"We have lost our ambition, our imagination, and our willingness to do the things that built the Golden Gate Bridge" - Barack Obama (aka President Malaise)
Open Thread
By Greg L | 4 November 2007 | Uncategorized | 112 Comments
Due to a death in the family, I’m going to be unavailable for a while. I hear there’s a good article about HSM in today’s Washington Post, and there’s plenty going on during the last push towards election day, so have at it.
Bring a few extra voters to the polls for me.
The opinions expressed here are solely the views of the author, and not representative of the position of any organization, political party, doughnut shop, knitting guild, or waste recycling facility, but may be correctly attributed to the Vast Right-Wing Conspiracy. If anything in the above article has offended you, please click here to receive an immediate apology.
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This is the link (might need a logonid and password).
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/03/AR2007110301075.html?sub=new
Imagine that! The BOS is actually voting the reflect the will of the
people and not that of foreigners and illegal aliens. Who would
have ever thought. It looks like the editorial staff of the Washington
Post was unable to change the votes either. Will wonders never cease?
Greg. sorry to learn of the death in your family. God be with
you and yours.
May God comfort you during this difficult time.
Greg, a prayer has been sent brother!
The article is great. Shows how strong..and fast people can get involved in the issue. Keep it up everyone and if you can, contribute to the county’s legal defense..Small dollars mean big support.
A couple snippets from another Washington Post article that appeared today:
“At this stage, three issues dominate the electoral landscape, with the war in Iraq at the top of the list. Nearly half of all adults, 45 percent, cited Iraq as the most or second-most important issue in their choice for president. About three in 10 cited the economy and jobs (29 percent) or health care (27 percent). All other issues are in the single digits.”
“While 12 percent of Republicans and 10 percent of independents cited immigration as one of the top two issues, it was highlighted by 3 percent of Democrats. Terrorism is also a more prominent concern among Republicans; 17 percent put it in their top two, while 3 percent of Democrats did the same. ”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/03/AR2007110301306_2.html?hpid=topnews
Greg,
Our prayers are with you and your family.
Did you notice the article in the Post said that one reason that illegals who are choosing not to leave is because of Prince William’s schools. No wonder. At the elementary level we are spending over $3,000. EXTRA per ESOL student. Not to mention the free breakfast and free lunch. And, if any child lacks school supplies they will also be provided. I don’t wish to “take it out on the children,” but we certainly make it inviting to be here. They have the large families and we take care of them.
Actually, illegal immigration is the nation’s #1 issue. The mainstream media don’t like to tell it like it really is.
If “incentives” are not cut off….this problem will not go away! We must cut off all incentives!
A June poll taken in Prince William County found that only 3.2% of our citizens thought that illegal immigration was the issue they most wanted addressed.
I wonder why it got so critical in July?
Greg,
You and your family are in our thoughts and prayers. May G-d comfort you along with all mourners, and may the memory of your deceased family member be for a blessing.
Peace, right! I guess that is why the WHOLE country called our Senators to stop the Amnesty bill that was flying around in July right???
I think the mainstream media has not taken the time to investigate the impact of the issue beyond politics, and international policies. In another thread where I had some discussions with Lafayette, I told her that if it were not for this blog site and people like her and Redawn, and others, I might still think that this is a federal issue.
Reading the concerns and situations of folks on this blog and then actually driving around the neighborhoods mentioned opened my eyes not to the policy and social issues or the international issues but to the DAY to DAY issues. Reading makes me listen better.
So many people, me included, cannot see a situation unless they experience it first hand. Let this be a lesson for the future!! I’ve learned.
So, while there may be differences of opinion on many subjects this is a fabulous web site for opening your eyes to local issues, asking questions, answering some and sharing information.
So much for personal feelings….. I will retreat back behind the $$$ signs.
Thanks, keokuk, for the link. The comments to that article are worth reading. Love the one from VirginiaConservative. I am printing the whole thing off and keeping it in my file. Great article, Greg! http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/03/AR2007110301075_Comments.html
One Voice, I couldn’t agree with you more! This truly is a
great venue for sharing thoughts, ideas, concerns and in some
cases, learning! Indeed, Patty, Lafayette, Redawn, Patriot
are just a few of the great contributors. There are many others
whom I enjoy very much.
Here is a link to the WaPo article’s comments:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/03/AR2007110301075_Comments.html The comments to that article are worth reading. Love the one from VirginiaConservative. I am printing the whole thing off and filing it for future reference. Great article, Greg!
One Voice and Gone Fishing,
Thank you both very much. I don’t know if either of you have seen my pictures? I’ve posted them on other threads. I’ve just added a new album about 10 minutes ago. Please, take a look.
All,
http://community.webshots.com/user/Lafayette13
For those folks that wish to stay in denial. I would think these pictures just might make you reconsider.
ENJOY!!!
“A June poll taken in Prince William County found that only 3.2% of our citizens thought that illegal immigration was the issue they most wanted addressed.
I wonder why it got so critical in July?”
I wondered the same thing, but then I read the survey (all 192 pages) and realized NOT ONE question about illegal immigration was asked. The only time the word illegal was mentioned was in regards to illegal signs along the road. The survey was released to the public in June but was actually taken months before that.
So the above statement that has been quoted often (I believe it originally came from a Pandak speech) is not true.
There was an open ended question where people could answer what they wanted to see in the county in 20 years, and perhaps some people mentioned illegal immigration in that question.
No one should be quoting that survey as factual unless there was a direct question about illegal immigration asked. I suspect if they had asked, the answer would have followed recent polls with 75% of people concerned about illegals.
Here is the link in case anyone is interested in reading the entire survey:
http://www.pwcgov.org/docLibrary/PDF/006710.pdf
I urge you to vote on Tuesday November 6th and when you do, do it with conviction. Don’t be brainwashed be ideological theory.
It’s time for Bush Republicans to leave the White House, U.S. Congress, U.S. Senate, the General Assembly, and the Prince William Board of County Supervisors.
A yes vote for Corey means no turning back. Once they’re in, there is no getting them out. We all know that.
I ask all HSM members to help me understand just what Corey Stewart has done for us? Are we now enforcing ordinances that are already on the books? No. Landlords are letting neighborhoods deteriorate, and what if anything is now being down about it/. Nothing. Going after businesses? Guess what, the developers left already and took the jobs with them.
Is local government enforcing county ordinances to help crack down on unlawful dwellers who illegal reside in the county and who appear to be in obvious violation of housing ordinances? No.
Will you accept the consequences when one of hard working police officers is wastefully killed in the line of duty while pulling over a vehicle that ran a red light. There is one officer per vehicle, this is unsafe and frankly irresponsible. Mr. Stewart doesn’t care, not about the safety of our police, but about anyone other than himself. It’s all showmanship to get his name out across the Nation so one day he can be President. Yes, the President.
Vote on Tuesday but say no to Corey Stewart. Nancy Reagan will be proud you did.
Lafayette ——
OMG!!! Rats??? How you have not turned into a ranting manic person at this point is beyond me. Who have you given those photos to? What does the state health dept have to say?
I found it.
It was in the open ended question section at the very end…so completely unprompted, 3.2% of people brought up the illegal immigration issue as something they wanted change in the coming years.
Almost every other answer people gave to the open ended question was on something they had already been questioned on, i.e. They hope we have more parks in the coming years. Illegal immigration sticks out as being one thing people kept bringing up unprompted!
Just the fact that people brought it up unsolicited when it is normally considered a federal issue goes to show that people in the county were concerned.
corr - maniac. There is a slight difference
One Voice,
At the peak of the rats in the early summer I addressed the BOS, on these nasty things. Public Works came at the request of the Health Dept. and check out the storm drain and found several dead down there way bigger than my pictures show. I’ve shown several pictures at several different BOS meeting, and left copies for the Clerk to be forwarded to all. I handed the actual pictures over to the Honorable John Stirrup’s staff. Patty has done the same.
BTW-Manic or maniac there’s a very fine line. Somedays it could be either one or both.-lol. Of course I’ve been called much worse on here.
This is what I meant about DAY to DAY issues and how people who won’t look can’t see or understand.
Sticks and stones…..
More power to you.
Sorry if someone has posted on this already elsewhere, but has anyone seen these ads referred to in this article?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/02/AR2007110201891.html
One Voice,
“So much for personal feelings….. I will retreat back behind the $$$ signs.”
I have learned a lot from you too! “SHOW ME THE MONEY”
It’s VERY important! As you know we have had discussions in the past about sayings…:) here is another one: “BS walks and money TALKS”….
I would hope that in the upcoming months the BOCS would redirect their efforts into improving turnaround time on zoning complaints, regardless of the status who is in violation. This is an area where county government can and should be effective.
Since this is an open thread, does anyone have thoughts about FEMA and the FAKE press conference?
Here are some youtube video links I found over the weekend, My husband said he had already heard about it, my guess, his listening to WTOP. So, what else does our taxpayer dollars fake?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6z_aFh8Dew
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=071nO9V22jA
Ok, let me try this again….since this is an open thread, would ANYONE like to comment about FEMA’S FAKE press conference?
It makes me wonder what else our tax dollars pay for that get faked…..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6z_aFh8Dew
I tried to post it this question earlier and it was deleted.This is why I started my comment off with: Ok, let me try this again….maybe it was because I posted 2 youtube websites….
Here is the so called FAKE press conference
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=071nO9V22jA
I am having trouble posting, that is why I started off with Ok, let me try again…
Here is the so called FAKE press conference
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=071nO9V22jA
redawn,
Im surprised only one person was fired from that incident. Actually was the press director fired or just moved to a different position in the gov’t?
Redawn,
What do you expect from the Federal Government? For the left who think the Government has the answer for every issue and problem we face, this is what they deserve. Once we allowed the Federal Government to gain power over the State Government we were doomed. Yet, those on the left want an always expanding Federal Government in order to give away the store for votes. Then they wonder why the Feds cannot even do their basic functions.
Dolph,
The turn around time does need to be shortened. However, the due process must take place and that could mean upto 6months. This would take legislative action at the state level. Virginia is Dillan Rule State, and dictates the limits and amount of time for due process to happen. I’m not well versed on the Dillan Rule. However, we both know some knowledgable commenter is sure to post and enlighten us.
The coke machine is still out in the driveway down the street.
Are you thirsty?-lol
There have been a few laws allowing higher fines on some Zoning Violations. I think the BOS will taking a very close look at the Zoning Dept. and look at where fines can be increased. I firmly believe we need new stiffer laws and/or fines, and enforcement of the laws.
Yup, citizenofmanassas, those on the left like all of you who voted for Bush (twice). His administrations have expanded the federal government substantially. But that is because he is rabidly left wing, right?
The rats are thirsty. Give them a cerveza, Lafayette. That coke machine needs to go. I saw it last night. They could at least move it to the back yard. Geez
Rats have always been around here. Where there are people there are rats because people have food. I guess I am glad they are dead rather than living ones. Shudder! The dead carcasses should not be left in yards though. Double shudder.
I believe we need stiffer ordinances also and they need to be enforced in a timely fashion. This should be one area for the BOCS to focus. They can also lobby the state for changes in state law.
Anonymous at 11:19 pm:
I have to say, I just found out about this event and do not have all the details, still searching to see what happened etc.
COM,
I am more concerned with the BIG picture of OUR government and agencies STAGING, FAKING… who do you trust? I know not to trust the government or any agency, media, as far as you can throw them for that matter. I had a hard time when Greg posted his video about religion and politics and asked me why I was upset with his approach in regard to the law of of our land, THIS is why. ( MAN’S law vs. God’s law)
He closed the comments, so I was unable to respond.
First off, Greg: Your family is in my prayers - if there is ANYTHING I can do for you, PLEASE let me know…you know how to contact me…don’t be shy.
Now for G-d Bless America: Do you leave out the “o” because you cannot utter His name beging the typical Liberal Hippie Commie Fag Freak that you are??? So nice how you have Corey elevated to President - oh come on!!! If you had said Scott Ling has those asperations, I would probably agree with you, but Corey, one step at a time.
For those who claim that Faisal Gill was cleared”, it’s time to grow up. Whatever strings were pulled to have Faisal “cleared” in ONE WEEK is one item to address, believing that Faisal had “no idea” about Al-Amoudi is another story. Greg recently posted on this blog about the guy Gov. Kaine appointed and had a YouTube video up about it. The speaker was Al-Amoudi yelling to President Clinton in front of the White House, “We are supporters of Hamas”, “We are supporters of Hezbollah”. This was BEFORE 9/11, BEFORE Faisal went to work as the Chief Spokesman for the AMC, yet we are supposed to believe he DID not know about Al-Amoudi’s threat to then President Clinton???
Another issue Faisal and his sympathizers fail to address is who Faisal is in business with RIGHT NOW. He has a law practice and a lobbying/consulting practice with a man who was paid $160,000 to be the lobbyist for FOCA (Friends of Charity Association). Go to http://www.foca.net/Members.stm. Out of the 6 members there, at least 3 of them are listed on the United States Treasury’s BLOCKED PERSONS list and on the US Treasury’s web site:
http://www.treasury.gov/offices/enforcement/ofac/sdn/t11sdn.pdf
They further mention those members to have ties to al-Qaeda. Here is just one link:
http://www.treas.gov/press/releases/js1895.htm
So you Faisal lackeys can be mad at me all you want, but I believe the U.S. Treasury Department vs. Faisal any day of the week. Oh, and if you bring up the WEAK argument that, that is “guilt by association” you may do so, but the fact remains that Faisal’s lobbying/consulting business is with ONE person and his law firm has only TWO other people, both are with the man who thinks it is okay to accept $160,000 to lobby for organizations that the U.S. Treasury says that they are tied to al-Qaeda. This might be okay with you the pro Faisal crowd, but it is NOT okay with me! Take a look at the local politicians who HAVE NOT endorsed Faisal…very telling indeed!!!
“It is a general and undisputed proposition of law that a municipal
corporation possesses and can exercise the following powers and no others:
First, those granted in express words; second, those necessarily or fairly
implied in or incident to the powers expressly granted; third, those
essential to the declared objects and purposes of the corporation, not
simply convenient, but indispensable. Any fair, reasonable doubt
concerning the existence of the power is resolved by the courts against
the corporation, and the power is denied.” - John Forest Dillon
John Light, I don’t know why G-d Bless American drops the “o,” but it is amusing you think it is a lefty thing. I associate G-d with Orthodox or otherwise highly observant Jews, who do it out of reverence. But I guess in your ultimate wisdom, you think Lubavitch et al and you think, what was it, your tolerant language? “typical liberal hippie commie fag freak.”
Big surprise.
UndahCuvahAnonaOhBrother - put down your hash pipe, get your panties out of its wad. Everyone knows that Liberals and Church don’t mix. Get a grip, bro.
I see you don’t believe me John Light. Why not put G-d and Jews in Google and find out. Nothing to do with church, I assure you.
Although liberals and church mix quite a bit, from Unitarians to those pesky sanctuary Catholics who annoy all of you so much as they take Jesus seriously.
Even Jesus, Mary & Joseph were subject to the law. That is why they were traveling back for the cencus and Jesus was born in Bethlehem.
COM @ 11:21, I concur. And now we have these voting blocks of muslims, latinos, asians, (and indoctrinated college students for that matter) who come from countries (campuses) where western civ is not exactly lived, taught or appreciated. It will be difficult to continue our heretofore successful great-experiment-in-democracy” which has made the US the last, best hope. For all their intelligence and “education”, they are clueless.
Comments from the WaPo article are worth reading. You would think Congress would be reading these - they are usually overwhelmingly to enforce immigration law, not give amnesty: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/03/AR2007110301075_Comments.html
Well stated, Le…..
Anony 11:41
I did not vote for Bush in either election. I knew from the start the guy was horrible. He was picked not because of his policies but because he polled well to the lead up to the first election.
Though, I don’t disagree with you that he is a bit to the left on many issues.
Redawn,
The smaller the Federal Governement is, the more it can be trusted. We can also trust the military.
Peace = Nancy Layall. You heard it here first.
Gary Jacobson is sueing Chris Core.
http://www.manassasjm.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=MJM/MGArticle/WPN_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&cid=1173353375894&path=
http://www.diggersrealm.com/mt/archives/002558.html
“OUTRAGE! No More Invasion Member Attacked By Illegal Aliens At Home Depot - Blood Spilled [Video, Pics]”
May God be with you and comfort you in your time of loss.
“Now for G-d Bless America: Do you leave out the “o” because you cannot utter His name beging the typical Liberal Hippie Commie Fag Freak that you are???” John Light said on 5 Nov 2007 at 12:19 am
We have solid proof that John Light really is an intolerant racist bigot!
He has drawn serious question to the credibility of his damaging claims against Faisal Gill. What a remarkable twist of fate for Republican voters who may have otherwise skipped over this race.
I will be voting for Faisal Gill tomorrow.
Who will you be voting for John, a man that is willing to deny us our 2nd amendment rights, and a man that is embarassed because Virginia’s Medicaid program isn’t spending enough money?
John–you make me sick!
Patriot - yeah, there are lots of college kids hanging out at 7-11, willing to do a $700 job for $80. Right…
Sorry, patriot - meant for COM.
Batson,
Peace is Nancy, really? I’ve always thought that was a distinct possiblity. Has this been confirmed? What screen name do you suppose John Steinbach is using?
God Bless America (there, I said it for you…GOD)
What proof do you have that John Light is an intolerant racist
bigot?
You, perhaps would say the same about me (go ahead, if you
want to look like a fool) because I am against the re-election
of Glendell Hill, who is black.
I believe that John Light has done extensive research on Gill
(as I have done on Hill) and he knows what he’s talking about.
G-d Bless America - then if I made you sick, my mission is accomplished. All I can say is, you are an idiot. And yes, I am sure you have been called worse by better. Just hide behind your pathetic anon because you are not man enough to sign your name.
I say GOD BLESS AMERICA…can you???
Gone Fishing - thank you
Gone Fishing,
Well I see we are in agreement again the this morning.
Trust me I’ve been called those same nasty names, and all just because we have a different opininion we are called racists. We are not, and this includes John Light as well.
Well if you are in Manassas today take spin by the courthouse parking lot where 28 splits at Rescue Squad.
BTW-Will you be taking Collier up on his offer to tour the Sheriff’s Office? Perhaps, you, Mr. Dominguez, and myself should go together, and save the trouble of three “tours”. Did you see that letter last week comparing to Glendell’s operation to that of Mayberry? Some folks just don’t seem to like informed/enlightened voters.
Lafayette, yes I saw the “Mayberry” letter and had a good
laugh. I also saw a recent letter from Collier praising Hill for
his ethics. I had a good chuckle on that one, too. Neither
would know “ethical” if it slapped them across the face. Sorry,
I won’t be out and about today (to tour the sheriff’s domain)
because I am nursing a cold and want to make sure I am able
to go out and cast my vote tomorrow for a true ethical person..
Louis Dominguez! I know that you are a huge supporter of
Jackson Miller, as was I until I looked this morning at his
campaign ad and saw him pictured with Glendell Hill! What
is he thinking??
ICE: Tab to remove illegal residents would approach $100 billion
Story Highlights
Immigration and Customs Enforcement: Figure based on very rough calculations
Estimate doesn’t include cost of finding illegal immigrants, nor court costs
Department of Homeland Security’s annual budget is about $35 billion
From CNN’s Mike M. Ahlers
WASHINGTON (CNN) — It would cost at least $94 billion to find, detain and remove all 12 million people believed to be staying illegally in the United States, the federal government estimated Wednesday.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/09/12/deportation.cost/index.html
Is it worth it to spend 100 billion to send them home, and where should that money come from?
Boy reading Jacobsens article about his suit to Core, is unbelvable .
I really liked where he said he got an estimate for 5 rooms at $700 to be painted. Figured that was too much and went to Rt. One and the Parkway and picked up 2 laborers and it cost him $200 plus. What a deal?? The $700 was a good price.
This just shows you what a cheap shot this Jacobson is and always has been.
When he had the Van service from Woodbridge to Wash. D.C. he was a real skin flint.
He likes living in his big houses but he doesn’t give alot to the community,but he talks as if he does.
He’s nothing but a FAKE.
??? - It OUGHT to come from the country of origin!
Feel like chicken tonight? http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=58501 Can we please close our borders now?
I actually think the best solution to cost is to have our government track the costs of illegals (healthcare, foodstamps, education, etc.) and then deduct that amount from any debt we have with the countries of origin involved.
I think $700 bucks to paint 5 rooms is a hell of a deal. If anyone knows where I can find something this good hiring legal painters, please leave me a note. Of course, I would want furniture moved.
Dolph
Maybe, Mario’s Painting would, and throw the Coca-Cola fridge in for FREE!!-lol (Not certain of legal status)
k. o’toole at 12:51 pm
From the article…
“…Hayman also said, despite the large number of foreign-born Hispanic employees working at the Decatur facility, all have been verified as legally working in the U.S.”
So, who exactly are you suggesting we close our borders to?
http://frontpagemag.com/Articles/Printable.aspx?GUID={71B4D7AE-CF76-441D-9736-4F8A9E7DBE4C}
What an eye opening article!
http://frontpagemag.com/Articles/Printable.aspx?GUID={71B4D7AE-CF76-441D-9736-4F8A9E7DBE4C}
The link.
Copy the whole link into your browser to view the article. For some reason only part of the link shows up in hypertext format. If you click on the hypertext it will give you an error.
sorry,peter,guess it was a non sequitor
How much money is spent by all of the law enforcement agencies in America in order to catch, retain, try and jail law breakers?
Should we just do away with law enforcement completely since it costs so much money?
COM -
I assume you are referring to illegals? The answer is “no”. But the feds have to take them when they are caught. Locals hold them until the Feds can “get to it”. Then they release them with the “direction” to appear in Federal court. Then if they don’t show up a warrant is issued. Do they really think they will car pool to federal court?
Maybe the Feds need night court? Our judicial building sits empty all night.
Oklahoma has most definitely got it right:
http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071103/NATION/111030046/1002
A federal judge this week allowed Oklahoma’s law cracking down on illegal aliens to go into effect. As the toughest law in the nation, it would:
•Eliminate illegal aliens’ ability to get an official government identification card, such as a driver’s or occupational license.
•Prevent illegal aliens from obtaining public benefits or assistance other than what is required by federal law, such as education and emergency medical care.
•Create a state felony offense for persons who knowingly harbor, transport, conceal or shelter illegal aliens. Each offense is punishable by a $1,000 fine and up to a year in jail.
•Make illegal aliens arrested for felonies or alcohol-related misdemeanors generally ineligible for parole, meaning they must be held until federal authorities come to pick them up.
•As of July 2008, businesses will have to check new employees’ work authorization with federal databases.
•Create incentives for businesses not to hire illegal aliens, including creating a private cause of action for anyone who is fired from a position that later is given to an illegal alien.
One voice,
No, I am referring to any criminal. I posted in response to the link to the CNN article highlighting how much it might cost to round up every single illegal.
The cost factor in trying to deport illegals has become a popular reason why we should not deport illegals.
I asked how much money is being spent in total on law enforcement to show we spend billions of money in the process of attempting to combat crime, yet nobody seems to think that money is wasted. But, somehow money spent on trying to deport illegals is wasted and could be better spent.
…citizenofmanassas said on at 1:33 pm:
“Should we just do away with law enforcement completely since it costs so much money?”
Absolutely not. Budget considerations are rarely an all or nothing exercise. Is the problem worth 100 billion, where will the money come from, and how will we prevent them from coming back in and starting the whole cycle again?
Why do we want to keep them out, and shouldn’t we have immigration laws that are uniform and applicable to everyone? Shouldn’t those laws protect our best interests AND be true to the founding premise of unalienable rights and freedom for all?
Is the fact that someone entered illegally a significant problem, or are specific criminal acts commited after arrival the real drivers of complaints. Don’t we already have laws against theft, burglary, boarding houses, etc? Couldn’t we more effectively deal with those specific problems if we weren’t spending county enforcement dollars by usurping federal authority? Shouldn’t the finger-pointing extend not only to groups of alleged perpetrators, but also to the county legislators and enforcers who have not devised real solutions to community problems?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbfhOZs6X7g&NR=1
Walter Moore in Los Angeles discusses the real situation in LA and across the nation.
Peter,
You have missed my point. We spend untold sums of money to fight crime. Why should we spend that money?
The supporters of illegals jumped on the cost issue of the resolution so quickly because they thought they had a valid point. Of course they did not bother to think it through completely because if they would have, they would have realized how silly their point was.
Funny, how nobody complains when local law enforcement teams up with the Feds to fight drugs and round up fugitives.
How can we prevent someone who has served their jail sentence from committing another crime once they are released from jail?
Patriot,
Thanks so much for the link about Walter Moore. EVERYONE needs to see this. Everyone needs to forward this on. It really makes you think.
If you would like to see what is happening in San Diego with illegal alien squatters and how the are decimating the area go to this link.
http://www.immigrationwatchdog.com/?p=5042
And click on Filthy Migrant Camps
ElemTeacher…..not a problem at all. I would urge everyone to do what ET said….forward it on! I really hope this guy gets elected in LA. They need someone like him to start cleaning up the mess there.
Why should we spend that money?
To protect the public safety and maintain order. To prevent willful acts of violence, destruction, and/or thievery. I’ll even throw trespass in there, but I would guess that with equal resources a community would put more emphasis on the aforementioned trangressions.
Cost of resolution silly? It must be, or the saviors who voted it in would have had the confidence good sense to fund it.
Cost of rounding them up and sending them packing?
100 billion. You would choose to spend that money, knowing that the entire budget for homeland security is just over 1/3rd that figure? Seems silly to me.
Funny, bunches of people complained when local Mexican law enforcement teamed up with U.S. Feds to fight drugs. As far as drug enforcement partnerships within the states, I would guess there are fewer complaints because the money usually comes from the federal money pot, and is going towards intervening in current local criminal behavior. Not randomly checking ID’s. Even then, as evidenced by other threads on this site, there’s considerable disillusion with the “war on drugs.”
How can we prevent…? We’ll never prevent all crime. But to put 100 billion into drop-kicking people over a ridiculously porous border will likely not reduce the number of wanderers across that imaginary line.
Watchdog Spends The Night In The McGonigle Canyon Migrant Camps
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CLICK HERE FOR SHOCKING VIDEOS
Pretty disturbing…..
Peter, that is why attrition by enforcement and cutting off benefits (incentives) is the best and most cost-effective measure!
Peter, although we should deport those we find are here illegally too of course!
Sorry Maureen - I didn’t see that you had already posted the link…..thanks, since mine obviously didn’t work anyway. Pretty disgusting…..
Patriot (Got E-Verify?)
…attrition by enforcement and cutting off benefits (incentives) is the best and most cost-effective measure!
I can find some common ground in that statement! You’ve already seen that some basic benefits are off limits by interpretation of the Constitution. Sorry, I have to agree with that interpretation. Other county services could be “on the table”, but could be tightened up and enforced without all the political grandstanding. That said, if a big concern is gangs, I don’t see how denying recreational opportunities or library cards will help solve that problem. (and yes, I know that’s not part of the resolution that passed.)
…we should deport those we find are here illegally too of course!
If they are convicted of current crimes, yes. But I don’t think it’s best for our community to search for criminality where it isn’t currently displayed.
COM
Oh, I see. Well I don’t see a difference between criminal and illegal. They are the same, but we agree on that. In fact illegal criminal is more of a slap in the face, if you ask me.
The only reason it costs so much to deport people is because our elected officials have made it so with their terrible processes. There could be a few steps cut out. This would be a good re-engineering project. They could redirect some foreign aid and create USA Aid or some money being thrown at the Middle East. There is money when the Prez or congress want there to be money so I don’t buy lack of funding as an issue.
After looking at Lafayette’s photo’s I’m not convinced it isn’t a form of domestic terrorism if the mess is made by illegals.
One voice,
Sorry, maybe I did not make myself clear. I wanted to know the cost of law enforcement for criminals that are not illegals.
Peter, why are you interested in spending money on every type of criminal but illegals? Do you think the combined cost of all law enforcement agencies are more then 100 billion? I would think so, since we will spend untold dollars on law enforcement year after year, after year, whereas the 100 billion is an end figure for the cost of removing illegals.
I would like to take advantage of this open thread and ask a question:
Background:
1. I am against illegal immigration.
2. I support the increased local police involvement and think PWC’s strategy in this area is EXCELLENT.
3. I think that the BOCS should not be involved in this issue because they don’t really understand it (the resolution which does little or nothing proves this point - to me).
That being said:
1. We need people to pick our crops, build our houses, serve our food, rake our yards, pack our hams, shell our clams, etc., etc., etc.
2. Regardless of the rhetoric, Legal residents just don’t want to do that work (lots of evidence on all of the National papers.) I’m from the mid-west. Natives (Citizens and legal residents) are leaving the Midwest because, simply put, farm life isn’t as attractive as it once was (anyone who has ever de-tassled corn or picked crops in the fields will understand). Without “guest workers”, the crops don’t get picked. I think it’s the same situation in California… and it is a problem.
My question: While I am against illegal immigration, I am for changing the immigration laws to allow increased legal immigration. This would allow us to control who gets in (background checks), get a handle on where they are (so criminals can be quickly identified and deported), and support that part of the National economy that depends on their labor. Pragmatically, I am specifically for increasing legal immigration from Mexico because they are our de facto source for agricultural labor (simply put, they pick the fruit you buy at the market, among other things).
Just curious, how do members of this blog (who I consider illegal immigration activists - a fair characterization) feel about significantly increasing legal immigration proportionate to the demand in industries that require their labor? In other words, if all of the otherwise law abiding illegal immigrants (folks who otherwise work, follow zoning laws, and don’t hurt other people or take their stuff) you see on the streets today came back as legal, would you be satisfied?
Old Soldier
Go to nummbersusa.com and watch the intro video. That’s what I think
Great question!
What One Voice said on 5 Nov 2007 at 6:39 pm
I watched the video. Interesting. I’m not sure I agree with all of his conclusons (number are funny things); however, I understand his message. I’m probably on middle ground because I still believe (from personal experience and relatives still on the farm in three mid-western states) that we need “guest workers” (read that more immigrants to make up for labor shortages in specific areas) to pick the crops. We just don’t see it “up close and personal” in Manassas. While Congress is doing a really poor job with immigration, part of the reason is pressure from Congressmen representing Districts that absolutely require “guest workers” in numbers greater than are currently available to get the crops from the field to the store (and other things where labor shortages exist).
So, you are (correct me if I’m wrong) really for reducing immigration in general and illegal immigrants are just one flavor if immigrants you would like to see less of (for the reasons stated in the numbers.usa video)?
Is this the general concensus of most of the participants in this blog?
The United States allows 2 million LEGAL immigrants into the country each year. This is more than all the other countries combined. We have guest worker programs. If we need to increase guest workers for certain jobs, we have the ability to do so. There is NO excuse to allow illegal aliens to get a pass on our laws because some employers want to hire this cheap labor force at the expense of every U.S. taxpayer. It is plain wrong to allow 10’s of millions of illegal aliens to decide which laws they will obey and which laws they will ignore, while U.S. citizens are required to obey all laws or pay the consequences. Immigrants should be allowed to come to the United States for what they can offer us, not for what they can take from us.
What starryflights said on 5 Nov 2007 at 7:20 pm
Regarding illegal immigration, absolutely agree! I’m talking about legal immigration.
starryflights 5 Nov 2007 at 7:20 pm
Well said.
Old Soldier: “…if all of the otherwise law abiding illegal immigrants (folks who otherwise work, follow zoning laws, and don’t hurt other people or take their stuff) you see on the streets today came back as legal, would you be satisfied?”
“Law abiding illegal immigrants” is an oxymoron. But I get your drift.
Starryflights nailed it in reply to you. The country’s needs, backed by the rule of law, should define immigration levels.
starryflights 7:20 - Of course the US takes in more immigrants. Reason being that it is a large country and is most likely the richest country in the world today. If you were to consider immigrants/ capita of, say, the Scandinavian countries the US would be way behind, I believe. The same holds true when it comes to foreigh aid.
What es_la_ley said on 5 Nov 2007 at 9:08 pm
Point of order, I actually said “otherwise law abiding illegal immigrants” but I get your drift also. It soulds like we are saying the same thing… controlled legal immigration to meet our needs (vice open borders.)
Since this is an open thread, I have a question regarding keeping track of updates to BVBL. I don’t know where else to post this.
I check in often (twice, or more, daily) to see what new threads and comments have been added, and I post fairly often too.
My question is… would using an RSS reader and subscribing to the RSS feed solve the problem of getting updates (new threads, new comments posted in the threads, and/or perhaps comments posted to *me*) ?
Doing it manually is getting to be a pain!
Old Soldier
Yes, I am for overall reduced numbers of legal immigrants into the USA until this illegal situation is under control. Then I would support a review of all our current policies as they are so convoluted they are almost impossible to follow. The congress along with economists should develop a new plan that better balances the countries from which immigrants can come and at what rate.
The statue of liberty does not guarantee a free for all. Charity begins at home. We have forgotten that in the USA.
Old Soldier,
There is not a job an American will not do. The reason why the MSM press uses the example of that illegals do jobs Americans will not do is because they support illegals and see that as a sound argument. If all you had to rely on was living here in the DC area, you might think that is the case. However, if you travel around the Country, you will see plenty of Americans working in all of these so called jobs we do not want to do.
For example, when I visit my mother in Florida, I usually drive. I stay in corporate hotels and family run hotels, and I see plenty of American maids. I stop at fast food restaurants and see the same Americans working in them as I do the gas stations and 7-11’s.
Given the fact illegals make up only about 5% of the entire work force, I hardly think we need them to do the jobs.
Will an illegal take a grass cutting job for six dollars an hour? Sure since they are used to making that much money in a day(if they are lucky in Mexico). They will also leave in an overcrowded house because that is all they can afford to do.
If you were able to make upward of ten times what you have been making, you would jump at the chance and do the job gladly. Those that support illegals seem to think otherwise that only illegals are hard working and that just is not the case.
We do have many guest worker programs that can be adjusted as needed. What we do not need is to have twenty million illegals and programs that allow chain migration for those in the guest worker programs.
Greg I’m sorry a member of your family has passed away. My deep condolences. My good friend at the office is also dealing with a family loss. It is very hard on him. I wish you the best and some peaceful rest. I pray Election day will be an emotional boost for you tomorrow.
Thanks to all who responded. I think we may be taking variations of the same path.
Old Soldier said on 5 Nov 2007 at 6:19 pm:
Pragmatically, I am specifically for increasing legal immigration from Mexico because they are our de facto source for agricultural labor (simply put, they pick the fruit you buy at the market, among other things).
Better check the labels on the fruit in the supermarkets again. Mostly all imports!
??? said on 5 Nov 2007 at 12:12 pm:
Is it worth it to spend 100 billion to send them home, and where should that money come from?
Enforce the laws on hiring illegals and take the jobs away.
It will cost nothing to send them home. They will “self-deport” if they can’t get a job.
Maureen:
A few years ago there was actually a migrant camp set up in the storm sewer drain on (under) Ashton Avenue between Confederate and Rolling.
My wife and a neighbor dug the stashed clothing, etc. out and placed it where the owners would know they were discovered, I suppose they moved on.
I would suggest that Arnold have the National Guard, preferrably an Airborne unit, do a sweep through the area on a regular basis, as part of the border security effort.
old soldiers never die, they just fade away. Notice you didn’t show up for your guard duty stint this morning at 02:00 hours at the sign.