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Think Hard, Now…

By Greg L | 28 November 2007 | Crime | 64 Comments

Personally, I think a .45 would be a better choice than a Glock 17, but maybe that’s just me.

H/T: Jerry



The opinions expressed here are solely the views of the author, and not representative of the position of any organization, political party, doughnut shop, knitting guild, or waste recycling facility, but may be correctly attributed to the Vast Right-Wing Conspiracy. If anything in the above article has offended you, please click here to receive an immediate apology.

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64 Comments

  1. Batson D. Belfrey said on 28 Nov 2007 at 11:26 am:
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    It ain’t all about caliber, it’s about shot placement. Have enough gun to do the job, but be able to hit what you want, where you want, everytime.

    I DO agree with the sentiment 100%.

  2. DennisD said on 28 Nov 2007 at 11:34 am:
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    While the 19 is an excellent handgun, the real trick is to be able to place four rounds in the “sweet spot” at 30 feet with whatever you’re carrying. While the 9mm is ok the 45 has excellent stopping power because of the impact and size of the exit wound.

  3. /\/\3|)iç 64 said on 28 Nov 2007 at 11:40 am:
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    A .22 will work just fine if the “sweet spot” has been hit!! (c: 4 rounds to the center chest will stop most people all the time. Knee cap shots will at least slow them down for better “sweet spot” shots (c:

  4. Krusty said on 28 Nov 2007 at 11:44 am:
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    What ARE you trying to do Greg? How would you be able to shoot the rapist in the act without hitting your daughter? It would be a bloody mess to clean up! (I suppose the rapist has a sign on him that says that he has AIDS)

  5. CitizenofManassas said on 28 Nov 2007 at 11:57 am:
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    I like both guns. However, the larger capacity of the 17 wins me over.

  6. 999 said on 28 Nov 2007 at 12:12 pm:
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    /\/\3|)iç 64 said on 28 Nov 2007 at 11:40 am:
    A .22 will work just fine if the “sweet spot” has been hit!! (c: 4 rounds to the center chest will stop most people all the time. Knee cap shots will at least slow them down for better “sweet spot” shots (c:

    Between the eyes will stop em every time.

  7. Nick said on 28 Nov 2007 at 12:20 pm:
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    Personally, I carry a 1911 in 45 ACP. I like the caliber, the steel, the crisp trigger pull, and the accuracy. I have shot the Glock 19, and while it’s not my favorite gun, it sure beats the Nokia.

  8. Rob Smalls - Patriot Temp said on 28 Nov 2007 at 12:32 pm:
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    I agree with Nick. I have a Colt 1911, and it’s bar none the best weapon I’ve ever owned. It’s a little too long for concealed carry though, so I have a Taurus 24/7 .40 that carries quite well.

    Ditto on the shot placement sentiment. It’s estimated that only 1 in 5 shots lands the target during an interaction with hostiles. Practicing shot placement certainly betters the odds, particularly if you have the discipline to keep at it.

  9. John Light said on 28 Nov 2007 at 12:38 pm:
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    The problem rests in no matter where the shot placement, if the perp is high on drugs, you need something that will REALLY take him down. Just ask the troops in Afghanistan and Iraq - saw a good special on the Military Channel just the other day and it said that those jokers were still charging our boys even after being shot up.

    Besides having the right gun, might be a good idea to have extra bullets close bye. The more you practice speed loading and firing, the better. Target up, target down.

  10. Thumper said on 28 Nov 2007 at 12:40 pm:
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    I carry Glock 19 is my concealed handgun. I don’t think Caliber matters as much as shot placement, reliability and readiness to use it to defend your life.

  11. Krusty said on 28 Nov 2007 at 12:42 pm:
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    Which of the above models do you plan to take to the HelpSaveManassas meeting tonight? 999 likes to hit between the eyes and others the “soft spot”. Maybe it’s one and the same!

  12. Chrome said on 28 Nov 2007 at 1:07 pm:
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    I personally own a S&W M&P 9mil. I have found that it isn’t the size that makes a differance, but I do have to agree you have to be willing to use it to protect yourself and your family. I have also been taught to aim for the torso as it is the biggest target on the human body (harder to miss). If someone is attacking a member of my family I am not going to take a chance of shooting them in the knees and leaving them to still be able to shoot at me. Just a thought folks.

  13. Rob Smalls - Patriot Temp said on 28 Nov 2007 at 1:18 pm:
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    FYI Krusty, it’s the “sweet spot”, not the soft spot.

    As far as which model to take to the meeting, I’d stick to my Taurus. Good caliber, decent capacity, I train with it often, and I have a good holster for it. And it’s good lookin’, too. Like steel and polymer-formed sexy.

  14. DontCallMeGringo said on 28 Nov 2007 at 1:21 pm:
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    I love my Glock 17 my first and so far only, gun. What it lacks in caliber it makes up for in capacity and I have several of the Glock 18 31 Round magazines that are compatible with the G17, that gives me 31+1 in the chamber of hollow point Hydrashok goodness.

  15. Rob Smalls - Patriot Temp said on 28 Nov 2007 at 1:23 pm:
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    A 31-round handgun magazine? I feel like half a man…

  16. Batson D. Belfrey said on 28 Nov 2007 at 1:37 pm:
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    The best gun in a bad situation is:

    THE ONE IN YOUR HAND!

  17. Chris Royse said on 28 Nov 2007 at 1:41 pm:
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    It’s called the sinoatrial node:

    What is the sinoatrial node?

    The sinoatrial (SA) node is a section of nodal tissue that is located in the upper wall of the right atrium. The SA node is also referred to as the pacemaker of the heart.
    http://biology.about.com/library/organs/heart/blsinoatrialnode.htm

    I spent many training hours practicing the “double tap” to this location; as my CQB instructor said “shuts ‘em down like a light switch.”

    Unless she is going to put the range time in shooting, reloading, clearing malfunctions, etc. so she is proficient with a semi-auto, I will advise my daughter to stick with a high caliber revolver. Unlike a semi-auto, the majority of failures to fire with revolvers are due to a bad primer or low powder. If that happens with a revolver, just squeeze the trigger again you’ll get the result you want. I know this leads us into a debate on concealability of a large caliber revolver vs. a slick semi-auto, but that is a debate I stay out of because many women have informed me that women’s fashion at large is not “friendly” to ladies who desire to embrace their right to carry.

  18. Advocator said on 28 Nov 2007 at 2:27 pm:
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    I’m with you, Chris. My Ruger Blackhawk will destroy a SA after traveling through the block of a fitty seven Plymouth.

  19. Anonymous said on 28 Nov 2007 at 3:20 pm:
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    Daddy always said “If you can’t take ‘em down with 15 rounds, you’re doing it wrong.”

  20. Batson D. Belfrey said on 28 Nov 2007 at 3:34 pm:
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    Guys (and gals),

    We are scaring Krusty. I think she thinks that guns are evil, not the heart of the person holding it. She is horrified that HSM members, or anyone else for that matter, would actually CC in a public place.

    Hate to see what she’d do if someone decided to exercise thier open-carry rights.

  21. Advocator said on 28 Nov 2007 at 3:59 pm:
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    I open carry when I walk my dog. I don’t know which scares hell out of the illegals more, the gun or the Doberman.

    When I make reservations at a restaurant, I always ask if they’ve got a problem with me exercising my CC right. If so, I cancel the reservations.

  22. Dolph said on 28 Nov 2007 at 4:10 pm:
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    How about a girl thread? Dogs? stock market? diamonds? turquoise?

  23. josh said on 28 Nov 2007 at 4:35 pm:
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    if I had a choice, I would rather have a cannon..but personally, I carry a G27 in .40 for Concealed carry. It’s light and the caliber is just right.

    I love my rottweiler however, he takes care patrolling the home :)

  24. One Voice said on 28 Nov 2007 at 5:35 pm:
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    If we could just keep the guns away from the nuts… all of them :)

  25. josh said on 28 Nov 2007 at 5:36 pm:
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    the other good thing about revolvers for women…they can fire them through their purse. No need to remove it. My wife has a nice .38 special but she rarely carries it unless she’s going to an area that is questionable.

  26. Anonymous said on 28 Nov 2007 at 5:53 pm:
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    Guns are for the weak. Real men carry machetes!

  27. Krusty said on 28 Nov 2007 at 6:01 pm:
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    Tough women handle castiron frying pans!

  28. Krusty said on 28 Nov 2007 at 6:04 pm:
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    Dobermans (Dobermen) and Rottweilers and guns! How can you enjoy life being scared all the time?

  29. es_la_ley said on 28 Nov 2007 at 6:05 pm:
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    “Guns are for the weak. Real men carry machetes!”

    A machete didn’t do Sean Taylor any good.

  30. redawn said on 28 Nov 2007 at 6:28 pm:
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    I was on my way into work and I saw a deer that obviously had been hit by a vehicle. I about cringed with tears ( softy) as it struggled to get up laying next to the road. I felt so bad and the thought crossed my mind, I had wondered if anyone else in traffic was carrying a gun or a knife for the sole purpose of putting this poor thing out of it’s misery. I ended up calling the police to assist. What away to start your day. :(
    The deer was gone when I traveled back home.

  31. redawn said on 28 Nov 2007 at 6:30 pm:
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    I forgot to post my point I was trying to make: if you carried a concealed gun with papers and that happened, would you get in trouble for shooting the deer in that situation?

  32. Dolph said on 28 Nov 2007 at 7:01 pm:
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    One voice,

    I totally agree. No magic bullet for that one though, I am sad to say. It seems we have a local school memorializing a fallen police officer just because of one such gun nut. What a waste. I never hear any of the gun enthusiasts talk about how we keep guns out of the hands of the nut cases. No one ever thinks THEY are crazy.

    Josh,

    .38 specials ….hmmmm…I have one of those but it has a little problem at the moment. Maybe I will get the nerve to ask someone here what to do about it.

    Redawn,

    That has to have been upsetting. I cannot stand to see road kill, especially when it isn’t totally dead.

  33. redawn said on 28 Nov 2007 at 7:11 pm:
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    Dolph,

    I couldn’t have helped out that deer in a way of putting it out of it’s misery. I am tough chick but I don’t have the balls to do something like that, so I did what I could and called while hoping for the best.
    Shoot, I hit 2 deer at the same time ( like a bowling ball down the isle) I did EVERYTHING I could to avoid it but there were 5 deer that jumped out in front of me on 28 in Nokesville one night. I pulled over and cried like a baby, more worried about the deer than my vehicle.
    If it were a defense type situation I could pull a trigger or what ever means necessary ( I have a mean round house kick :) ) LOL

  34. es_la_ley said on 28 Nov 2007 at 7:19 pm:
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    redawn: Re: deer

    Unfortunately, that happens frequently this time of year. And it’s a very sad thing to see. Vehicles are the number one predator of deer nowadays.

    You did the right thing by calling the police. I don’t think euthanasia of a crippled animal is an allowable reason for an average citizen to discharge a firearm on a public road.

    I live near where 234 meets Hoadly Rd. There are deer everywhere in this area now. Drive carefully. :)

  35. es_la_ley said on 28 Nov 2007 at 7:28 pm:
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    One Voice: “If we could just keep the guns away from the nuts… all of them.”

    Yes. But define a “nut”. That’s a tough call! :)

  36. redawn said on 28 Nov 2007 at 7:33 pm:
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    es_la_ley,

    Thanks for your comment and vote for what I thought was right as far as discharging a firearm ( my heart still hurts :( ) and you drive safe too. They are out there more and more. I am to the point I try to avoid driving at night for that reason :)

  37. redawn said on 28 Nov 2007 at 7:34 pm:
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    I am not against hunting just the suffering…damn it did it again…LOL

  38. es_la_ley said on 28 Nov 2007 at 7:50 pm:
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    Batson D. Belfrey : “We are scaring Krusty. I think she thinks that guns are evil…”

    Wait just a cotton pickin’ minute… He’s a she? For many, many months I thought Krusty was a dude.

    :)

  39. Dolph said on 28 Nov 2007 at 8:55 pm:
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    krusty,

    I think you are female. Will the real Krusty please stand up. (Krusty will know where that line came from)

  40. redawn said on 28 Nov 2007 at 9:06 pm:
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    Dolph,

    Slim Shady? LOL…will the real_ please stand up, please stand up….:)

  41. Krusty said on 28 Nov 2007 at 9:49 pm:
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    Krusty is a krusty old lady who writes like a MAN. Quite an achievement, huh!

  42. redawn said on 28 Nov 2007 at 9:58 pm:
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    Krusty,

    “Krusty is a krusty old lady who writes like a MAN. Quite an achievement, huh!”

    Not if you believe in the slogan: behind every good man is a woman…or :Secret, strong enough for a man but made for a woman..LOL…:)

    Another step further ( I really should stop) there are cosmetic surgeries out there if the above not good enough…..yeeeeppp,should have stopped, it was in good fun ONLY….just trying to cover ever angle of debate. :)

  43. Krusty said on 28 Nov 2007 at 10:34 pm:
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    Everybody - I thought for sure that my frying pan comments would have given me away long time ago.

    Redawn - Love your comments! :) Speaking of cosmetic surgery, remember the Dane, Christine Jorgensen (nah, you’re too young)? Bet Dolph remembers her. Oops , I forgot, she (Christine) went the opposite way!
    Anyway, it’s been fun “being” male for a while.

    Just finished watching the Rep. hopefuls. Pretty good show . A few good arguments occurred.

  44. Dolph said on 28 Nov 2007 at 11:30 pm:
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    Krusty,

    Cheer! I knew it! You can’t fool another vintage woman. Tee hee. And yes, the frying pan was a real dead giveaway. Shall we start a new subgroup here? The Vintage Chix?

    Yes, I remember Christine Jorgensen. I was a little kid then and probably don’t honestly remember the actual event but it was talked about for years and years. I always confuse him/her with that tennis player….Renee Richards???

    You can keep on being male on here if you want, Krusty. Sometimes difficult times call for heroic efforts.

    Dolph

  45. Batson D. Belfrey said on 29 Nov 2007 at 8:30 am:
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    “Dobermans (Dobermen) and Rottweilers and guns! How can you enjoy life being scared all the time?”

    So sayeth the sheep, as the wolves watch.

  46. Krusty said on 29 Nov 2007 at 10:19 am:
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    Batty - I shall cavort in the meadow while I’m alive. The wolves might enjoy the show so much, they’ll join me.

  47. Dolph said on 29 Nov 2007 at 11:42 am:
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    Krusty,

    New name? Dances with Wolves? Cavorts with Wolves?

  48. Krusty said on 29 Nov 2007 at 11:52 am:
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    DOLLph - My kinda gal!!!

  49. Josh said on 29 Nov 2007 at 12:56 pm:
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    Krusty,

    doesnt necessarily mean people are afraid or scared when they carry firearms and keep dogs…

    it’s more along the line of prevention. You can get carried away, no need to carry an entire arsenal of weaponry around or keep 50 dogs in your house, moderation is key.

    I’ve had my dog for 11 years, he’s a sweetheart and a valued member of the family. As for the guns…look at all those innocent people murdered or assaulted that could have had a chance if they had a firearm within reach.

    I take family protection seriously, that’s my “job” but I also don’t freak out and barricade them in either. Again, moderation is the operative word here.

  50. Dolph said on 29 Nov 2007 at 1:46 pm:
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    To many of us, gun ownership includes some restrictions. All too often I see people on both sides of the issue painting themselves into the ‘all or nothing’ corner. Is there no middle ground between having an arsenal with absolutely no restrictions and going from house to house confiscating everyone’s guns?

  51. Old Soldier said on 29 Nov 2007 at 4:06 pm:
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    Re what Dolph said on 29 Nov 2007 at 1:46 pm …no middle ground…?

    I’m afraid not. Just look at Australia and Canada (and D.C.)… first Registration… then Confiscation. There’s a move afoot at the United Nations to make guns illegal among all members of that body (hope some future Liberal doesn’t give away the store.)

    As the old saying goes, give them an inch… and they will come for your gun!

    I pack a 1911A1 with Federal Hydroshocks… one round anywhere on the torso tends to slow someone down (although I also practice “touble tap”).

  52. josh said on 29 Nov 2007 at 7:43 pm:
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    that 1911 is a pretty big piece,

    I was carrying a HK-USP45 Compact but I switched it out for the G27 due to size, it was getting to be a pain to carry. Cant wear sweatshirts all the time :)

  53. Krusty said on 29 Nov 2007 at 9:02 pm:
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    Yea, it got to be a pain. Leaving the HK-USP45 Compact at home was not an option, of course. One question, do you gun people who work in offices carry guns to work too?

  54. Old Soldier said on 29 Nov 2007 at 9:35 pm:
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    Re what Krusty said on 29 Nov 2007 at 9:02 pm - do you gun people who work in offices carry guns to work too?

    (Speaking for myself) no.

  55. Roland the Headless Thompson Gunner said on 29 Nov 2007 at 9:36 pm:
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    Kimber Ultra CDP, .45 ACP. 230g. handloaded Gold Dots. A 9mm MAY expand, but a .45 will never shrink.

  56. josh said on 30 Nov 2007 at 12:44 am:
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    krusty,

    not traveling too..cause it’s illegal to have guns in d.c. however while there work provides one when needed..

  57. Krusty said on 30 Nov 2007 at 6:33 am:
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    josh, I don’t know what kind of work you do, but it seems a little bit odd, that an employer would provide his employees with guns. Maybe you’re a private eye with special permit or night watchman or something else, where your job might put you in imminent danger.

  58. Rob Smalls - Patriot Temp said on 30 Nov 2007 at 8:26 am:
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    Krusty,

    Prevention and preparedness is the name of the game. I don’t keep a fire extinguisher in my house because I think there’s an arsonist around every corner. I don’t have airbags and seatbelts in my because road ragers dominate our highways. It’s the same for smoke detectors, electric surge protectors, life, health and homeowner’s insurance, garage door closing sensors, or the door and window locks on my house and cars. I don’t have these things because I believe the world and everything in it is out to get me. There’s no overriding element of fear here. I have them because the world is an unpredictable place, and that once in a while bad things happen, and the best I can do is prepare myself.

    That you disagree with my method of preparation is your choice, but it’s my right, so long as I don’t deprive anyone else of their liberty.

  59. Rob Smalls - Patriot Temp said on 30 Nov 2007 at 8:27 am:
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    Oh, and my office doesn’t permit me to carry on premises.

  60. Krusty said on 30 Nov 2007 at 9:58 am:
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    Rob Smalls - Never said it wasn’t your right, did I? However, all de preventive methods you list, differ greatly from having a gun. It would be mighty difficult to kill anyone with smoke detectors, surge protectors, fire extinguishers, seat belts, etc. The intent of owning a gun I presume, is to, if not kill, at least physically incapacitate a person.

  61. Krusty said on 30 Nov 2007 at 9:58 am:
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    check .. all THE …

  62. Rob Smalls - Patriot Temp said on 30 Nov 2007 at 11:02 am:
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    Krusty - This is your primary error. You believe I buy, own and carry guns just to kill people. I don’t. It’s preparedness. It’s about being on equal footing with people that may want to do me harm, in whatever likelihood that will be. I’m happy to have never had to train a weapon on someone, through all my military years up to now. Does that register with you, or do you merely think I strap up everyday and go pick fights with thugs so I might get the chance to shoot someone because I carry a gun?

    Would you presume that cops carry guns just to kill people? A lot of cops carry everywhere, on and off the job, and I doubt they do it because they are looking for someone to off. The fact is that legal armed presence is an effective deterrent to criminals. Criminals don’t mess with people who they know have guns, and are more likely to retreat after they find out they have to deal with one.

  63. Krusty said on 30 Nov 2007 at 11:26 am:
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    You and I don’t understand each other. I know what you’re saying. What I was trying to show that a seat belt etc. protects you but aren’t able to harm someone else and I feel one can’t compare safety devices with a gun. Of course, guns are necessary in many cases. As for off-duty police carrying guns, do you recall several cases where there have been fatal shooting outside bars in the wee hours of the morning by off-duty police? There was also a case in a shopping mall not long ago. Anyway, I’m closing this subject for now. Always interesting to learn about others’ opinions.

  64. Rob Smalls - Patriot Temp said on 30 Nov 2007 at 11:54 am:
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    I well understand your point about safety devices being unable to harm others. But my point is that I carry guns not to inflict harm, but to safeguard my own well-being with the potential capacity to inflict harm against those who would threaten it. That is the distinction. Therein, it is all about preparedness.

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