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The Story That The MJM Ignores
By Greg L | 15 November 2007 | Crime, Prince William County | 63 Comments
While the Manassas Urinal-Massager continues to push the allegation that voters were somehow intimidated at the Stonewall precinct during the last election they are steadfastly ignoring actual evidence of election fraud. The difference between what gets reported and what does not here has nothing to do with evidence, but with who is making the allegations. If Latino activists make an allegation, it gets thoroughly reported, but if someone reports misdeeds by these activists, it doesn’t. I’ve dug into what happened that Tuesday, and here’s what the Urinal-Massager doesn’t want it’s readers to know:
Sometime before noon, Mexicans Without Borders were dropping off vanloads of voters along with interpreters at various precincts around Manassas, and stopped by Stonewall. The voters that they brought often appeared to have no ability to speak English, which raised the suspicions of outside poll workers that were handing out sample ballots at the time. All immigrants applying for citizenship are required to have a basic ability to read, write, and speak English. There are two exceptions to this rule, available only for those who are over the age of fifty, so to encounter younger voters who cannot speak English does raise legitimate concerns that illegal aliens may have fraudulently registered to vote and intend to participate in an election.
Of course there’s no way to address such concerns at a polling precinct. Elections officials can’t deny a registered voter the opportunity to vote absent some compelling evidence that a violation of elections laws is occurring, and they certainly can’t require a voter to prove their legal presence before allowing them to cast a ballot. After the fact, issues like this can be investigated, but there’s little opportunity to deal with fraudulent voter registrations on election day. It is going to raise a pretty significant red flag, however, and after this was noted poll workers were keeping a sharp eye out for what might happen next.
Outside the precinct, the interpreters provided by Mexicans Without Borders had a discussion in Spanish with these voters, some of whom were carrying sample ballots printed by Mexicans Without Borders that did not conform to the requirements of Virginia election laws. When these voters entered the precinct, they had the interpreters fill out a voter assistance form as required, and then went with the voters to the voting booths where long discussions between them were observed — much longer discussions than one would reasonably expect necessary if all the interpreter was doing was to translate the sparse text printed on the screen of a voting machine.
Virginia Code § 24.2-649 governs how voter assistance should be provided. Section B of this law, in it’s entirety, reads as follows:
B. Any qualified voter, who requires assistance to vote by reason of physical disability or inability to read or write, may, if he so requests, be assisted in voting. If he is blind, he may designate an officer of election or any other person to assist him. If he is unable to read and write or disabled for any cause other than blindness, he may designate an officer of election or some other person to assist him other than the voter’s employer or agent of that employer, or officer or agent of the voter’s union.
The officer of election or other person so designated shall not enter the booth with the voter unless (i) the voter signs a request stating that he requires assistance by reason of physical disability or inability to read or write and (ii) the officer of election or other person signs a statement that he is not the voter’s employer or an agent of that employer, or an officer or agent of the voter’s union, and that he will act in accordance with the requirements of this section. The request and statement shall be on a single form furnished by the State Board. If the voter is unable to sign the request, his own mark acknowledged by him before an officer of election shall be sufficient signature, provided no mark shall be required of a voter who is blind. An officer of election shall advise the voter and person assisting the voter of the requirements of this section and record the name of the voter and the name and address of the person assisting him.
The officer of election or other person so designated shall assist the qualified voter in the preparation of his ballot in accordance with his instructions and without soliciting his vote or in any manner attempting to influence his vote and shall not in any manner divulge or indicate, by signs or otherwise, how the voter voted on any office or question.
A person who willfully violates this subsection shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor. In addition, the provisions of § 24.2-1016 and its felony penalties for false statements shall be applicable to any request or statement signed pursuant to this section, and the provisions of §§ 24.2-704 and 24.2-1012 and the felony penalties for violations of the law related to providing assistance to absentee voters shall be applicable in such cases.
In any precinct in which an electronic voting device is available that provides an audio ballot, the officers of election shall notify a voter requiring assistance pursuant to this subsection that such equipment is available for him to use to vote in privacy without assistance and the officers of election shall instruct the voter on the use of the voting equipment. Nothing in this subsection shall be construed to require a voter to use the equipment unassisted.
(emphasis added)
This behavior on the part of the “translators” appeared to be a violation of the law, and election officers and the registrar were informed of these concerns. A video camera was used to document the behavior of these “translators” outside of the polling place in order to facilitate any official investigation of these irregularities, and at some point I understand there was a heated discussion between a campaign manager and a representative of Mexicans Without Borders about what was happening at Stonewall.
I arrived at the precinct about 3:00 PM and voted, and returned about an hour later to assist outside the polls. Again these “translators” showed up to assist Spanish-speaking voters, sometimes even when the voters seemed to have little trouble understanding English. When one of these voters was brought into the polls, an inside poll worker observed the “translator” reaching over the voter and changing the voter’s selection on the machine. In another case, a voter had extended discussions with their “translator” for approximately six minutes while voting. Both of these irregularities were reported to me within minutes of them happening.
Despite these problems, outside the polls everything appeared orderly and non-confrontational with the exception of one representative of Mexicans Without Borders getting into the face of one outside poll worker who was handing out sample ballots and shouting questions about whether she had been intimidating voters. Not long after that minor incident, the press showed up with about ten Latino activists and the 9500Liberty crew looking for something to investigate, saying they had received reports that there had been some attempts at voter intimidation. This circus waited around to see if anything would happen, and ended up disappointed. There were three Republicans handing out sample ballots, about ten Democrats doing the same, and six representatives from Mexicans Without Borders, plus the press. It’s hardly the picture of large crowds of “concerned citizens” trying to prevent voters from entering the polls, as the MJM reported to have been the case.
The only allegations of violations of elections laws that have any credibility here are the ones that the Manassas Urinal-Massager have chosen not to report on. The only person named as a source in their recent editorial is Betty Weimer, who was never at Stonewall on election day. While the illegal alien lobby consistently flaunts the rule of law, whether it involves sample ballots, voter assistance at the polls, outdoor advertising, use of IRS tax-exempt status, or operating as an unregistered political action committee, in addition to aiding and abetting the violation of federal immigration laws, the Urinal-Massager is determined to be silent. Yet any time the illegal alien lobby has any thin complaint about what anyone else does, it’s front page news.
What a farce.
The opinions expressed here are solely the views of the author, and not representative of the position of any organization, political party, doughnut shop, knitting guild, or waste recycling facility, but may be correctly attributed to the Vast Right-Wing Conspiracy. If anything in the above article has offended you, please click here to receive an immediate apology.
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So, if there is evidence that MWB again flouted election laws, what now?
How about election workers and candidates blocking the sidewalk requiring me to have to speak to them or take their literature despite holding my hand up as I attempted to get by them inside the building. I assume that is legal and normal, but now I’m not so sure. I could say I felt intimidated or threatened, I guess.
One Voice - All I had to say to them was “No, thank you” and they got out of the way. And of course you would be perfectly within your rights to go about in a coarser, albeit more effective way.
Ha ha. I’m not saying that this is the case at all, but suppose these folks in need of a translator are anchor babies whose parents bought them back to their home countries. Now they’ve returned as citizens whose primary language is Spanish and need a translator!!!
BTW, when I voted there was already a guy at the machine next to me. He was there before me by at least a minute, he was there while I was voting, and he was still there when I left after joking with one of the election officials I know. He was a white professional-looking guy. I don’t know why it was taking him so long.
Anonymous too - Perhaps he was trying to spell “Hamilton Sandwich, Esq.”
Rob Smalls, that’s what I thought too. Ha ha.
This is easy, post the video so we can see the exchange for ourselves.
And if you don’t post the video we can assume the fault lies with the members of the HSM group. Problem solved.
Compassioinate Conservative,
I don’t recall Greg saying it was HIS video to post.
Another example of “double standard”….
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,311838,00.html
Hey “compassionate”, when that video was taken, I was returning from my in-laws as my mother-in-law had died the previous Sunday morning. I don’t have squat for you on this, as I was otherwise engaged when all this was going on and I don’t have any video to show you.
FYI, Help Save Manassas was not manning the polls on election day. Some of our members who are politically active volunteered with some of the candidate campaigns and the political parties, but HSM as an organization had no presence at the polls.
I worked at one of the polls in the morning handing out the legal, gray (not whitle) Republican sample ballots and material for other Republican candidates. The Democrats were there too. A person with a non-American accent approached the group of poll workers and asked who the candidates were who supported having the police harass immigrants. I tried to respond that none of the candidates from either party advocated or would support such activity. The Democrat poll worker jumped in and and started listing Corey and other Republicans. The voter was then not interested in anything else I had to say. Isn’t lying to voters at the polls to influence their vote like that illegal?
My point is the video won’t be posted because it doesn’t substantiate your claims. And you can bet if it did then you’d be circulating it all over town. So as the saying goes - put up, or shut up.
manassascityresident said on 15 Nov 2007 at 2:52 pm:
Another example of “double standard”….
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,311838,00.html
==================================
Here’s just a little snippet of the FoxNews article in the link above. These illegal aliens have some gall DEMANDING rights.
“When it comes to foreigners, we’re a little more strict here,” Alejandro Ruíz, director of education at the Mexican Automobile Association, told the newspaper.
Concerned -
If a voter is too stupid to avoid being influenced like that, there’s nothing that can be done about it. Voters who wish to be informed on the candidates’ positions must undertake that endeavor themselves. Relying on any candidate’s view wholesale is an exercise in ignorance, particularly at the 11th hour of an political race while entering the polling station.
Compassionate -
Why don’t you find and post the video and prove to us all what a huge, filthy liar Greg is? C’mon, do it! You’d be the darling of the BVBL trolls, trodding Greg’s ego and credibility ‘neath your conquering feet.
As the saying goes - put up, OR…
Hey West Gate Witch,
Are you Patricia married to the Vietnamese immigrant? Just curious.
anonymoustoo said on 15 Nov 2007 at 1:38 pm: “He was a white professional-looking guy. I don’t know why it was taking him so long.”
Ok, why the hang up that he was white??? I know MANY hispanics who DO NOT require translators because they took the time to LEARN OUR LANGUAGE either prior to, or after arriving in the US.
Your remarks are akin to someone saying, “I know many people who sign as anonymoustoo who don’t have a pair to post under their real names and all people signing as anonymoustoo should be moderated for idiotic or racist remarks.” I don’t know nor care if you are a non-white person who hates whites, or you are a caucasian who for whatever reason are ashamed of your pursuasion like some spokespeople, but please, do us all a favor and get off the bash whitey bandwagon. As we ALL on this side of the debate have been saying, it has NOTHING to do about race but everything with following the rule of the law.
Concerned, get use to it. That is the way of the democratic party. Fear uncertainty and doubt. It should be illegal. They saw a way to intimidate the voter for their side and because that was an uninformed voter, they probably voted for the democratic sympathizers.
The problem is with the way news is reported on a biased slant. Once the newspaper gets out of this rut and reports the news fair and balanced, we will see a better informed public.
Rob Smalls - Patriot Temp
According to Greg, “at some point I understand there was a heated discussion between a campaign manager and a representative of Mexicans Without Borders about what was happening at Stonewall.”
Let’s give this “campaign manager” a name and I personally will make sure the Justice Department gets the tape.
So just give me the name. Greg, you can send it to my email if you don’t want it posted. Thanks.
# Compassionate Conservative said on 15 Nov 2007 at 3:18 pm:
Hey West Gate Witch,
Are you Patricia married to the Vietnamese immigrant? Just curious.
______________________________________________________
What does this have to do with anything?
Concerned - if it was illegal, then Ted Kennedy, Jim Moran, etc would have to be arrested on the spot - lol.
John Light, I agree!! This is why I do not specify a race or group when I post about the issue. I use illegal alien. As I have said before, why do the Hispanics think they have the market cornered on this illegal alien issue. It is ANYONE that is in the US ILLEGALLY!!!!!!!!
Just trying to put a name & a face together.
It’s for the West Gate Witch to answer.
One Voice said on 15 Nov 2007 at 1:28 pm:
I barely made it to the polls in time to vote so, needless to say, I was in a bit of a rush. When I saw the gauntlet that I would need to run I simply called out before I reached them, “Anybody that tries to hand me something and slow me down should be aware that I will vote for their opposition.” The sea parted and the only other reaction I got was a good-natured, “How ’bout if I hand you one of his (pointing to someone obviously on the other side).” I’ve never had a problem with obnoxious campaign workers at my precinct (Parkside)…I was just in a hurry.
John Light -
Anonymous too made an observation that the dude was white - so what? It’s a clarifying point to his story, but he didn’t bring it up the story BECAUSE the dude was white. The point is ancillary to the post.
You seem to have the intensity dialed up to 11 on this one. I might recommend some soothing chamomile tea and an Enya CD to bring you down.
John White,
The implication was that there was no legimate reason for a Hispanic voter with an assistant to be at the machine for six minutes. I was merely pointing out that a white guy took a lot of time voting as well.
“As we ALL on this side of the debate have been saying, it has NOTHING to do about race but everything with following the rule of the law.”
Yeah, sure…and how did you fell about the abusive driver’s fees? I hope you were in favor of them…rule of law and all that.
/\/\3l)ic 64,
Clearly, they(CC-NOT) want to bring race into it. Race has nothing to do with it. It about THE RULE OF LAW.
Greg-
May I suggest you drop the term “Urinal-Massager”
for our local newspaper and just use MJM. Granted,
they are in no danger of winning a Pulitzer prize and leave
much to be desired, but I think your term reflects
more poorly on you than them. It reminds me of
years ago when my four year son and his friends
thought “Booger King” was an original and clever play
on words - by five,of course, they realized it wasn’t.
BTW “Compasionate Conservative,” I find your commentary generally lacking in compassion and most certainly lacking in conservatism…it’s actually rather rude. You might want to rethink your handle.
I have to agree with Steve Randolph. It’s putting a pretty sizable dent in the serious factor of the posting when the term “Urinal-Massager” is bandied about.
anonymoustoo said on 15 Nov 2007 at 3:36 pm:
LOL! John White!
Hey, is your screen door open?!
Compassionate Conservative,
I was one of many at Stonewall Middle. What Greg said is accurate. There are too many witnesses. MJM went out on a very shaky limb on this one and they fell head first.
I would welcome the state’s investigation. I would like to know by what authority interpreters have for actually casting the vote instead of the voter. Also why was an interpreter needed? There were directions in both English and Spanish. Also, citizens should be able to understand English unless they meet the criteria mentioned above. Seems the irregularities are on the part of the interpreters and those who brought them to the polls. Also, why was Nancy Lyall at Stonewall? Seems peculiar to me. Seems like her friend John S. was involved in producing and distributing the illegal ballot. I hope the state will investigate these people.
It may be wise for Ms. Nancy L. and Mr. John S. to get a lawyer.
There you go, Compassionate Conservative. Get a sworn affadavit from Patty (and anyone else who witnessed the event in question), and trot down to the DOJ to get some sweet justice on behalf of the voters of Prince William County.
It’s not that complicated folks. Where’s the video and who shot it?
AW Cheney - good idea - for an extrovert. I am a bit of an introvert and feel very stressed in those situations. I will pass this along to my husband who would think that was a WONDERFUL idea - will just scoot along beside him
Hate to sound like a broken record but obviously there are some hard heads here.
Rob Smalls - Patriot Temp said on 15 Nov 2007 at 3:48 pm:
I must say, you are doing an excellent job as the Patriot Temp!
Rob Smalls~You are a “True Patriot, temp or otherwise.
The Patriot would be proud.
mcr~We agree once again.
Rob Smalls - Patriot Temp said on 15 Nov 2007 at 3:35 pm:
“John Light - Anonymous too made an observation that the dude was white - so what?”
Because he/she is inferring, if not outright saying, that we are after Hispanics due to the color of their skin and then on a number of occassion points out what he/she sees as infractions and follows it by “who was white” or something to that effect.
So no, not dialing it up to 11, as you suggest. If you think because I wrote, “…it has NOTHING to do about race but everything with following the rule of the law.” then maybe you are the one who needs to refelect on your stance. You are either for or against illegals, regardless of their race…whose side are YOU on???
Laf -
Great minds think alike! HaHa
Greg L has new thread open.
State Police find no voter intimidation. Now, after a week the real story comes out. NO VOTER INTIMIDATION. I’ve know it all along, and so have many others.
John Light -
I made an error. I thought the mention of race on the part of the professional-looking white guy was innocuous, but I wholely missed the intent of Anonymoustoo’s statement, so that’s my bad, and I apologize.
But seriously, you need to calm it down before you stroke out over your keyboard. Your grammar teacher would be appalled at your devil-may-care use of the Caps Lock and gratutious punctuation, not to mention a writing style that’s that digital equivalent of poking someone in the chest when they disagree with you.
No growing corn in the front yard! Patriot-temp has spoken!
Someone from Puerto Rico or Guam or the Virgin Islands could be a US citizen and eligible to vote and yet not speak English and therefore need a translator. Someone could speak only Spanish and not read it well. Just a couple reasons why assistance could be needed at the polls.
John Light, I pay more attention when someone discusses a subject and doesn’t merely parrot a party’s talking points…even with my best friend. As soon as someone says “push 1 for English” or “rule of law” or any other pat phrase that they read from the latest playbook given them by the Republicans or Democrats my eyes glaze over and I think “there’s another puppet who can’t think for him/herself.
I daresay I could probably discuss immigration reform more cogently with anonymoustoo - whom I most likely disagree with - than with John Light, who I probably share a more parallel view with.
Rob S & John L,
Be nice. Can’t we just get along here?
Oh, calm down, fiesty, intensity dial at 11, etc. Please, that’s almost as bad as name calling and post as anon.
I think the two of you share where more views than either of you might even realize or care to admit.(IMHO)
I’ve been reading what you both have been saying for months.
I don’t find myself thinking to myself either of you support ILLEGAL ALIENS.
I thought the intensity “dial at 11″ was a sweet Spinal Tap reference, certainly much more clever than simple name calling.
I know I share many views with John Light. I just don’t know if he knows that’s the case.
Rob S.
Spinal Tap, now I get it. That is clever indeed. Thank you.
I would like to know why the Hispanic voters were intercepted outside the polls by the “translator”. These people should have been able to go inside the polls, then if they needed help, ask for it. We still do not know what the “translator” said to these voters.
Maureen, yours is indeed a good question, but unfortunately,
we shall never know that the “translators” said to those voters.
Rob, you’re doing a fine job of temping for The Patriot. He’d
be most proud of you.
Why do you care Maureen? Keep our nosy self out of other people’s business…and others will stay out of your business.
Alert to all: Shall we activate our “Ignore” buttons?
Maureen,
I was approached by the translator. He just showed me a sign in Spanish. I didn’t read it, I just said no thank you. Actually, I probably couldn’t read all of it. He never said anything to me other than perhaps a greeting.
I don’t know why I was singled out. I didn’t see anyone else get the same treatment. Must be the blonde hair and blue eyes.
Well, perhaps Antigreg knows something about voter fraud during this last election and that’s why he/she is SO very defensive. Perhaps the people who professionally keep their noses in other people’s business should look into these translators and their non-English speaking clients much more thoroughly. Everybody else is only asking how it is that people who are citizens eligible to vote could possibly know so little English that they required THAT degree of assistance…our friend here may actually know.
Correction: Flashed a sign. It was inside a folder of sorts. He opened the folder so I could read it. When I said no thank you he closed the sign.
Just an afterthought, but I wonder if those rumors of voter intimidation came from some Hispanic voters who were afraid to say “no” to the “translators” when they were offered their help in the voting booth. It would certainly explain the questionable act of one of those “translators” being observed changing the vote of one of their clients.
AWCheney
There’s a thought.
Antigreg- what an a$$. People aren’t allowed to question or make observations? Crawl back under your rock.
“When one of these voters was brought into the polls, an inside poll worker observed the “translator” reaching over the voter and changing the voter’s selection on the machine.”
Given that the poll workers don’t stand behind the machines, and given the fact that there’s privacy screens on either side, I cannot possibly imagine how anyone could “observe” someone reaching over and CHANGING a selection. Maybe the voter’s touch didn’t register on the screen, or the voter didn’t see the “Next” arrow and the translator helped him/her?
But hey, when has rationality, logic, or truth ever played a part in anything Greg’s posted here? Innuendo, baseless accusation, rumor and hearsay all make for much better blogging, right?
Dolph-Be thankful they just flashed a sign at you!
Talk about ILLEGAL.
WGW,
Ho ho ho, are you suggesting I might have gotten a real ’side show?’
I see that coke machine is still up and running. Up in the driveway along with all the other crap out there. It is getting harder to see coming down the street because of all the trucks out there in front of the house and in the driveway.
Don’t those folks need a business license to be operating out of their home like that?
The Dude,
Do you really want to stand by your post? I knew folks who support criminals were stupid, but really, you and Anti are neck and neck in the race to be crowned most brain challenged.
Greg does an outstanding job and while he may not be right every time, he does seem to be a better source then the MJM.
The above post is from me…
Well, well, well look what’s in the MJM today.
Police find no evidence of intimidation.
http://www.manassasjm.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=MJM/MGArticle/WPN_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&cid=1173353559770&path=
This is long over due. However, I knew from the get go this did
NOT happen.