these supervisors said when they quickly and in a self-congratulatory way voted to raise our taxes to build roads to respond to the transportation crisis.”
Apples and oranges Bunkerboy, unlike the current issue wherein the Feds have obviously failed (or succeeded if you are truly cynical) the “transportation crisis” is one of the BOCS’s own making. As I have stated before, they failed to abide by county and state code when granting a gross number of residential rezonings that created the amount of overdelopment that now plagues most of PWC. The codes are very clear, you don’t development until the infrastructure is IN PLACE, the BOCS typically relied on long-range plans and used them as justification for approval; when the bubble burst and funds cut for projects, they left PWC holding the bag and are no planning to tax their way out of a situation of their own making. You can’t point to the Feds, Richmond or Mexico for that one, it is a circumstance almost entirely of their own making.
Mom
Here’s some comment from earlier today regarding responses from Supervisors.
Lafayette said on 4 Oct 2007 at 11:23 am:
Anon @ 11:14am
All,
I’ve just gotten this response from Supervisor’s Stirrup’s office.
Chris, Thank you for expressing your encouragement to Supervisor Stirrup for his rule of law resolution. Your experience and ideas are very worthwhile.
So, here’s the score now, 2 responses out of 8. Keep calling, faxing, emailing the Supervisors.
Lafayette said on 4 Oct 2007 at 10:24 am:
The Patriot
Yes, I got a response from Wally too, he’s the only one so far. I sent my letter late yesterday afternoon. I spoke with someone that called his office, and they got the exact same lines we did. BTW-Are you worried about the Rt 28 Project?
There are PLENTY of ways to cut back. I would first say get rid of PCE Inspector(lack thereof) Sr. Chavez. There are some that are getting paid way too much in Neighborhood Services, and quite frankly don’t seem to care about the job they are supposed to be doing. I will be making some calls today, and hope to visit some Supervisor’s offices in person tomorrow. Be prepared, some will have calendars too busy to call us back. This is what I heard(prior to 7/10/07 resolution vote), and know of several others that would say the same.
sandy on 4 Oct 2007 at 5:46 pm:
Yes, the the BOCS will be floating more bonds!
Patty on 4 Oct 2007 at 5:17 pm:
Well that is nice to know someone in that office is alive and has the courtesy to respond to an e-mail or return a phone call. I have sent a number of e-mails to Stirrup’s office over the last two years with regard to zoning and traffic problems in the Sudlay area all to no avail. In fact, I have also written a letter or two to him which were not acknowledged. His predecessor was of the same mind set. Once they get in office they play hard to get.
Guys, guys, you are so being played. The Demagogues (you an they know who they are) are praying, praying that the fiscal conservatives on the Board will take the rap for not enacting anything of substance. Stewart has his fingers crossed that the Nohe/Covington/Caddigan group, along with Barg and Jenkins, will save him from the dire fiscal consequences of doing what you want him to do while freeing him to send messages like that in the previous thread that he’s battling to rid PWC of those vile illegal immigrants. He may get his wish, but just for the sheer sport of it, if I were on the Board, I might say, “I’ve got real concerns that we don’t understand the costs or the overall tax implications of enacting this thing a time when our residential tax base is under tremendous pressure, but, by golly, our Chairman wants to rid the County of these anti-American, non-English-speaking, litterbugs, and, by gum, I’m going to stand by our Chairman on this.”
A couple of years down the road, the County’s estimable financial condition will be a distant memory and Stewart won’t be able to say he would have loved to have satisfied your most base desires, but was held back by fiscal killjoys who wouldn’t let him start his own INS.
Very interesting story in the NYT today. ICE raiding the wrong houses and terrorizing American citizens of Hispanic origin.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/04/nyregion/04raid.html
Editorial on it as well.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/04/opinion/04thur2.html
Also on the economic side, I would recommend this WSJ article on businesses bracing the crackdown:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB119119705298544271.html?mod=googlenews_wsj
It mentions the phenomenon of American farmers subcontracting or renting land in Mexico because of the threat to labor here, something discussed in a lot of detail in an NYT article last month that I just now noticed.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/05/us/05export.html
The headline is: Short on Labor, Farmers in U.S. Shift to Mexico
Lafayette, I told both Wally and Marty (yes I received a reply from Marty now - he was passing the buck too and complaining about funding)….that they can free up money from the “Community Development” projects listed in the CIP to fill the “funding shortfall”. Many of those projects in that section certainly are NOT as important as resolving our illegal immigration issues and they can be deferred for a later date (once we get our illegal immigration situation under control). In fact, once we get our illegal immigration situation under control, there should be more county money freed up for those projects that were deferred.
Does anyone see the absurdity of Supervisors Jenkins, Nohe, Caddigan, Barg and Covington becoming the ‘fiscal conservatives’ on the board worried about how this will impact the budget? I feel like I’m in la-la land.
The sudden impulse at fiscal conservatism is nothing more than an excuse. The way most of these supervisors work is simple. If you don’t want to vote for something but your constituents are in favor of it, you come up with an excuse (i.e.Rt. 28 funding will be cut), then you float that excuse about to see if people buy it. If they don’t, you keep floating other excuses until you find one that people buy. I’m not buying this time.
Nohe:
“About $3 million will be used to hire firefighters for the new Antioch station, one of the fire department’s top priorities, said Vice Chairman Martin E. Nohe (R-Coles). About $220,000 was put back into the budget and shifted from other areas within the library system “to keep all of our libraries open for all of their hours,” Nohe said. An additional $30,000 will be made available to keep pools open in the county.”
So Marty isn’t fiscally conservative when it comes to cutting a library or a swimming pool’s hours by a couple of hours and he’s not a fiscal conservative about hiring firefighters,….but talk about extra police help to deal with the illegals, and all of the sudden he is the solid fiscal conservative? Give me a break!
Covington: (transcipt of a CNN interview with Kitty Pilgrim interviewing Wally Covington about the cost of illegal immigration only 9 months ago)
“PILGRIM: Alarm about illegal immigration has prompted another local government to do what the federal government will not do. A county board of supervisors has ordered the study of the financial impact of illegal immigration on its budget.
Civic groups say such a study would be unique, but it’s happening in Prince William County, Virginia, just outside Washington, D.C. Now the study is the brainchild of supervisor Wally Covington who joins us here tonight.
Thanks for being with us. WALLY COVINGTON, PRINCE WILLIAM COUNTY: Thank you, it’s good to be here.
PILGRIM: Why did you do this study? Why did you think it was important?
COVINGTON: It’s important to go after what the cost is to local government. We’re in a budget-tightening period right now and we only receive a certain amount of funds from certain forms of taxes. So whereas illegal immigration sends a fair amount of money to the feds and the state government, local government really gets stuck with a lot of the services.
PILGRIM: You know, according to the census bureau, the population of Prince William County has increased by 67,000 people in just five years. How many do you estimate are illegal aliens?
COVINGTON: They haven’t been able to give me those numbers yet. I’m not sure exactly what our total number of illegal immigrants are. But we do know that in our jail system, that we have 88 inmates out of 719 that are illegal aliens.
So if we were to extrapolate those numbers, we can clearly see that we have a fairly large population of illegal immigrants and many of my constituents are asking me to step forward and talk about it more and try to get some more of these numbers.
PILGRIM: Do you believe that the millions in cost will eventually be reimbursed?
COVINGTON: You never know what the federal government is willing to do. But if we’re able to put a focus on this and a face on it that local government is bearing most of this burden, then the federal government should act in some form or another to bring us some relief.
PILGRIM: Was this born of frustration and just seeing budgets out of control?
COVINGTON: It does. It has a heavy impact on our education. We have children in trailers, we have a justice system that’s being plagued with a fair amount of crime and we’re just looking to get a handle on this portion of it as a growing community.
PILGRIM: Let me run this by you. Now the controller of the state of Texas just released a report showing illegal immigrants contribute $17 billion to the state economy. But the report did not examine the cost to education. How do you react to that kind of a report?
COVINGTON: Well, I think that report, if you really looked at the details, talked about the state government receiving most of those funds and local governments bearing most of the burden, that there were shortages at the local level.
So it bears out a lot of what I’m talking about that the local government here in Prince William County is being forced to pick up a lot of the costs associated with illegal immigrants.
PILGRIM: And let me just give you some feedback from the Hispanic civil rights group, the National Council of La Raza. And they sent us a statement which I’d like to read to you. It says, “We welcome the study on the costs and benefits of immigrants at the local level.
And while we know that immigrants do pay taxes, there is much to be learned about the distribution of those tax revenues. Of course, such a study must be based on strong, unbiased methodology to ensure that both the costs and the contributions are accounted for.”
This seems like a very open statement. How do you assess it?
COVINGTON: You know, I would agree with that. As much as we can just put the raw numbers down that it’s costing us to educate children, to provide law enforcement and human services, the best we can come up those numbers, the more we’ll be able to offer solutions at the local level.
The reality is the federal government’s got to be the one that steps in. They’re the ones that control our borders. They’re the ones that regulate interstate commerce and it really comes into those clauses of the constitution that the federal government should be doing these things and local government just can’t do it all.
PILGRIM: Mr. Covington, you’re up for re-election next year. This is an enormous political issue and some of your detractors suggest that you’re doing this for the publicity of it. What do you say to them?
COVINGTON: Well, first, I never thought there would be so much publicity on it. It was merely a budget request that I asked for, how do we get a handle on these numbers?
We’re looking at a budget shortfall in Prince William County of $18 million this year alone and we’re looking at budget shortfalls in the coming years ahead. We had to start asking some serious questions about our fiscal responsibilities to our taxpayers.
And one of those areas seems to me to be illegal immigration. We have a problem and we ought to start talking about it and trying to figure out a way to prod the federal government to give us some help.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much for explaining it all to us, Wally Covington, supervisor of Prince William County, thank you.”
So just 9 months ago, Mr. Covington said the illegal immigration was “costing” Prince William county, but now he doesn’t want to spend any money to help with the same problem he complained about. Ridiculous!
Caddigan:
“Supervisors Maureen S. Caddigan, R-Dumfries, Hilda M. Barg, D-Woodbridge and John D. Jenkins, D-Neabsco, favored advertising a higher tax rate to give the board some flexibility in the budgeting process.”
So a higher tax rate is okay for giving us ‘flexibility’ but not okay when you really need it to deal with a huge problem.
Barg:
“Barg was incredulous when the board voted down Jenkins’ proposal after hearing people speak in favor of more money for the schools and several endangered social services programs.
She held up a stack of e-mails supporting tax rate increases and said she had even more in her tote bag.”
Great, so now Barg can hold another stack of emails supporting doing tax increases or whatever else it takes to straighten this problem out and rid this county of illegal aliens!
Don’t accept these silly excuses. Keep the pressure up. It is the only thing that will work.
I received an e-mail reply from Covington and Nohe. Basically, Covington said that this issue was a federal government problem/responsibility, and stated that he knew that there wouldn’t be enough tax dollars for this from the beginning. Which brings up the obvious question…Why then did he vote for the resolution in the beginning if he knew it couldn’t happen? But, he did state at the end of his letter that his goal was to work with the Board to find an acceptable funding source. Kind of sounds like double-talk to me.
Nohe’s letter applauded everyone involved in the issue…the Board, county staff, and Chief Deane. But, he also stated that this was essentially a federal govt. problem. He did take credit for the illegal immigration policy moving forward though, since it was his motion that formally approved the Chief’s new policy. He also brought up the “shocking news” of Gov. Kaine’s budget cuts that will influence the Board’s decision. Curiously, he said that the Governor’s cuts were “the responsible thing to do.” Again, this Supervisor sounds like someone who is both for the policy and against it.
It appears that no one counted on the Governor’s drastic budget cuts, and it also appears that the County doesn’t want to cut already existing plans to fund the illegal immigration issue. But, as was stated in earlier posts….What is more important to Prince William than the illegal alien problem? I would gladly pay more taxes or sacrifice a road being widened if it meant that the County would be a safer place for my family. I am a homeowner in the County. And, I feel very disappointed and betrayed.
No. No. No! We cannot let our BOCS off the hook! They can free up money from the “Community Development” section of the CIP and also use discretionary funds! There is no excuse! I just sent an e-mail to them with this proposed solution. In any budget, there is always room for re-prioritization and re-distribution of funds when an “emergency” action is required. We have an “emergency” action that needs to be addressed now!
What?? You still don’t get it? They duped you, used you and mislead you and the funny part is they did it largely through Greg and this blog. They set Greg up as the strawman, generated enough heat on both sides of the issue and now have a convenient out. Typical of the way this board operates.
Finally, I get to disagree with NOVAScout (although he’s right about you being played), it’s been so long I feared I was slipping to the left. Whatever else they may be “the Nohe/Covington/Caddigan group” are not fiscal conservatives, well at least Nohe and Caddigan, I don’t know if Covington can spell it much less define it. This is nothing more than internecine warfare on the part of Nohe and Caddigan with Wally standing outside with his finger to the wind.
Mom
CW, i am with you, this is a joke, a 500k cut in a state support from police is no excuse in my opinion. That is less than 1 dollar per citizen of PWC. The proposal that they all seemed to support costs about 3 dollars per year per citizen. Get off your butts and act, words mean nothing only actions, and government action begins with funding.
“Community Development” funds from the CIP + discretionary funds = funding for the “shortfall”
Using fiscal conservatism as an excuse for not acting is a farce. The BOCS has approved development projects for years that do not pay for the services they consume and require raising taxes on current citizens to make up the difference. Moreover, as soon as the election is over we’re going to see a flood of new rezoning applications. The housing slump will not last forever and developers look several years down the road in making their plans. Moreover, they want cheap, illegal labor.
The Wall Street Journal article referenced above says:
“As a crucial hearing looms on a planned government crackdown on illegal immigrants in the workplace, many businesses are scrambling to figure out how they will cope with an expected loss of illegal labor. . .
The program, if put into effect, is expected to pose tough choices for many business owners, particularly in industries such as agriculture, construction and food service, which rely heavily on illegal workers. Employers would be required to fire such workers once their status was exposed, or risk fines.”
This is the crux of what’s going on here. The business community fears the loss of cheap, illegal labor, and having to comply with processes to ensure their employees are legal. They are putting pressure on the BOCS not to fund implementation of the Stirrup resolution.
The opponents need only four votes to stop implementation of the Stirrup resolution. A tie vote among the eight supervisors is a defeat. We need five to pass it. On October 16, Supervisors Jenkins and Barg will vote no. Supervisors Stewart, Stirrup and May will vote yes. Supervisors Covington, Nohe and Caddigan are trying to figure out how they can kill the measure while taking minimal heat. They will kill implementation by deciding among themselves who least can afford the public criticism. Two of the three will vote with Jenkins and Barg to kill it. Whichever one of the three votes for implementation of the Stirrup resolution, knowing that it dies, dodges the bullet. Their supporters in the business community will know what is going on and not criticize the one of the three who votes for implementation. In the end, citizens and taxpayers lose.
Would the crackdown cost us something? Without doubt it would. We would likely pay more for restaurant meals, lawn maintenance services, etc. as those businesses are required to pay legal employees higher wages than they pay illegals. However, the transformation of our neighborhoods into third world barrios would stop, overcrowding in our schools would ease, and we would no longer be paying taxes to support public services for illegals. That’s a good deal in my opinion.
The art of politics is a game of compromise. People who go into an endeavour expecting to get everything they asked for really aren’t adept at this particular game. The masters of the art always have an alternate proposal that “gives something” to “get something”. Holding firm to something that appears to be quickly evolving into an untenable position is a prescription for losing it all. People need to start focusing on the end game (driving illegal immigrants from Prince William County, Virginia, and the United States) vice one specific strategy that appears to be at high risk. I would suggest it’s time to start thinking about a plan “B” if you wish to walk away with anything at all. Surly, we have more than one trick in our bag? I don’t think our County Supervisors are amateurs (although they are compared to the old hand Federal politicians)… and we are being played a bit. It’s time to move to the big boy’s table and play the game properly.
Supervisors ARE responsible to the citizens within their district as each district has a unique set of equities in County politics. Sooner or later the Citizens of Prince William County are going to wonder why Corey Stewart is allowing a group named “Help Save Manassas” (a town with its own Government and unique problems that do not necessarily mirror the rest of the county or its sentiments) to write County policy and drive the County’s agenda. That’s not a criticism of a very effective group that has advanced the illegal immigrant issue from the perspective of legal residents in this County, State and Country; however, it is a reality that you should consider in developing strategy.
It’s time to think strategically and consider alternate courses of action to attain our goals. It’s the end game that counts. Cigars and brandy all round when the last illegal alien leaves Prince William County. There are many political paths to achieve this end. Don’t get hung up on any one course of action and be prepared to be flexible and to adapt to changes beyond yours or the BOCS control (such as a reduced tax base or State level cuts). I’m sorry gentlemen; however, only a fool would implement the Immigration Analysis recommendations considering today’s fiscal reality. I don’t see any fools sitting on the BOCS.
If you only have one recommendation and it fails, you’re done. You need alternatives. Develop a couple that consider and allow for the same issues that face the BOCS.
Concerned and Retiredwildgoose:
You have both presented thoughtful appreciations of the situation as it appears, and statements of prudent general political principles. May I ask if either or both of you have a suggested way forward?
Concerned, do you see a way to undo the scenario you have sketched? Is the choice binary, either-or, or could the BOCS compromise and at least move the process forward, if not to the full extent?
Retiredwildgoose and concerned, what concrete suggestions do you have, assuming that meaningful follow-through on the part of the BOCS fails to materialize?
CWC:
I must concede to a large degree of frustration at this point. As a life-long Republican I fear that my party has succumbed too much to the influence of corporate contributions and big-government, from the national to the local levels. It is no longer the party of Ronald Reagan. The Democrats are worse. On immigration, Republicans pander to the businesses who want cheap illegal labor and Democrats worship at the shrine of every multicultural, politically-correct crackpot in the country. Democrats see the invasion of illegals as a future voting constituency also. Neither party is representing the vast majority of the American middle class.
I got my “final notice” from the Republican National Committee to renew my membership this week. I can’t bring myself to send them any money while they and Bush are pushing amnesty. I don’t recall ever not being a member of the RNC, but there it is.
Unfortunately, the key undeclared votes on implementing the Stirrup resolution, Covington, Nohe and Caddigan, are all running for reelection unopposed. They have at this point a sense of invulnerability. Moreover, according to the Virginia Public Access Project, this year Covington has raised $90,463, Nohe has raised $83,592 and Caddigan has raised $62,104 with developers being the largest contributors to all. When they have no opposition, what do they need all of that money, largely from developers, for?
I feel that they will kill implementation of the Stirrup resolution, as I wrote in my previous post, in the service of their contributors who want to continue using cheap, illegal labor. One will vote with Stewart, Stirrup and May (these three Republicans are the only reason for any optimism in this dismal scenario). We’ll know then which among Covington, Nohe and Caddigan feels weakest. I hope I’m wrong but I don’t see much chance of their acting in the best interests of the citizens of Prince William County rather than the source of their money.
When Jenkins, Barg, and at least two of the three “undecideds” betray us, they will tell us it was for our own good and in the interest of fiscal conservatism. We can then get out our wallets to pay even more taxes to finance services for illegals so the businesses can continue getting their cheap labor.
Republicans need to take back their party to restore it to what it was in the days of Reagan and Democrats need to go back to the values of Kennedy. Reagan and Kennedy differed in many ways and had different approaches to solving the nation’s problems. Nonetheless, both put the interests of the American people first!
Here is my response from Supervisor Nohe:
Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts regarding the Board’s ongoing efforts to deal with the challenges that we face due to the Federal Government’s inability or refusal to deal with illegal immigration. I believe that the county staff has done an excellent job in bringing together the extensive information and recommendations that the Board requested in July. I also applaud Chief Deane for developing a new set of police policies that address the manner in which his officers deal with cases in which they suspect an individual is not in the country legally.
On Tuesday, the Board unanimously approved my motion by which we have formally concurred with the Chief’s new policy and standard for determining “probable cause” and provided him with the authority to publish that policy, share it with the public, and begin planning for its implementation. Further, my motion directed county staff to continue working on the agreement that is being formulated between the county and ICE to grant the appropriate authority to the Police Department to carry out that plan.
Unfortunately, the county got some shocking news on Monday afternoon. Due to a large revenue shortfall at the state level, the Governor made some fairly dramatic budget cuts to balance the state budget. While making cuts was the responsible thing to do, we were disappointed to hear that he cut $575,000 from the money that the state gives to our county police department. With an unexpected hole in our police budget, we decided that the fiscally responsible action would be to get more input from the Chief on the impact the cuts will have on his Department before we move forward with funding any new initiatives. We will be getting some of the information on October 11 and I anticipate that at that time, we will be in a better position to know how to proceed responsibly.
Again, thank you again for your comments.
Yours-
Marty Nohe
Coles District Supervisor
Concerned -
AMEN! I let my membership expire as well. I never thought that day would come, but it has.
Your post makes a lot of sense (unfortunately for us). Maybe we’ll all be surprised!
POOR, POOR illegals - take a look at this!!!!!!!!!!!
All of you illegal alien apologists can take a hike!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUdwBOy-FIk
CWC,
I’m glad you asked. The Immigration Analysis provided a lot of information on the Constitutional basis and case law for policy in this area. For example, I found it interesting that the Supreme Court ruled all “persons” on U.S. Soil are protected by the constitution… good to know. I would propose that perhaps Help Save Manassas use the Immigration Analysis and the information it provides as input to a brainstorming session regarding next steps.
First, I would make sure that we are clear on our goals. There are perhaps a couple of goals that are not mutually exclusive:
a. Eliminate the presence of illegal immigrants in Prince William County, and/or
b. Address the problems caused by illegal immigrants in Prince William County.
Second, I would propose that Help Save Manassas sponsor a town hall meeting. The group has the gravitas (in my opinion) similar to the Committee of 100 so getting the right people to show up would probably not be a problem. I would propose that the group invite two or three supervisors (perhaps representing different poles of the discussion). The supervisors would be invited to give an honest assessment of the budget situation and would be encouraged to talk in terms of what we could afford and what compromises could be made within the county to fund an initiative. I would borrow from the Committee of 100 format a bit (and perhaps open a dialog with them to see if they were interested in working together).
Third, I would invite a Federal Congressman (or two) to the same or perhaps a different town hall meeting. We do need the Feds involved. That’s what our Congressmen do. I notice a lack of traffic to Congressman on the blog. Some might say we are complaining to the wrong people when we make this a County issue. Let’s start creating some heat on the hill. Congressmen handle constituent issues and worry about votes also.
Forth, I would perform some due diligence regarding “what works” and “what doesn’t work” in other communities. For example, how is Irving, TX exporting so many illegal immigrants?
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/TheNote/story?id=140443
Or, what went wrong in Riverside, N.J. We don’t want their experience.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/26/nyregion/26riverside.html?ex=1191470400&en=851764c0b70b3177&ei=5070&emc=eta1
or, the Feds just pulled off successful raids in Nevada, California, and New York (like, yesterday). Chertoff indicates its part of a trend. What are their plans for Virginia? They know we are making national news because of their inaction so it would be reasonable that we are “in the queue”.
http://www.ice.gov/pi/news/newsreleases/articles/071003losangeles.htm
The interesting thing is that participants in this blog have tracked successes and failures across the country so we have the data.
Fifth (and this might cause some brickbats to be thrown), I would get creative to who I talk to and work with. For example, I would suggest a meeting between Help Save Manassas and Mexicans without Borders and other Hispanic groups to discuss differences. I’m guessing the members of the Hispanic community who are legal residents would like to see an end to this problem as much as we would. It would be worth reaching out to them to at least open a dialog (for a lot of good reasons).
Sixth (concurrent activity with all of the above), ask the BOCS to start a citizen group sponsored (and funded) by the county to address the issue of Illegal Immigration following the model of the Human Rights Commission (and perhaps to balance the Human Rights Commission).
http://www.co.prince-william.va.us/default.aspx?topic=040030000020004263
That would give the group an office in the County Government Complex for closer access to supervisors and staff. I would use this group (which would include a Supervisor or two and perhaps County staff support) to sort through the results to identify things that would work now and things that would work later, things that cost nothing and things that need resources, things that have already been tested in court and things that generated litigation. The works now, costs nothing, already tested in court would go to the top of my list. The rest would be prioritized in a list for further vetting with the solutions that pass muster being implemented.
Seventh, I would open a Federal front via our Federal Congressman. It’s time to put the heat on with regular calls, letters, and citizen testimony. There’s an election next year. We are suffering because of Federal inaction. Let’s share the pain.
Eight, I would change the name of Help Save Manassas to Help Save Prince William County. Names have baggage. Manassas probably reflected the original scope of the Group; however, (IMHO) its scope has expanded. Article 2 of the by-laws refers to the community. The name of the group implies the Community is Manassas. Clearly, it as a voice for the County. I would fix the name.
The process would be to submit recommendations as appropriate to the venue to both:
Our Congressmen, I think they’ve been getting a pass., and
the Chairman, BOCS, for consideration.
Reference the Feds, my experience is you get what you ask for. I’m not sure that the citizens are asking for anything. Let’s change that. I would suggest we change that by evolving Help Save Manassas (Help Save Prince William County?) into an effective lobbying effort not unlike the NRA that offers viable alternatives while keeping the pressure on at all levels. The biggest problem would be if, in fact, it “lost” the current narrowly focused battle and simply “went away.” It needs to operate on multiple fronts.
I would also suggest it consider dipping into Supervisor’s discretionary money to fund research, investigations, and perhaps travel to review effective (and ineffective) solutions implemented in other communities to gather data.
It has taken Prince William County (as well as Virginia and the United States of America) a long time to get in this mess. It will take a while to get out of it. We have a vocal organization to drive this through and a blog for discussion. Let’s use these tools to create a longer term vision for the future of this County and perhaps America.
On another note, CWC, I also let my membership in the Republican party expire. The Dems certainly aren’t an alternative these days. I’ve joined the ranks of the independants (and, I’ll admit, it feels uncomfortable to be without a party affiliation).
RACK said: “Here is my response from Supervisor Nohe: […]”
Yea, I got the same standard form letter as well.
I told him I’d never support him again if he caves on this.
Call, write, fax, ad infinitum.
Since even the very thought of our police cooperating with ICE via 287g has begun self-deportation, I would be happy if the BOCS would just keep that part of the resolution.
Also, I hate to say it, there is a LARGE bit of land which PWC bought up some years back in my neighborhood in order to keep it out of the hands of developers - can’t remember why. They could sell it to their developer friends and make them happy, and use the $$ from the sale to pay for implementation of the resolution. I’d hate to see a big development go in, but am willing to sacrifice IF the BOCS were serious about this issue.
Here’s my response from Corey.
As you may know, some of the Board members on Tuesday refused to vote to fund the crackdown on illegal immigration until the Board discusses financing options at the Board’s annual fiscal retreat on October 11.
The only Board members who have stated, without reservation, that they will (1) support funding the crackdown and (2) cut off services to illegal immigrants are John Stirrup Mike May and myself. We need to get commitments from all the other supervisors.
In my view, the community is already paying for the cost of illegal immigration in terms of crowded schools, emergency rooms, jails and rising gang violence. I have insisted that the Board vote on this no later than October 16. This is the last meeting before the election on November 6, and it is imperative that the Board vote before the election to avoid losing momentum.
Please come to the Board meeting on October 16th at 2:00 at the McCoart Building and speak in favor of the resolution. Also, please email the whole Board at BOCS@pwcgov.org urging the board to approve the funding for the resolution. If possible, please also call your district supervisor. Thanks. I appreciate your help. .
-Corey
Concerned,CWC, Rwildgoose,
You all bring up very interesting points. Now, is too late for the three ofyou to be write in candidates?
I have to say as “Help Save Prince William” doesn’t sound like a bad idea. There always been “the other end”(Western and Eastern for you newcomers) mentality in the county.
There does need to be an office in the County Complex that represent the legal citizens. I was the also thinking the PWCBOS, needs a spokesperson of sorts to handle some of the media attention. Our Supervisors are part time. The HRC-Immigration sub-committee, was an absolute joke and biased.
I’ve only heard back from John S, Corey, and Wally. Now, I’m still waiting on responses from 5 more. I will keep call, faxing, emailing, and even visit offices until I get responses from all. It was very clear they read bvbl, on Tuesday. There’s no excuse for not responding to their citizens even if they aren’t from their district. They represent the county as a WHOLE. I’ve spent quite few hours at the McCoart building since 6/5/07, I would at the very least would expect responses. I’m making my PWCBOS report card. I hope to here from John J, Marty, Mike M., Maureen, and yes you too Hilda.
I NEVER heard back from Hilda prior to 7/10/07, she was the only one!!! Well, she definately won’t be there next term. I’m sending my letter to Chris Royse too. Woodbridge, you need Mr. Royse!!!!
http://www.chrisroyse.com/
MOM: you would have to be “slipping to the left” if you find yourself disagreeing with me. I’m a pretty right of center type. But, hoping to prolong our summer of harmony a bit longer, I’ll concede error. I should not have used the term “fiscal conservative” to describe certain BOCS members in this context. I wasn’t really trying to make that grand a statement. What I am saying, at least on this issue, is that a few supervisors, whatever their overall predilections or philosophies, are realizing that all this hysteria has a price and that, until we find a way to levy a specialized taxed on the twenty-five commenters who keep this site hopping (and who profess to be willing to pay whatever it takes to get every illegal out of here) to cover all the extra costs, the whole county’s tax base is going to have to pick up the tab at a time when things are a little tight anyway. Funding a big county like PW is complicated stuff, especially given the tax structures that the county governments in virginia are forced to live with. The property tax is really about all you got, and it is subject to the vagaries of valuations. Suddenly the hot button issue of the moment comes along and some very insistent folks want to build duplicative enforcement structures rather than driving twenty miles to shake some sense into their congressmen. The pols fall all over themselves to oblige and they pray for a Ponce de Leon moment where they can resuscitate feeble careers by catching this wave (witness Mr. FitzSimmonds, just to name one of dozens of examples). But - and here’s the catch - this stuff costs a lot of money at a time when money isn’t exactly falling out of the sky on local governments. It is the height of fiscal irresponsiblity from charlatans who, in other circumstances, try to pass themselves off as green eye-shade, sharp pencil budget cutters.
But far worse yet, to campaign on this, a pol has to run around saying how the whole community has gone to hell (Garbage! overcrowding! street peeing! rape! murder! ID theft! DUIs! Etc! Etc!). So the pols essentially run against the community. Just a couple of years ago, PW had an image of an up and coming, booming community being transformed from a trailer park, strip mall extension of the DC exurbs into a community of its own that was changing for the better. Now I assume I couldn’t drive down Hoadley Road without running over several drunks, getting robbed, needing a translator, being groped at the 7-11 when I stop for a comfort Slurpee, and slipping on all the garbage. And no leader of Prince William is telling me that’s not the way it is. so on top of all the other problems, this rhetoric contributes to making Prince William seem less desirable, which negatively influences housing demand, which drives down property values, which lowers tax revenues.
To be sure, some of this stuff (fallout from the failed federal immigration policy) is happening, and I’m not unsympathetic to commenters here whose immediate neighborhoods have suffered real damage from non-code-compliant housing etc., but the way you deal with it is the way Giuliani dealt with decay in New York. You enforce local law. I have yet to see any compelling argument as to why the Fairfax approach, assuming its well -executed (regulate behavior, not status) isn’t the correct local response. You don’t create a new structure at unknown and unknowable cost to the taxpayors. And you sell and build your community at every turn on the best instincts of human nature, not the worst.
Lafayette (et.al.),
While I certainly appreciate the desire to get action out of our locally elected officials, I believe now is the time to exert the same pressure on our elected Federal officials. I would suggest adding Frank Wolfe (R, 10th) and Tom Davis (R, 11th) to the list. Tom Davis is particularly interesting as he would like to run for John Warner’s Senate seat and needs an issue to get face recognition outside of Northern Virginia. This would do it. Email is best as letters are slowed down by a central processing facility that checks for bio agents (Anthrax spores, etc.)
ICE is moving. Elections are coming and the Feds need to demonstrate movement on the immigration issue. They conducted very successful raids in California, Nevada, and New York. There are probably other raids planned (as, for obvious reasons, they don’t publish a schedule of raids in the Washington Post). I wouldn’t be surprised if they had something planned for our area to mitigate the national attention that we (PWC) are getting. In any case, now is the time to press for national action and Federal support for our community. Concurrent bottom up (County BOCS) and top down (Federal) is the way to go. I don’t know about the rest of you; however, my largest check goes to the Feds. I’d like to see a little more of that $$$ spent locally on our issues.
Lafayette:
In theory, a write-in campaign is a good idea. I recall that Greg mentioned that in his citizen time remarks this week. However, it would be very unlikely to succeed, especially in light of all of the money Covington, Nohe and Caddigan have access to. I suspect that if the developers thought there was a serious chance of losing one of them, especially Covington who, along with Connaughton until he left, has been their guy since voters threw Ed Wilbourn off the BOCS in 2003, they would mobilize a massive turnout and fund a two or three week campaign. We would see Wally’s face (or Marty’s or Maureen’s) all over the papers and Comcast cable, and have our mailboxes overflowing with campaign literature, extolling all of the wondrous things they have done.
Wally has done a great job of PR, such as his development “moratorium” that is already being ignored even though it doesn’t expire until December, and his asking the County to study the cost of services to illegal aliens a few months ago. His follow-up “action” to their superficial report (staff did a much better, more thorough job in response to John Stirrup’s resolution because they knew it was serious this time) was to write a nasty letter to Nancy Pelosi (Speaker of the House of Representatives) and Dick Cheney (President of the Senate) demanding reimbursement. He knew full well that nothing would happen (was quoted in the press to that effect), but that he would receive a lot of great press about his taking up the cause of the citizens (very smart). I think he, Marty and Maureen are now in a panic since John Stirrup has proposed concrete action that would actually help the citizens to the detriment of their corporate and big landowner supporters.
My guess is that Wally will be the one of the three who votes with Corey, John and Mike, knowing that Marty and Maureen will vote with Jenkins and Barg to kill the measure. His district, Brentsville, is the most heavily Republican and most likely to balk when the measure fails.
Marty and Maureen have not been as patronizing toward the citizens as Wally has been, but their votes are still important to the corporate community.
Check out www.vpap.org. There is a lot of interesting information there. Keep in mind that the massive illegal alien and overdevelopment problems we face now were rooted during the reign of Sean Connaughton. Sean has much higher political ambitions and knew to bail out of Prince William County before the **** hit the fan largely as a result of his actions as Chairman of the BOCS. Sean was the developers’ dream Chairman and has a lot of money left over, which he is already doling out in Prince William County behind the scenes (thank you to VPAP for shedding some light on this). Sean is now a Bush (Mr. Amnesty himself) appointee and would be able to mobilize financial and other forms of support to ensure that Wally, Marty and Maureen win.
Rest assured that a great deal of money is riding on the outcome of this. Most of that money is concentrated in the hands of those who stand to gain from having continued access to cheap illegal labor, and from controlling the comprehensive plan amendment and rezoning processes. They won’t sit idly by if they think that a write-in candidate has even a remote chance of winning.
I’m not completely pessimistic. I’ve posted so much in this thread hoping that the Supervisors are reading it. I want them to know that we know what is going on and to think about the people who originally elected them to office. It’s discouraging when we see them take so much money from special interests and then not act in our best interests. However, I’m holding out some hope that they will let their consciences guide them.
Wally, Marty and Maureen - please prove what I’ve written in this thread wrong. If all of you join with Corey, John and Mike (no games to ensure the measure fails) we can send a statement that Prince William County does act in the best interests of its citizens. Please vote on our behalf and make what I’ve posted wrong! I would be delighted to post on BVBL after the vote thanking you for looking after our interests (and I will).
Concerned:
Are you my long lost twin? I thought I was the only one who saw through Wally, or at least the only one to say so.
BTW, check out the DAPS schedule for all the rezonings in his disrict that have been postponed until just after the election, some food for thought.
Mom
Mom:
No fair - I was feeling a little better and had a glimmer of hope, and then you reminded me of that. For those who are not aware of the DAPS schedule, please see
http://www.pwcgov.org/default.aspx?topic=040035001160002351
Note that some indicate dates since the last activity. That does not mean that the projects have been pulled, just that the developers are sitting on them until after the election.
The map is particulary illustrative of what Wally has planned for us after the election. Check out the concentration of pending development projects in the Brentsville District:
http://www.pwcgov.org/docLibrary/PDF/002880.pdf
Are we going to need perhaps some cheap labor to build all of these projects? Maybe a new job boom for illegals? Don’t get your hopes up that the overcrowding in your neighborhoods is easing until you see what is going to happen when this building schedule takes off.
I’m sure none of us object to more crowding in our schools, higher taxes for social services for illegals, and waiting in line at the emergency room behind illegals using it as a free clinic. We certainly don’t want to deprive the developers of the cheap labor they are going to need for all of these projects.
All,
Retiredwildgoose’s posts are well thought out and make very strong points!
Re-read them!
Concerned:
You are right about Mr. Covington, but we can make him squirm and force him over to our side, even if it is kicking and screaming. I’m quite sure Wally wants to run for another office,so he won’t want to enrage Brentsville voters. He also wants to seem like he is working with Stewart.
However, Nohe has no problem being the odd ball and going against Stewart. Little Napolean Nohe holds no allegiance to the Republican party or the people of Coles. He thinks he knows better than his constituents, and with his hands tucked so deeply inside the developer’s pockets, he almost wets himself with ways to make them happy. Caddigan is still furious at Stewart and goes out of her way to do the opposite of what Stewart proposes just because she’s pissed.
I think the best plan would be to have Dumfries constituents to put the strong arm on Caddigan. Although Nohe has no qualms about screwing his constituents, Caddigan does listen (to her own Dumfries constituents, not the rest of the county). If there are enough people in Dumfries that pressure her, I think she might fold and go with Wally and the Stewart/Stirrup/May bunch. Although she does get developer money, she has a heart for her people and I think she is the link that could be broken. She also likes Wally and if he is on Stewart’s side, that might be enough for her to stomach it. Incidentally, she was the supervisor who was so outspoken at the July resolution press conference. She was very clear that the board was doing the right thing….what happened between July and now??
So email anyone you know in Dumfries and get them to write her. She won’t listen to the rest of us, but she’ll never ignore one of her own. Then email everyone you know in Brentsville and tell them to put the thumb screws on Wally to make sure he doesn’t fold.
Anonamouse:
I agree with you about Maureen. She is the most likely to be persuaded on the basis of doing what’s right for her constituents. She’s also taken the least amount of contributions this year of the three, although I still don’t understand why she accepts all of that money when she’s unopposed. I’ve known of occasions when people contacted her on issues, and she listened and responded. Also, as you wrote, she was very outspoken in favor of the Stirrup resolution the evening it passed. She seems also to have a better voting record than Wally or Marty. I’ve heard the same things about her and Corey not getting along but am not well-enough connected to know how serious that is. I would like to think that she has enough integrity to vote her conscience rather than the other way just to screw Corey. We need to ensure that her constituents make very clear to her that we don’t want her to go astray.
If Maureen votes with Corey, John and Mike we need only one more vote. Will Wally and/or Marty defy their corporate/developer contributors to provide that support?
I’ve got a response back today from candidate Chris Royse, and it was NOT some form letter BS either. Thank you Chris!!
I spoke with Maureen on the phone before the vote 7/10/07, and she’s very aware of the effects of the illegals aliens. I really hope to hear back from her and others.
I grew up going to church in Brentsville, and I mean the town not the district. There are many people out there that are PWC natives, and they are not pleased that they don’t have a choice this election. The Brentsville district is NOT just Nokesville folks, it actually includes Brentsville. This was once the county seat.The courthouse has recently been renovated along with a one room school house. There’s a jail there too, not yet renovated. Wally, immigration is most pressing issue, not Route 28.
The Supervisors voted yes unanimously on7/10/07, for them to not vote for implementation. Will really make them look like FOOLS. The nation has been watching us, and they will continue to do so. We’re leading the way at this point. PWCBOS, I know you read the blog, and this one is just for you all. I hope you’rE listening to what the legal voting citizens are asking of you. We are merely asking you to act our best interest. Voting no will make it crystal clear that you don’t care about the legal citizens in my book at least. I would venture to say there are a few more that might agree.
For you Supervisors that love that developer money,
Dollars are NOT votes!!! Do you think the citizens want you to be so hungry for the developers’ $$$? From what I hear these are the enablers that encouraged illegals to come to our community in the first place. What happened to that questionable “mortorium” on new development?
We all knew Wally’s “bill” to Dick and Nancy was meant as a symbolic gesture. We thought his position on illegals was real. Was the vote on 7/10/07 symbolic too? Please, prove it wasn’t, and vote YES for the implementation of the resolution!!!
You are welcome Lafayette.
anonamouse vented: “However, Nohe has no problem being the odd ball and going against Stewart. Little Napolean Nohe holds no allegiance to the Republican party or the people of Coles. He thinks he knows better than his constituents, and with his hands tucked so deeply inside the developer’s pockets, he almost wets himself with ways to make them happy.”
That was a direct slam against my elected supervisor….and I couldn’t agree with you more!!!!
Marty! You’re readin’ this. Get with the [legal] program!
Has anybody considered that the so-called State budget shortfall is just as non-existent as the previous “shortfall” that turned out to be, if memory serves, a $1.2 Billion (or was it 1.4?) surplus? Would it really be surprising for Kaine to take a page out of Warner’s book…particularly in areas where it would negatively affect the local 287g programs, to which he is adamantly opposed?
The good Republicans will stand up to this nonsense and fiscal irresponsibility. I know Stewart probably doesn’t believe this stuff and is just hustling for votes, but if he really believes that good fiscal stewardship includes buying in to these status-weighted local programs on 2I, he’s no Republican. If Nohe’s oppostion (if that’s what it is) is based on concern on what this will do to the finances of the County, and at least a high school level appreciation of who’s got the duty on immigration enforcement, he’s a mainstream Republican. I’ve always felt that a lot of this local status enforcement enthusiasm is a very liberal, non-federalist, surely Democratic type approach. If a lot of people who like to call themselves Republicans are buying into it, they should switch parties, go back to school, or practice balancing their checkbooks.
AW, that’s exactly what is going on. Now, what can we do to get people to do the right thing?
Tom Davis has a terrible record regarding illegal immigration. He has no intention of solving anything. I received quite a few e-mails from him that clearly shows he is NOT serious about it.
I don’t know Legal2. Last time even someone as astute, albeit trusting, as Harry Parrish bought into the lie that Virginia’s financial health was at stake. Of course, I seriously doubt that Kaine is quite as good a spinmeister as Warner was and perhaps the truth of it can be ferreted out by someone astute enough among our elected officials (that would be worth quite a few votes…catching Kaine in a whopper which was going to affect public safety funds). Perhaps the possibility of error should be broached by our local representatives with the state government, citing the previous HUGE error as precedent. Just a thought.
The entire country is continuing to look to Prince William County to lead the way in dealing with illegal immigration (in a legal and measured way) - SUPERVISORS, DO THE RIGHT THING. PROVE THAT YOU ARE PEOPLE OF YOUR WORD. NO EXCUSES!! http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=21703
http://www.smalltowndefenders.com/public/
This is about ILLEGAL!
Legal2,
There have been a few of us reminding the PWCBOS that the nation is watching us. I sure hope they’ve been listening and reading what ther legal voting citizens want.
All,
We MUST continue to call, email, fax all Supervisors! Please, tell everyone one you know to contact the PWCBOS.
http://www.pwcgov.org/default.aspx?topic=040016
To pwcgov.org
In response to this issue. Should illeagle allians receive benifits
thru our gov.
My vote is no.
In my oppinion, we need to take care of our elderly citizens
before we give out money to illeagles.
I have found out that alot of elderly people that are on medications can not afford to buy their perscriptions. If they
buy their medications that week they can not buy groceries.
We need to help our elderly not illeagles.
And NO they should not be able to vote unless they are
leagle citizens.