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	<title>Comments on: A Local Outrage Draws Attention</title>
	<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/</link>
	<description>Blog-Fu for Prince William, Manassas and Manassas Park politics.</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 13 Feb 2012 16:22:47 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.3</generator>

	<item>
		<title>By: redawn</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-38400</link>
		<dc:creator>redawn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Nov 2007 23:07:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-38400</guid>
		<description>Anonymous,
Do you know what other charges, name, etc.? Thanks for the update</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anonymous,<br />
Do you know what other charges, name, etc.? Thanks for the update</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35962</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Oct 2007 14:19:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35962</guid>
		<description>Update on Alleghany Rd. Rape Case 
    Police have a suspect in custody, on an unrelated charge.  That's about all they can say.  They are waiting for some test results, that may take awhile
because of the back up at the labs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Update on Alleghany Rd. Rape Case<br />
    Police have a suspect in custody, on an unrelated charge.  That&#8217;s about all they can say.  They are waiting for some test results, that may take awhile<br />
because of the back up at the labs.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Michael</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35895</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Oct 2007 02:56:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35895</guid>
		<description>Funny thing about IQs, they are highly individualistic, with an extremly broad statistical spread.  Many claim you cannot group them by racial, gender, religious or ethnic groups or to prove anything with averages, even though those averages show differences. I agree we should NEVER look at the averages even if they are different. Far better to be against (or with some of you: for) stupidity, but then you need to only look at the individual to see how broad that is.  I prefer to look at basic ability, skillls, and talent in a multitude of ways of measuring IQ, and trying to recognize intelligence in many areas even if it is not in all areas.  I just don't like it when one gender, racial group, ethnic group or religious group is given special intelligence compensating privileges to benefit that group, while banning some other group (gender, ethnic, racial, religious) from the same privileges, and not considering ONLY ability and skills for those privileges and opportunities.  I think that is what is fundamentally wrong with the diversity, inclusion and multi-culturalism concepts.  These concepts are facist ways of getting special privileges for a GROUP which would not normally deserve it unless it was ONLY based on each individual's unique abilities. This is why I am against such concepts, being just as wrong as facist white supremist advocacy for special educational and business privileges just for that group as a priviliged matter enforced by law. Diversity, inclusion and multi-culturalism legal privileges and favoritism is just another way of saying the same illegal concept to benefit groups. It discrimminates against individuals.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Funny thing about IQs, they are highly individualistic, with an extremly broad statistical spread.  Many claim you cannot group them by racial, gender, religious or ethnic groups or to prove anything with averages, even though those averages show differences. I agree we should NEVER look at the averages even if they are different. Far better to be against (or with some of you: for) stupidity, but then you need to only look at the individual to see how broad that is.  I prefer to look at basic ability, skillls, and talent in a multitude of ways of measuring IQ, and trying to recognize intelligence in many areas even if it is not in all areas.  I just don&#8217;t like it when one gender, racial group, ethnic group or religious group is given special intelligence compensating privileges to benefit that group, while banning some other group (gender, ethnic, racial, religious) from the same privileges, and not considering ONLY ability and skills for those privileges and opportunities.  I think that is what is fundamentally wrong with the diversity, inclusion and multi-culturalism concepts.  These concepts are facist ways of getting special privileges for a GROUP which would not normally deserve it unless it was ONLY based on each individual&#8217;s unique abilities. This is why I am against such concepts, being just as wrong as facist white supremist advocacy for special educational and business privileges just for that group as a priviliged matter enforced by law. Diversity, inclusion and multi-culturalism legal privileges and favoritism is just another way of saying the same illegal concept to benefit groups. It discrimminates against individuals.</p>
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		<title>By: ateacher</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35854</link>
		<dc:creator>ateacher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Oct 2007 00:02:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35854</guid>
		<description>No stripes or anything on the truck.  No logo either unless it was magnetic.  I saw none. I'm not the make and model pro that my husband is, but I was able to discern that it was a 2-door, Ford pick-up, bumble bee yellow.  It was rounder with black in the body curve where the wheels are.  Does that make sense?  My daughter has asked her friend to send the picture, my husband said if he looks at it he may be able to figure out the year.  I will try to upload the photo.  It is however a front end photo, and license plate is not easily readable.  Had I had my wits about me I might have thought to follow and get the plate numbers.  But alas, I did not.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No stripes or anything on the truck.  No logo either unless it was magnetic.  I saw none. I&#8217;m not the make and model pro that my husband is, but I was able to discern that it was a 2-door, Ford pick-up, bumble bee yellow.  It was rounder with black in the body curve where the wheels are.  Does that make sense?  My daughter has asked her friend to send the picture, my husband said if he looks at it he may be able to figure out the year.  I will try to upload the photo.  It is however a front end photo, and license plate is not easily readable.  Had I had my wits about me I might have thought to follow and get the plate numbers.  But alas, I did not.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35662</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Oct 2007 13:00:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35662</guid>
		<description>Where are the flyers with the composite picture?  What is the latest on what is going on?    Looks like this story ended abruptly for some reason.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Where are the flyers with the composite picture?  What is the latest on what is going on?    Looks like this story ended abruptly for some reason.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: APB</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35623</link>
		<dc:creator>APB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Oct 2007 02:22:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35623</guid>
		<description>A commenter spoke of a yellow truck above, I have never seen it on move, always parked.
Can you tell us more as to the year, big, small etc.? I have another truck in my vision that had black stripes, from the hood, etc..rounder, newer....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A commenter spoke of a yellow truck above, I have never seen it on move, always parked.<br />
Can you tell us more as to the year, big, small etc.? I have another truck in my vision that had black stripes, from the hood, etc..rounder, newer&#8230;.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: ateacher</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35613</link>
		<dc:creator>ateacher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Oct 2007 01:06:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35613</guid>
		<description>I did report the incident to the non-emergency number, and an officer arrive in less than an hour to take the report.  Both girls were very descriptive when describing what happened:  Walking home from Sudley Elem, the truck with two Hispanic males pulled over.  The passenger opened his door, winked and gestured for them to get in.  The girls ran in the opposite direction, hid in the shrubs nearby, and witnessed the truck drive by "at least five times".  They called me, I drove to get them and I too witnessed the same truck.  My daughter's friend took a picture of the truck with her cell phone. Not a clear photo of the license plate however.  The cop I must say was at first, in my opinion kinda blowing them off, but after seeing the photo, and hearing what they had to say he seemed a bit more interested.  He did tell them that in the future when something like this occurs, they should call 911, and then call a parent.  He made a report with a report number.  I told him that it was important that we make a report should similar occurences happen in the future to others, and he agreed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I did report the incident to the non-emergency number, and an officer arrive in less than an hour to take the report.  Both girls were very descriptive when describing what happened:  Walking home from Sudley Elem, the truck with two Hispanic males pulled over.  The passenger opened his door, winked and gestured for them to get in.  The girls ran in the opposite direction, hid in the shrubs nearby, and witnessed the truck drive by &#8220;at least five times&#8221;.  They called me, I drove to get them and I too witnessed the same truck.  My daughter&#8217;s friend took a picture of the truck with her cell phone. Not a clear photo of the license plate however.  The cop I must say was at first, in my opinion kinda blowing them off, but after seeing the photo, and hearing what they had to say he seemed a bit more interested.  He did tell them that in the future when something like this occurs, they should call 911, and then call a parent.  He made a report with a report number.  I told him that it was important that we make a report should similar occurences happen in the future to others, and he agreed.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35388</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 21:12:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35388</guid>
		<description>Doesnt sound like the same truck, but theres a huge F-350 bumblebee yellow truck near me thats a contractor truck, but its 4 door and has writing on it. Its also jacked up on a lift kit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doesnt sound like the same truck, but theres a huge F-350 bumblebee yellow truck near me thats a contractor truck, but its 4 door and has writing on it. Its also jacked up on a lift kit.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: anon</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35373</link>
		<dc:creator>anon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 17:01:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35373</guid>
		<description>http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071028/ap_on_re_us/halloween_ap_poll;_ylt=AmmVvC8HIIhtpkPI8RfvGCV34T0D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071028/ap_on_re_us/halloween_ap_poll;_ylt=AmmVvC8HIIhtpkPI8RfvGCV34T0D" rel="nofollow">http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071028/ap_on_re_us/halloween_ap_poll;_ylt=AmmVvC8HIIhtpkPI8RfvGCV34T0D</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Lafayette</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35371</link>
		<dc:creator>Lafayette</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 16:29:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35371</guid>
		<description>Around the corner,
Thanks for the information. The Park is just a quick walk. There was ID ring that got busted late spring or early summer at Global Mart on Portsmouth Dr. by The NoVa Regional Gang Task Force. They swarmed the place, we saw an American girl get arrested and the paper gave her name. There are plenty of illegal alien lovers amongst us. This is disgusting. 
New slogan for Virginia...
Virginia is for Lovers of the Rule of Law!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Around the corner,<br />
Thanks for the information. The Park is just a quick walk. There was ID ring that got busted late spring or early summer at Global Mart on Portsmouth Dr. by The NoVa Regional Gang Task Force. They swarmed the place, we saw an American girl get arrested and the paper gave her name. There are plenty of illegal alien lovers amongst us. This is disgusting.<br />
New slogan for Virginia&#8230;<br />
Virginia is for Lovers of the Rule of Law!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Around the corner</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35369</link>
		<dc:creator>Around the corner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 16:26:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35369</guid>
		<description>Virginia State Police Missing Children List

look at how many are just in our area

http://www.vsp.state.va.us/MissingChildren.shtm

Also with Halloween approaching, here is the sex offender data base to search ( KNOW offenders)

http://sex-offender.vsp.virginia.gov/sor/html/search.htm</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Virginia State Police Missing Children List</p>
<p>look at how many are just in our area</p>
<p><a href="http://www.vsp.state.va.us/MissingChildren.shtm" rel="nofollow">http://www.vsp.state.va.us/MissingChildren.shtm</a></p>
<p>Also with Halloween approaching, here is the sex offender data base to search ( KNOW offenders)</p>
<p><a href="http://sex-offender.vsp.virginia.gov/sor/html/search.htm" rel="nofollow">http://sex-offender.vsp.virginia.gov/sor/html/search.htm</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Around the corner</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35366</link>
		<dc:creator>Around the corner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 15:58:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35366</guid>
		<description>Date of Release: 102307  

Type of Offense:  Forge Public Document

Dates of Occurrence: 102107 1003

Location:  200 Block Manassas Drive

Vehicles Involved:  2001 Chevrolet Impala

Suspects:  

Arrests: Olvin Daneris Rivas Guzman, 23, 123 Forrest Street, Manassas Park

Mr. Rivas Guzman was stopped for traffic violations.  Investigation revealed that Mr. Rivas Guzman had provided false information about his identity to the officer and had signed this false name on the two traffic summonses.  He was arrested, charged with two counts of forging public documents, providing false identification to a police officer, driving on a suspended operators license, and not seat belting a child, brought to the ADC, and held on $7,000 bond.  Court date--120607.  In addition, Mr. Rivas Guzman was wanted in Stafford County for failure to appear in court and was held without bond on that charge.



http://manassasparkpolice.com/press_release.htm</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Date of Release: 102307  </p>
<p>Type of Offense:  Forge Public Document</p>
<p>Dates of Occurrence: 102107 1003</p>
<p>Location:  200 Block Manassas Drive</p>
<p>Vehicles Involved:  2001 Chevrolet Impala</p>
<p>Suspects:  </p>
<p>Arrests: Olvin Daneris Rivas Guzman, 23, 123 Forrest Street, Manassas Park</p>
<p>Mr. Rivas Guzman was stopped for traffic violations.  Investigation revealed that Mr. Rivas Guzman had provided false information about his identity to the officer and had signed this false name on the two traffic summonses.  He was arrested, charged with two counts of forging public documents, providing false identification to a police officer, driving on a suspended operators license, and not seat belting a child, brought to the ADC, and held on $7,000 bond.  Court date&#8211;120607.  In addition, Mr. Rivas Guzman was wanted in Stafford County for failure to appear in court and was held without bond on that charge.</p>
<p><a href="http://manassasparkpolice.com/press_release.htm" rel="nofollow">http://manassasparkpolice.com/press_release.htm</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Lafayette</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35339</link>
		<dc:creator>Lafayette</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 06:12:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35339</guid>
		<description>Gone Fishing,
corr: No Child Id Program at Fair. Hmm.
What's next?-lol</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gone Fishing,<br />
corr: No Child Id Program at Fair. Hmm.<br />
What&#8217;s next?-lol</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Lafayette</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35335</link>
		<dc:creator>Lafayette</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 04:27:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35335</guid>
		<description>Gone Fishing,
I knew it get you fired up! I found so many lies in the article it's not even funny. I love the part about security updrades, and then there's the Child ID program. The Sheriff's Office, used to be at the Fair where your child could be fingerprinted right  on the spot. I have noticed this at the fair the last few years. Hmmm. More to come. I hope others to notice and read too.
ateacher,
Yellow Ford pickup is on my radar. These guys must be found. Did you report this to PWPD?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gone Fishing,<br />
I knew it get you fired up! I found so many lies in the article it&#8217;s not even funny. I love the part about security updrades, and then there&#8217;s the Child ID program. The Sheriff&#8217;s Office, used to be at the Fair where your child could be fingerprinted right  on the spot. I have noticed this at the fair the last few years. Hmmm. More to come. I hope others to notice and read too.<br />
ateacher,<br />
Yellow Ford pickup is on my radar. These guys must be found. Did you report this to PWPD?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Gone Fishing</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35316</link>
		<dc:creator>Gone Fishing</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 00:24:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35316</guid>
		<description>Lafayette,  I did see the article on the front page w/the photos
and lol when reading Hill's remark that "the incident is not
indicative of the performance of the SO"  Oh, I think so!  There
are so many incidents that we never hear about because the
police are not involved, but they happen with regularity.  He
needs four more years to accomplish changes such as security
and to provide support to local law enforcement agencies....
Is he kidding??  What a hypocrite!  Isn't that what started the
turf wars between the former sheriff and Charlie?  Truth be
told, he probably needs four more years to perfect his golf game at the taxpayers expense.
Lafayette, now see what you've done?  Got  me all fired up!

ateacher, a yellow Ford pickup truck shouldn't be too difficult to spot, somebody will see it and turn them in for sure.  I hope to
God it happens soon!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lafayette,  I did see the article on the front page w/the photos<br />
and lol when reading Hill&#8217;s remark that &#8220;the incident is not<br />
indicative of the performance of the SO&#8221;  Oh, I think so!  There<br />
are so many incidents that we never hear about because the<br />
police are not involved, but they happen with regularity.  He<br />
needs four more years to accomplish changes such as security<br />
and to provide support to local law enforcement agencies&#8230;.<br />
Is he kidding??  What a hypocrite!  Isn&#8217;t that what started the<br />
turf wars between the former sheriff and Charlie?  Truth be<br />
told, he probably needs four more years to perfect his golf game at the taxpayers expense.<br />
Lafayette, now see what you&#8217;ve done?  Got  me all fired up!</p>
<p>ateacher, a yellow Ford pickup truck shouldn&#8217;t be too difficult to spot, somebody will see it and turn them in for sure.  I hope to<br />
God it happens soon!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Dolph</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35313</link>
		<dc:creator>Dolph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:54:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35313</guid>
		<description>Madmom,

I answered your email about 8:30 this morning.  It is from an email address different than the one you sent it to.  Leave me an email if you did not get it.

ateacher,

You do need to call the non emergency police number and let them know what happened today.  Red flags are going off all over the place.  We will all keep an eye out for the bumble bee pick up.  Hopefully someone can get a license number.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Madmom,</p>
<p>I answered your email about 8:30 this morning.  It is from an email address different than the one you sent it to.  Leave me an email if you did not get it.</p>
<p>ateacher,</p>
<p>You do need to call the non emergency police number and let them know what happened today.  Red flags are going off all over the place.  We will all keep an eye out for the bumble bee pick up.  Hopefully someone can get a license number.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35312</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:01:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35312</guid>
		<description>ateacher  on 27 Oct 2007 at 6:18 pm:

Hope you filed a police report and provided a description of the vehicle.   Don't imagine there are too many yellow Ford pickups in this area.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ateacher  on 27 Oct 2007 at 6:18 pm:</p>
<p>Hope you filed a police report and provided a description of the vehicle.   Don&#8217;t imagine there are too many yellow Ford pickups in this area.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: obit</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35311</link>
		<dc:creator>obit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:51:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35311</guid>
		<description>stick a fork in it, America is done</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>stick a fork in it, America is done</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35310</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:44:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35310</guid>
		<description>Spitzer caves!

Newsday.com
Homeland Security strikes deal with New York on driver's licenses
By DEVLIN BARRETT

Associated Press Writer

3:17 PM EDT, October 27, 2007

WASHINGTON

The Bush administration and New York cut a deal Saturday to create a new generation of super-secure driver's licenses for U.S. citizens, but also allow illegal immigrants to get a version. 

New York is the fourth state to reach such an agreement on federally approved secure licenses, after Arizona, Vermont and Washington. The issue is pressing for border states, where new and tighter rules are soon to go into effect for crossings. 

The deal comes about one month after New York Gov. Eliot Spitzer announced a plan whereby illegal immigrants with a valid foreign passport could obtain a license. 

Saturday's agreement with the Homeland Security Department will create a three-tier license system in New York. It is the largest state to sign on so far to the government's post-Sept. 11 effort to make identification cards more secure. 

Spitzer, who has faced much criticism on the issue, said the deal means New York "will usher in the most secure licensing system in the nation." 

Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff said he was not happy that New York intended to issue IDs to illegal immigrants. But he said there was nothing he could do to stop it. 

"I don't endorse giving licenses to people who are not here legally, but federal law does allow states to make that choice," Chertoff said. 

"It's going to be a big deal up in Buffalo, it's going to be a big deal on the Canadian side of the border," Chertoff said. 

The governor made clear he is going forward with his plan allowing licenses for illegal immigrants. But advocates on both sides of the debate said Spitzer had caved to pressure by adopting the administration's stance on tighter security standards for most driver's licenses. 

GOP Rep. Thomas Reynolds, who represents the Buffalo suburbs, said he was glad Washington had heeded his concerns about border identification. But he said he feared that Spitzer "is taking this state down a risky path" by giving any kind of license to illegal immigrants. 

Under the compromise, New York will produce an "enhanced driver's license" that will be as secure as a passport. It is intended for people who soon will need to meet such ID requirements, even for a short drive to Canada. 

A second version of the license will meet new federal standards of the Real ID Act. That law is designed to make it much harder for illegal immigrants or would-be terrorists to obtain licenses. 

A third type of license will be available to undocumented immigrants. Spitzer has said this ID will make the state more secure by bringing those people "out of the shadows" and into American society, and will lower auto insurance rates. 

Those licenses will be clearly marked to show they are not valid federal ID. Officials, however, would not say whether that meant local law enforcement could use such a license as probable cause to detain someone they suspected of being in the U.S. illegally. 

"Besides being a massive defeat for the governor, I can't imagine many _ if any _ illegal immigrants coming forward to get the driver's licenses, because they'd basically be labeled as illegal," said New York Rep. Peter King, the top Republican on the House Homeland Security Committee. 

New York has between 500,000 and 1 million undocumented immigrants, many of whom are driving without a license and car insurance or with fake driver's licenses, Spitzer said in September when he announced his executive order. 

The administration has not finalized standards for Real ID-compliant driver's licenses. Spitzer said he believed the new licenses would meet those standards or come very close. 

Many states say it is too expensive to comply with the law; seven of them have passed legislation opposing Real ID. Neither the governor nor Chertoff would say how much it would cost to put the system in place or who would pay for it. 

Donna Lieberman, executive director of the New York Civil Liberties, said Spitzer's move effectively revives a faltering ID program. "The governor's stunning lack of courage is aiding the Bush administration in clamping down on civil liberties," Lieberman said.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Spitzer caves!</p>
<p>Newsday.com<br />
Homeland Security strikes deal with New York on driver&#8217;s licenses<br />
By DEVLIN BARRETT</p>
<p>Associated Press Writer</p>
<p>3:17 PM EDT, October 27, 2007</p>
<p>WASHINGTON</p>
<p>The Bush administration and New York cut a deal Saturday to create a new generation of super-secure driver&#8217;s licenses for U.S. citizens, but also allow illegal immigrants to get a version. </p>
<p>New York is the fourth state to reach such an agreement on federally approved secure licenses, after Arizona, Vermont and Washington. The issue is pressing for border states, where new and tighter rules are soon to go into effect for crossings. </p>
<p>The deal comes about one month after New York Gov. Eliot Spitzer announced a plan whereby illegal immigrants with a valid foreign passport could obtain a license. </p>
<p>Saturday&#8217;s agreement with the Homeland Security Department will create a three-tier license system in New York. It is the largest state to sign on so far to the government&#8217;s post-Sept. 11 effort to make identification cards more secure. </p>
<p>Spitzer, who has faced much criticism on the issue, said the deal means New York &#8220;will usher in the most secure licensing system in the nation.&#8221; </p>
<p>Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff said he was not happy that New York intended to issue IDs to illegal immigrants. But he said there was nothing he could do to stop it. </p>
<p>&#8220;I don&#8217;t endorse giving licenses to people who are not here legally, but federal law does allow states to make that choice,&#8221; Chertoff said. </p>
<p>&#8220;It&#8217;s going to be a big deal up in Buffalo, it&#8217;s going to be a big deal on the Canadian side of the border,&#8221; Chertoff said. </p>
<p>The governor made clear he is going forward with his plan allowing licenses for illegal immigrants. But advocates on both sides of the debate said Spitzer had caved to pressure by adopting the administration&#8217;s stance on tighter security standards for most driver&#8217;s licenses. </p>
<p>GOP Rep. Thomas Reynolds, who represents the Buffalo suburbs, said he was glad Washington had heeded his concerns about border identification. But he said he feared that Spitzer &#8220;is taking this state down a risky path&#8221; by giving any kind of license to illegal immigrants. </p>
<p>Under the compromise, New York will produce an &#8220;enhanced driver&#8217;s license&#8221; that will be as secure as a passport. It is intended for people who soon will need to meet such ID requirements, even for a short drive to Canada. </p>
<p>A second version of the license will meet new federal standards of the Real ID Act. That law is designed to make it much harder for illegal immigrants or would-be terrorists to obtain licenses. </p>
<p>A third type of license will be available to undocumented immigrants. Spitzer has said this ID will make the state more secure by bringing those people &#8220;out of the shadows&#8221; and into American society, and will lower auto insurance rates. </p>
<p>Those licenses will be clearly marked to show they are not valid federal ID. Officials, however, would not say whether that meant local law enforcement could use such a license as probable cause to detain someone they suspected of being in the U.S. illegally. </p>
<p>&#8220;Besides being a massive defeat for the governor, I can&#8217;t imagine many _ if any _ illegal immigrants coming forward to get the driver&#8217;s licenses, because they&#8217;d basically be labeled as illegal,&#8221; said New York Rep. Peter King, the top Republican on the House Homeland Security Committee. </p>
<p>New York has between 500,000 and 1 million undocumented immigrants, many of whom are driving without a license and car insurance or with fake driver&#8217;s licenses, Spitzer said in September when he announced his executive order. </p>
<p>The administration has not finalized standards for Real ID-compliant driver&#8217;s licenses. Spitzer said he believed the new licenses would meet those standards or come very close. </p>
<p>Many states say it is too expensive to comply with the law; seven of them have passed legislation opposing Real ID. Neither the governor nor Chertoff would say how much it would cost to put the system in place or who would pay for it. </p>
<p>Donna Lieberman, executive director of the New York Civil Liberties, said Spitzer&#8217;s move effectively revives a faltering ID program. &#8220;The governor&#8217;s stunning lack of courage is aiding the Bush administration in clamping down on civil liberties,&#8221; Lieberman said.</p>
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		<title>By: ateacher</title>
		<link>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35304</link>
		<dc:creator>ateacher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:18:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2007/10/25/a-local-outrage-draws-attention/#comment-35304</guid>
		<description>Today my daughter and her friend, both 13 walked up to Sudley Elem a mere .5 miles from my house.  I suddenly got a panicked phone call from my daughter..."Come get us!  We are being followed by men in a truck!"  I immediately drove to Sudley.  As I approached the school, I noticed a truck with two men making a u-turn in the parking lot of the church next door to Sudley.  I actually thought nothing of this until as I drove by Sudley my daughter and her friend flew out of of a bush jumped into the car and yelled "Those are the guys!" They referred to the truck behind me.  Apparently my daughter and her friend were walking down Copleland toward my home when the truck pulled up and the passenger opened the door, winked and gestured for them to get in.  The girls ran in the opposite direction and the two men in the truck turned to follow them.  My daughter said she and her friend hid in a bush, and they observed that "truck kept driving up and down".  Unfortunately, I did not get the license plate, but I do know that it was a 2 door ford pick up in bumble bee  yellow. I got out of my car and approached them but they skidded off across Sudley Manor into the West Gate subdivision.

[Ed note: That is my church you're referring to, around the corner from my house.  There WILL be eyes out there for this one.  I'll let you know what turns up.]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Today my daughter and her friend, both 13 walked up to Sudley Elem a mere .5 miles from my house.  I suddenly got a panicked phone call from my daughter&#8230;&#8221;Come get us!  We are being followed by men in a truck!&#8221;  I immediately drove to Sudley.  As I approached the school, I noticed a truck with two men making a u-turn in the parking lot of the church next door to Sudley.  I actually thought nothing of this until as I drove by Sudley my daughter and her friend flew out of of a bush jumped into the car and yelled &#8220;Those are the guys!&#8221; They referred to the truck behind me.  Apparently my daughter and her friend were walking down Copleland toward my home when the truck pulled up and the passenger opened the door, winked and gestured for them to get in.  The girls ran in the opposite direction and the two men in the truck turned to follow them.  My daughter said she and her friend hid in a bush, and they observed that &#8220;truck kept driving up and down&#8221;.  Unfortunately, I did not get the license plate, but I do know that it was a 2 door ford pick up in bumble bee  yellow. I got out of my car and approached them but they skidded off across Sudley Manor into the West Gate subdivision.</p>
<p>[Ed note: That is my church you&#8217;re referring to, around the corner from my house.  There WILL be eyes out there for this one.  I&#8217;ll let you know what turns up.]</p>
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