"We have lost our ambition, our imagination, and our willingness to do the things that built the Golden Gate Bridge" - Barack Obama (aka President Malaise)
Pitch in with the Prince William Young Republicans and help defeat Obama in 2012!
PWCBOCS Passes On Funding Illegal Alien Crackdown
By Greg L | 18 December 2007 | Prince William County | 172 Comments
I’m hearing that the Prince William Board of County Supervisors left off a budget item in their deliberations today — any funding for implementing the rule of law resolution that was passed on July 10th. I seem to recall a number of citizens saying this should receive funding priority, but for some reason this is going to be pushed back as a supplemental appropriation to compete with all the other post-budget funding requests.
Somehow, the term “priority” didn’t quite get understood by the board. Readers might want to help the board understand what is meant by this term by emailing them at bocs@pwcgov.org.
The opinions expressed here are solely the views of the author, and not representative of the position of any organization, political party, doughnut shop, knitting guild, or waste recycling facility, but may be correctly attributed to the Vast Right-Wing Conspiracy. If anything in the above article has offended you, please click here to receive an immediate apology.
You can follow the discussion through the Comments feed.
172 Comments
Views: 2533
Loading ...
Shocker! Corey Stewart took you for a ride!
Did you really trust that the Board would stand behind the campaign rhetoric once the votes were counted on November 6? They got their headlines. Corey got on CNN. The electorate was whipped into a frenzy. Now, with the holidays to distract everyone and cold weather closing in, they can quietly let the issue slip away.
I’m sure Stewart and his band of merry men have all the excuses lined up already…
“Property tax revenues aren’t where we thought they’d be…”
“Schools and roads are eating up more than we anticipated…”
“We expected more federal and state assistance. Without that aid, we just don’t know where the funds will come from…”
and so on…
Hate to say “I told you so,” but I recall several regular commenters (including myself) noted that passing the resolution was really easy and that it was the funding that would be the true test. We noted that any hard funding decisions were purposefully postponed for discussion *after* the general election and posited that this was well-calculated.
Regardless….
the “electorate” still doesnt want illegal aliens here..there is nothing anyone can say about that. I dont welcome them, I hope they hit the street. In my view the only “rights” they’ll ever have end at the border.
in a few years when this county is completely overrun with illegals I’ll not be around to hear your bitching..I’ll be gone…probably back to arizona where sheriff joe has the right idea, they’ll probably be cleared out by then.
Josh
My family and I will leave if nothing is done soon. I am very disappointed to hear this. It sure does look like they listened to the citizens long enough to get re-elected and now….nothing!
Should be if something isn’t done soon, we will leave PWC.
Oh boy - I told you before. Stewart was using you. He knew you were ripe for picking. You took the bait. Eat it!
If all of the people who don’t like illegals leave PWC leaving only the liberals, our problem will be “gone”. It’s another approach.
NO comment.
“If all of the people who don’t like illegals leave PWC leaving only the liberals, our problem will be “gone”. It’s another approach.”
No, the problem will still be here. You’ll just have no one to fight it.
Yeah you are all going to “try” and leave. No one wants to move to PWC so how are you going to sell your houses and leave? The property value is continuing to fall. I guess my real question is are you willing to sell it for 70% of it’s worth?
maybe we should wait until we can sell our property for 30% of it’s worth!!
That’s still more than double what I paid for it.
Remember, if you manage to sell your house you will have to pay the NVTA tax.
Anonymous, your posts of 5:56 and 6:15 just makes everyones point on here. What an idiot you are! By the way, don’t ask for an apolgy because I am all out of them. You truly are an idiot. By the way, we have way to many anonymous people on here. Would someone pleeease change their name.
Feeding frenzy already. Geesh.
Details! Details! Then feed!
Here is an idea… ask the PWCBOS why they delayed the funding before you leap to a conclusion…
Facts first!!!!!!!!!!!!
One Voice,
I was counting down your arrival….show me WHAT money ( half smile)
redawn said on 13 Dec 2007 at 3:16 pm:
http://www.manassasjm.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=MJM%2FMGArticle%2FWPN_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&cid=1173353845424&rendermode=preview&path=!news
# redawn said on 13 Dec 2007 at 7:18 pm:
Alert!
You thought things were bad enough with the housing market and the stupid and UNFAIR abuser fees.( to be nice)
Starting in January of 08 the Grantor tax increase to $5.00 per $1000.00 but what is not in this article is the increase from $1.00 to $5.00
http://www.enovahomes.com/blogs/nova_market/archive/2007/11/20/grantor-s-tax-increases-jan-2008.aspx
# redawn said on 14 Dec 2007 at 4:59 pm:
Repeal the “Farewell Tax” petition
http://www.petitiononline.com/Grantor/petition.html
You supporters of illegals should not pull a claire on this issue, lets just wait to see how this plays out.
They delayed the funding because they don’t have the money.
You all put him in with your voting,
Now Corey’s resolve is eroding,
His crackdown so great, turned unfunded mandate,
in spite of your misplaced emoting.
you got USED. stewart worked up your racist frenzy and sold you OUTTTTTTTT.
karma hurts–hatred and ignorance comes full circle. Way to be tools to get re-elected in the middle of a year where republicans should have been punished for their irresponsibility….
again, we are PWC and we are here to stay–Hispanic citizens and reasidents, even the undocumented….
VIVA LA RAZA EN LOS ESTADOS UNIDOS!!!
I have this song in my head
Journey : Who’s crying now ( fighting for America with love and desire…)
It’s been a mystery
And still they try to see
Why somethin’ good can hurt so bad
Caught on a one-way streets
The taste of bittersweet
Love will survive somehow, some way
One love feeds the fire
One heart burns desire
Wonder who’s cryin’ now
Two hearts born to run
Who’ll be the lonely one
Wonder who’s cryin’ now
So many stormy nights
So many wrongs or rights
Neither could change
Their headstrong ways
And in a lover’s rage
They tore another page
The fightin’ is worth
The love they save
One love feeds the fire
One heart burns desire
Wonder who’s cryin’ now
Two hearts born to run
Who’ll be the lonely one
Wonder who’s cryin’ now
Only so many tears you can cry
‘Til the heartache is over
And now you can say your love
Will never die
Whoooooa-oh-whoa
Whoooa-oh
Ooooooh-whoa, ooh-whooa
One love feeds the fire
One heart burns desire
Wonder who’s cryin’ now
Two hearts born to run
Who’ll be the lonely one
Wonder who’s cryin’ now
BOCS Synopsis:
The purpose of the meeting was to give the CXO direction to prepare a proposed 2009 budget. The BOCS agreed to a tax increase of up to $1.008. They also agreed to include immigration on top of the $1.008. This is all at the investigative stage. The final tax increase or no increase will be voted on in April. The current tax rate is $.78. There is plenty of time to make your opinions known.
Today’s vote on this was:
For: Caddigan, Jenkins, May, Barg
Against: Covington, Stirrup, Stewart
Not Voting: Nohe
Low priority was placed on immigration. It was only briefly discussed at the end of the meeting. Stewart, Stirrup and Covington wanted a lower tax ceiling with all the same items. The $1.008 will result in additional staff layoffs and no additional Neighborhood Services staffing.
The big concerns are the 11th high school which might not be built, lowest teacher salaries in the region and continued staff layoffs although demands on services are increasing.
Dolph, Thanks for the info. I’ve been digging but haven’t found much.
We must put more pressure on the supervisors. We need to turn the heat up. This isn’t going to be easy, but together we can make a difference.
I sent them all an email and I look forward to their responses.
It ain’t over ’til the fat lady sings.
[Yes I know that’s politically incorrect, but it is an appropriate proverb]
es_la_ley said on 18 Dec 2007 at 7:32 pm:
Forget the PC - we’re beyond that - and you are right!
Mexicans moving to Canada ( the title of the video, not my words)
12-15-2007http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxkGmFnbqH4&feature=PlayList&p=76628A2C165B2880&index=24
PC is a big part of the problem we are faced with today.
es_la_ley,
It definately ain’t over yet.
starryflights,
Please, keep us updated on your responses. I’m working on a little something for each of our Supervisors too.
*******************
I would urge all to conatact the entire BOS. They are each elected to represent their district, but they all must act for the good of the entire county. We need to encourage Supervisors and let them know they have the support of the legal citizens. That’s right the legal citizens that got them on the board to begin with.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxkGmFnbqH4&feature=PlayList&p=76628A2C165B2880&index=24
Dolph I’d like to add a little clarification. The vote reflects whether staff was to prepare a budget based on a particular package (which did not include funding any illegal immigration measures). That is presumably why Stewart, Stirrup and Covington voted against it. I found there to be considerable discussion by the BOCS at the end, led by Corey Stewart, as to how they may fully fund the illegal immigration measures (none of the staff-proposed budget alternatives included full funding). It was said many times during the discussion that this was NOT the final budget vote, just a suggestion for staff to use for budget development.
So to those who are bad mouthing Corey on this thread, you need to cut him some slack and look to those who voted FOR the package for someone to castigate.
“About This Video
Pat identifies the problems and has the answers… (more)
Added: December 10, 2007
Pat identifies the problems and has the answers.
Sadly, the USA is at the most critical point in its history and if we don’t turn it around from the path it’s on, the country - as we know it - is doomed.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VALL26CPeyg
redawn said on 18 Dec 2007 at 7:53 pm
Good video. Very telling.
Anonymous said on 18 Dec 2007 at 6:15 pm:
“Yeah you are all going to “try” and leave. No one wants to move to PWC so how are you going to sell your houses and leave? The property value is continuing to fall. I guess my real question is are you willing to sell it for 70% of it’s worth?”
Real estate throughout the region is worth FAR less than that in reality and it would be properly valued if prices and assessments hadn’t been artificially inflated by “creative” financing and greedy realtors, developers, and lenders. Hopefully, the prices will come down to the level where they should be and developers will stop glutting the market with poorly constructed, overpriced houses. Anonymous, your comment is truly ignorant.
redawn said on 18 Dec 2007 at 7:53 pm:
Redawn,
Thanks for that youtube. I have to laugh Canada getting 20 “new arrivals” per day. How about the our 4,500 per day?
BTW-Your youtube selection is much better than that Journey stuff.:) Along those lines, it’s not from my favorite genre by any means, I’ve been thinking of the song.”Everybody Wants To Rule The World”~Tears for Fears.. Just a quick blurb.
Help me make the most
Of freedom and of pleasure
Nothing ever lasts forever
Everybody wants to rule the world
Is Stewart Kopko in drag?
AWCheney said on 18 Dec 2007 at 8:23 pm:
I’m in total agreement with your comments. I really liked this part…Hopefully, the prices will come down to the level where they should be and developers will stop glutting the market with poorly constructed, overpriced houses. Anonymous, your comment is truly ignorant.
I’ll take my 40 year old Hylton house anyday over a new one built today. I’m very pleased to say one foreclosed property on the next block has been sold. The house that had the squatters next door to my mom has had quite a few lookers. It’s an excellent time for teachers, law enforcement, firefighters, and other county employees, etc. to purchase home at these prices.
I really wish the Anonymous’s would pick a name or throw a number/character after the Anonymous. They get pretty confusing and there’s too many. I might take heat because I use a screen name, but all know I’m no coward when comes to revealing my legal name.
Lafayette,
“BTW-Your youtube selection is much better than that Journey stuff.:) Along those lines, it’s not from my favorite genre by any means, I’ve been thinking of the song.”Everybody Wants To Rule The World”~Tears for Fears.. Just a quick blurb”
Just for that…
Don’t stop believing, as the Wheel in the Sky keeps on turning, I am just trying to keep the Lights on in the City,Faithfully.
Tears for fears…that is a good one…. but we can’t SAVE the world…..we have to start with OUR Country….
redawn,
What are you talking about let’s start with our native county!
es_la_ley & manassascityresident
” es_la_ley said on 18 Dec 2007 at 7:32 pm:
It ain’t over ’til the fat lady sings.
[Yes I know that’s politically incorrect, but it is an appropriate proverb]
manassascityresident said on 18 Dec 2007 at 7:42 pm
es_la_ley said on 18 Dec 2007 at 7:32 pm:
Forget the PC - we’re beyond that - and you are right!”
Well, I hope you are not talking about Lady Justice singing, she is blind, even to the country she is to protect! (with all that she is ingesting now may make her fat….:)
” Lafayette said on 18 Dec 2007 at 8:44 pm:
redawn,
What are you talking about let’s start with our native county! :)”
Yes, we and all other cities counties alike need to as the same thing: Ask not what your Country( county/city/town) can do for you, but what you can do for your Country ( county/city/town)
I agree G-man. I intended for my summary to be value neutral. Thanks for clarifying. It was a lot to absorb and I was drifting off towards the end. We have serious money problems in the county. No one will be totally happy with the outcome.
justice -
are you talking about Mexicans being literally killed by Americans?
I always said you guys were getting played by the pols. But isn’t this the best of all worlds? The most unprincipled pols got your votes and kept their jobs in a one-issue campaign that enabled them to ignore all the tough, real issues. You got to ventilate. Everyone felt really great. Now we move on.
Oh - I forgot the really good part: one of the huge problems with the “who-can-bash-the-wetbacks-hardest” campaign was that these silly efforts to turn local governments into the INS (or whatever they are these days) was the waste of public monies problem. If the reports are accurate that now, after your votes have been harvested, the pols are slowing down in the face of general hard times on the tax collection front, everyone’s a winner. We’ve had all the electoral advantages of irresonsible public policy and liberal anti-constitution bashing, but - mirabile dictu - we may not have to really pay the bill.
This certainily wouldn’t have happened if Chris Royse was elected.
Even if Chris Royse had been elected, he would not have been sitting there today.
I would expect the Board to follow through on funding. The repercussions would be a disaster for them if they didn’t. Look what happened to Gray Davis in California. Immigration is one of those issues where people are up in arms.
Well, they haven’t paid for this years immigration stuff yet so what happens remains to be seen and as Gman said this is not a final budget, just telling the Executive how to put together some options.
Folks, the larger issue, yes, there is one, is the crumbling CIP and the schools. We have terrible overcrowding and the lowest paid teachers around. Who is going to want to live here? Even county employees, firefighters and policeman, Lafayette will want good schools for their kids. They will go to Stafford and Faquier. Word spreads fast in the military about these situations………
We wouldn’t be in this financial mess if we would stop subsidizing illegal immigrants continued criminal behavior; paying for their hospital bills, their incarceration, their food stamps, their anchor babies, et al. We simply don’t have the money to continue with the status quo. It’s time to cut the benefits to anyone that isn’t a citizen. No medical, no education, no food stamps, no nada. Too bad that will never happen. Pitchforks and common people I have always said are the only two things that can solve this problem. Politicians can’t and won’t. I hope I am wrong but I hardly ever am…
…but still, regardless of the cost, most of us want them outta here, gone, bye bye!! Most important things first!!
park’d
You are right. The less illegals in the county and two cities that we are supporting, the less services we’d have to provide, and less overcrowding in our schools and emergency rooms. The “red carpet” must get rolled up to keep the illegals from coming here in the first place. Oh, I almost forgot this one. THe employers must stop hiring the illegals for cheap labor.The less illegals we have draining the local jurisdictions will result in a more managable budget.
Regarding the inmates the get three meals, air/heating, and a “bed”, and bet there are some truly “hard working” folks that don’t have all of those comforts each and everyday for themselves and their families.
NADA MAS ILLEGALS!!
Park’d: Illegals are not eligible for food stamps.
NOVA
If illegals have stolen someone’s identity or has fake documents, or purchased ID’s they could very well get these benefits.
All*Here’s a little something from Mexico itself..
Nearly 7 in 10 Mexican Migrants Enters U.S. Illegally, Says Mexico
Wednesday, December 19, 2007
Fox News
MEXICO CITY —
The Mexican government reported the results of recent studies on Tuesday showing that 68 percent of Mexicans who migrate or try to migrate to the United States do so without documents and 55 percent of them hire immigrant smugglers.
The report, timed to coincide with the U.N. International Migrants Day, also noted that the Mexican-born population living in the United States increased from about 800,000 in 1970 to more than 11 million in 2006.
The majority of Mexicans now living in the United States — 6.2 million — are undocumented, according to the report, which was based on surveys of migrants and information from the government’s National Population Council.
Almost 30 million people in the United are direct descendants of Mexico migrants, the report stated.
In contrast, the report said the immigrant population in Mexico is quite small and has not experienced rapid growth.
The number of foreign residents in Mexico grew from 340,000 people en 1990, or about 0.42 percent of the population at the time, to about 493,000 in 2000, or about 0.5 percent, the last year for which data is available.
More than two-thirds of the foreign residents are from the United States, and many of those are of Mexican extraction.
You saw the cost savings generated when stopping services to illegals. They are a problem in many ways, but when it comes to county funding issues, they have a very small impact. Pleeeeeaaasseee - open your eyes to the problems we have. There are two - funding and illegals. You need the first to solve the second. The first will impact you and your families for a decade or more. Calling negative attention to ourselves only worsens the first part. Granted illegals may prevent some from moving here BUT THAT”S NOT THE ONLY PROBLEM.
If all illegals left today, we would still have a real estate market at 14% lower with these funding problems. They did not cause the real estate slump. They have an impact but a small one.
Stay away from single issues - it keeps you from watching the horizon for what’s coming.
Dolph-
I disagree–with Royse staring at them while they cast their votes they would have voted differently. They voted the way they did because they know Royse is not taking office today in which he would actually do what he said he would do. The apologist will gut the measure by not funding it. The other board members that voted for this resolution will hide behind the budget woes of the county. So I offer this suggestion that we cut police, fire, and teachers to fund this resolution. While we are at it why don’t we cut old people’s programs also? Why have I coldly targeted these precious programs??? That’s where we will be accused by Principi, little (or not so little) sloth Nohe and lipstick pig Caddigan and Mike “I wish I had a backbone” May of cutting these budget items. So let’s be honest and cut them before they cry us a river about them. We don’t need the blue bird bus program–what we need is this resolution funded. Nothing more nothing less
Nova, that is correct, however, I contacted the foodstamp organization and asked how they prevent illegals from getting them….they said that they cannot prevent them from using a child from getting them for them. So there we have it….the classic “anchor baby” loophole in action! Certainly if a large number of illegals live in a single bunk house and use their “anchors” to acquire foodstamps….no one in the entire house would need to buy food! Wow…what a great deal huh? All at the legal taxpayer’s expense!
The Patriot (Got E-Verify?) said on 19 Dec 2007 at 8:24 am:
Nova, that is correct, however, I contacted the foodstamp organization and asked how they prevent illegals from getting them….they said that they cannot prevent them from using a child from getting them for them. So there we have it….the classic “anchor baby” loophole in action! Certainly if a large number of illegals live in a single bunk house and use their “anchors” to acquire foodstamps….no one in the entire house would need to buy food! Wow…what a great deal huh? All at the legal taxpayer’s expense!
That’s how they play the system and the federal government won’t do a damn thing about it (and never will.)
If you were moving to Northern Virginia (as many Military, Civil Servants, and Contractors do)… if you were a business looking for a home in the D.C. Metro area, a family contemplating a move to the suburbs, or simply looking for a place in the Country and Goggled PWC, do you honestly think you wound consider living here?
Sorry folks, it will take PWC years to recover from the reputation created by the Immigration Resolution and surrounding publicity. While the housing market crash had many causes, I would suspect that the “rule of law” initiative has probably cut another 10-20% off of the price of a PWC house for a few reasons:
1. I doubt any legal Hispanic (or many other minorities of color) would ever consider moving here. Hispanics alone count for 20% of the population. Add other minorities, and you just reduced the available buyer’s market significantly.
2. Reading this blog and watching the publicity surrounding the “rule of law”, one would think we are in the middle of a crime spree (FYI, I read MJM every morning… it’s not generally Hispanics engaged in armed robberies these days. They are more likely the victim.)
3. Sorry folks; however, in the context of our history (slavery, segregation, Rebel flags, eugenics, misogamy laws, etc.) it’s hard to make a case against a minority in Virginia without resurrecting the feeling that we are still part of the “old south.” When opting for a place to raise a family, the “old south” I’m talking about doesn’t generally come to mind.
4. Many of the dialogs about neighborhood problems make PWC sound like one big ghetto. We all know that’s simply not true.
Oh, and taxes are going up to make up the difference… another real draw to folks looking for a place to live.
Frankly, I would say PWC looses points for style. It hasn’t taken a low key political approach to a very volatile issue opting instead to inflame passions in the name of votes (and, ironically, now that the election is over the issue is probably dead from a BOCS perspective). I would say PWC is being hoisted on its own petard. We have successfully erased twenty years of work rebuilding our reputation as a modern progressive County to rejoin the “infamy” list of places a lot of people just wouldn’t like to live (ironically, again, that apparently includes many of the people responsible for the situation).
NoVA Scout said on 19 Dec 2007 at 8:06 am:
Park’d: Illegals are not eligible for food stamps.
Of courrrse they are not. Surrrre, and I am a Chinese jet pilot too.
If you think that illegals are not getting food stamps in mass quantities through legal or illegal means then you are not worthy of participating in any discussion here. Stolen ID’s, anchor babies, bribes, corrupt state employees are only a few examples of how they get them.
Ohh and Jimmy, people don’t want to live here because they know it is a haven for illegal aliens. All the people I talk to or know don’t want to live here because they see this entire area as a sanctuary area and a wild west with no control over what they see as an invasion. They don’t see PWC as a racist county where white people ride around on horses persecuting anyone who is brown like you would try and get us to believe. They simply don’t want to live here because living here is like living in a corrupt, dirty, trashed out 3rd world Latin American country. People with means don’t want their kids to have to go to schools like that where nobody speaks English, gangs are prevalent, teachers are low quality because their pay is low, etc, etc. Your spin makes me chuckle.
Ride around in my 4 year old town home development where trash on the grass is rampant, people live 10 to a house, cars have broken windows for months on end, thug kids with colors playing soccer in the middle of the street. Would you want your kids to grow up in an environment like that? If my neighborhood hadn’t become dilapidated within 3 years time and I was looking for a home and saw this, I would turn around as fast as I could and be on 28 North as quick as the car would take me. I can assure you that the resolution, if anything, has brought more people back to this county than it ran out and the few that it did run out were the ones that it was designed to run out.
I thought this was about ensuring that people that are here legally. What does the following have to do with anyone’s status as a legal or illegal resident? Do you know that these people are illegal, or are you just assuming based on your own perception of how a legal resident would look or behave?
“…living here is like living in a corrupt, dirty, trashed out 3rd world Latin American country. People with means don’t want their kids to have to go to schools like that where nobody speaks English, gangs are prevalent,”
@ park’d
Those that don’t see a problem just haven’t had their neighborhoods invaded yet. I’d bet dollars for doughnuts they live in mostly segregated enclaves in which the only minorities you see are the ones servicing them. It’s the hypocracy that drives me nuts. They’re all full of crap.
They drive through Manassas like tourists on safari with their windows rolled up staring and pointing.
@ Jimmy Neutron
LaLa land called. It wants you back.
The only business we’ll be attracting without the resolution are ones like Swift Foods. Of course, I know you need some part of Northern VA to house your help and keep your wallet fat. God forbid they come to your neck of the woods.
Yeah Pete, I’m sure that none of the at least 1200% increase in Hispanics in my town are illegal. None of the ones that don’t speak a single word of English, skulk around the side of my house staring at the ground to get to the rooms for rent in the basement at my next door neighbor’s townhouse, close the front door as soon as I pull up just like clock work are illegal. None at all…
Come on man! Use some common sense. We both know that at least 50% of the influx in Hispanics in the past 3 years are illegals and most likely more. The demographics stats show us at least this much. It doesn’t take a racist or a rocket scientist to see that. This country and particularly this county and the 2 cities have a huge unchecked illegal problem which is leading to widespread, rapid and rampant cultural upheaval.
“I’d bet dollars for doughnuts they live in mostly segregated enclaves in which the only minorities you see are the ones servicing them.”
Are we talking illegal immigration or minorities?
The BOCS should be advised that one way or another, we’re taking this County back.
Thank you One Voice for your comment on 19 Dec 2007 at 8:15 am. I am not an illegal alien apologist and understand the frustration so many feel regarding the issue. But I’m also a realists and a pragmatist.
The declining property values and corresponding decrease in revenue available for funding county programs is not solely to be laid at the feet of illegal immigrants. Kicking out all of the illegal immigrants tomorrow would still leave our schools overcrowded, our teachers underpaid, our roads jammed with cars, and our critical infrastructure lacking. The programs and services cut by the rule of law resolution will result in a pittance of savings in the county budget. The additional enforcement and legal costs will far outweigh any immediate, measurable benefit.
I can tell you from first-hand experience that for many families moving to PWC, the most important issue to them is not whether their neighbors are illegal or not but whether their children will be in decent schools with good teachers. When businesses look at relocating to an area, the ratings and performance of the local schools are among the first factors they look at (in addition to the cost of real estate for their operations, the tax rate on businesses, and the availability of a qualified workforce).
Given tradeoffs between funding the rule of law resolution or building the Kettle Run high school, the county would be much better served building the school. Given the choice between a dedicated immigration enforcement division in the police department or competitive teacher salaries, the county (and its citizens) would be much better served by attracting and retaining high-quality teachers.
The reality is that we face some severe economic realities that are only in very small part a direct result of illegals in our midst. The sooner we wake up to this reality and start to really think about our priorities instead of wasting our time pontificating on foodstamps (a Federal program outside the purview of PWC control) and anchor babies (also a Federal issue outside the purview of PWC), the sooner we may be able to come up with some real, workable solutions that address all the needs of our community, not just a singular focus mired in overtones of nativism and xenophobia.
Danlyn– Yes, I have a perception of how a citizen should look, speak and behave. You got a problem with that?
This current crop of illegal aliens seem bent on bringing their third world ways with them and thus trashing our communities. A country can absorb only so much of the uneducated, illiterate, uncivilized lumpenproletariat who does not comprehend the rule of law.
Nova- Are you saying illegal aliens are not receiving food stamps? Prove it. Why are all the signs written in Spanish re: food stamps and WIC?
Only illegals speak Spanish? Do us all a favor and just stop talking. It justs validates the negative perception
When the BOCS gets down to deciding what is important to the majority of citizens in this county, they should consider that we’ve told them….schools, roads, and libraries. These are issues we’ve supported through our VOTES, not funding the immigration resolution. Remember the referenda? It may not be possible to finance all of these improvements immediately, but they should be the priorities along with teacher salaries.
Wow monti, nice word! Had to look that one up.
Turn PW Blue: Just about everything you wrote is your opinion only. Those of us on the front lines know the real costs and have to live amongst the real reasons for our economic troubles and community blight every day of the week. I could take every line in your post and dissect it word for word for what it is but I have already done things like that in the past and don’t want to waste my time on it.
monticup
The “Rule of Law” in the Constitution provides that we have free speech, and by judicial interpretation, freedom of expression. That seems directly at odds with your contention that a citizen should look, speak, and behave to your liking.
Immigration laws were not even considered in the development of the Constitution, and can be changed to fit the liking of particular interests.
The Constitution is what gives life to this country, and while not unchangeable, it is the foundation upon which America is based.
Breaking the former can be a legitimate protest of an unfair or misdirected initiative, and can lead to great improvements.
Breaking the latter is an affront to the very idea of America.
Your post illustrates which one you and the “Rule of Law” folks have more respect, or use, for.
Turn PW Blue,
The school situation will become increasingly critical as the boomers that were drawn to the county back in the 60’s and 70’s when PW was the fastest growing county in the entire nation leave the system in droves. They will leave because the salaries are not competitive and the pressures arising from NCLB and other such BS.
Who will replace these teachers? General education might be ok for a while but NCLB insists on highly qualified teachers which means being fully certified in what you teach. Check out the vacancy list for PW Co. Special Ed and ESOL teachers are always in short supply. The news gets worse.
Where citizens really need to worry is in math and science. What person with a degree in math or science would want a job with non-competitive pay in a school system when they could make much more money with government or the private sector? Not many. Substitute teachers are already being used to fill these positions. Not a great outlook for Prince William Co, especially when the end result is your school being rated as a failed school by the federal government.
Turn PW Blue is correct in all respects on this issue. He just didn’t tell the whole story.
http://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/saudi_border_fence/2007/12/02/53900.html
“Anyone wanting to slip illegally into Saudi Arabia would be forced to: climb a series of high sand berms; scale a high fence girded with razor wire on top and bottom; creep along a 50-yard stretch of no-man’s land; clamber over a barbed-wire pyramid; cross another open 50 yards; and shinny over a second barbed-wired fence all while avoiding detection by ultraviolet sensors, night vision cameras, buried movement sensors and patrol dogs.”
I don’t know anonymoustoo. I think that illegal immigration is THE top issue for most people (who aren’t benefiting from illegal immigration at least) in the area. If it’s not the top issue then it’s running a close 2nd. I’m sure if you held a referendum on cracking down on illegal immigration that it would pass overwhelmingly. I know you guys/gals that lean to the left like to think that this issue is just some racist, politically driven thing that is the flavor of the month to get certain pols reelected, but what you fail to realize is the scope of this grass roots movement. People all over the country are seriously pissed and this WILL be the hotbed issue of the 2008 Presidential Election. The next President will be voted in based on his stance on this issue (and no, Hillary doesn’t stand a chance). This is not going away no matter how much you think it should.
park’d:
Polling shows otherwise (at least in national polling–I’m not able to find any recent local polling on the subject). When asked to rank what was most important, the Iraq War is first (36%), the economy is second (16%), healthcare third (15%), and illegal immigration fourth (10%).
(Source: http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/Top_News/2007/12/10/poll_iraq_tops_election_issues/1911/)
The fact that a referendum would pass is irrelevant to gauging how important it is in people’s minds. I’m sure a referendum on whether dogs should be banned from defecating on other people’s property would pass too, but that doesn’t mean it’s the most important issue on people’s minds.
I also think you misinterpret the “Left.” While I don’t speak for all with a progressive bent, I will tell you that I am concerned about illegal immigration and I do understand that it is an issue that needs to be addressed in some manner. Where I find issue, though, is the single-minded focus on this issue above all else. Understanding we have limited resources and can’t address every single issue that is on people’s minds doesn’t mean I’m advocating ignoring the problem but rather that our limited resources need to be used in a manner that provides the greatest return.
I agree 100% with Park’d! Just look at the reaction from all over the country when the amnesty bill tried to get passed. The liberal (and heavily biased) media is trying to keep things under the table by not broadcasting anything that is against illegal immigration. The hosts of the presidential debates are avoiding the illegal immigration issue by not asking questions related to it. The people, however, know that this is going on. Just look at all the forums all over the place that are addressing this issue (because the biased media is not).
Park’d, which is more important in addressing your (personal “your”) problems in a very tight budget cycle …having enough staff for Neighborhood Services or funding the police portion of the resolution? Remember that other services cut by the resolution are minimal. I realize you’re not a county resident, but which would make a bigger impact on your immediate neighborhood?
Patriot (re your 19 Dec 2007 at 11:44 am post):
The Saudis refer to their country as “ah Segin al ahchbar” - the Greatest Prison. Looks like they’re building a fence worthy of such a moniker.
This vote was nothing but game playing. First we need to get rid of Gerhardt.
He can not come up with straight answers. He sure can’t tell the difference on where to start with a budget. He wants a dollar figure,then a budget will be prepared,which will probably be the scraping of the barrel. As then all these other things can be added on with a higher tax rate. Then the Board can say it wasn’t them who caused the high increase of the Rate.
Why don;t they start with the Rate today and show us what we get for that.
Then add in the illegal issues that surely has been shown is a priority.
Examine all Departments,eliminate the Discresinary funds.(Have you seen Barg giving away thousands of dollars this past month.?
There is another fund that each are given and this needs to be eliminated.
How can we even start to do what the Park Authority wants?
How can we even suggest Pre Kindergarten?
The people want enforcement of the illegals that are ruining our way of life in our neighborhoods.
Not the legal Immigrants but the illegal.
I just sent an e-mail to the Board. Very disappointing news, though not surprising. It was pretty apparent by their recent newsletter that most of them just wanted to move beyond this “dirty business” of illegal immigration. This is politics as usual. Each member has their own agenda, and some really don’t care what the average “legal voter” has to say. Though, I really disagree with some of the entries that say that we’ve been had by Corey Stewart. I really felt that this was an important issue to him, and obviously Stirrup. But, with that said, Stewart probably doesn’t have the votes needed to get something done. Again, we citizens will be forced to put the heat on the politicians. Probably, to no avail. But, it’s worth the effort. I really like how they voted to possibly raise the tax rate, but at the same time trash the illegal alien issue. Classic. Many voters said that they had no problem paying more taxes if the money went to funding the illegal immigration “crackdown.” But, the way it looks now my tax increase will go towards funding one of the pet projects of Caddigan or Jenkins. Many thanks to BVBL for keeping us current on this issue. I just received a response from Nohe…..
Advocator, they may be their “reason” for the fence. We all know that is not our “reason” for the fence! My point with the article is….if there is a will to do something…it can be done!
Earth to Woodbridge, Earth to Woodbridge:
Craig Gerhart is a county employee. He does what his bosses tell him to do. His bosses are the BOCS. They work back and forth. They tell him what they want and he reports back to them using his managerial expertise and his directives from them. This is not a single dimensional process.
Unless you are I viewed different meetings, most of the meeting was a budget presentation looking at different scenarios with different tax rates applied. The current standard cannot be a benchmark because of the 14% drop in county assessments.
Mr. Gerhart, regardless of the opinions expressed here, is a highly sought after individual in the land of municipal governments. He brings a wide range of skills to Prince William County and has a very good reputation nationally.
Perhaps we should fire him and see how many different municipalities jump at the chance to hire him, probably at twice the salary he receives from us.
… and see if ANYONE who is qualified for the job would actually apply…
[reference above comments on whether anyone would move here]
How about I tell you that where I live we have no illegal problem. My neighborhood is nice and neat. Paying for illegal immigration enforcement is not necessary for me to enjoy a pleasant quality of life. My top priority is the Montclair Library and Schools.
Maybe I should drum up some single issue folks and we slam all the supervisors with these as our top priorities. Lots of the Brentville folks might replace the Montclair Library with the Kettle Run HS.
I would prefer they not spend the $$$ on illegal immigration until these preferred projects of mine are funded.
Since the problems are primarily in the Gainesville district and the rest of us are too stupid to understand it as we’ve been told repeatedly, I think we should just say, “you are right”. Then we will call our supervisors with our priorities. Since you can’t see beyond your own issues to any others, and Westgate/Sudley is responsible for this resolution and resulting expense, then why on earth should MY taxes support YOUR issues over MY priorities?
That’s what I get from these posts. Honestly get over yourselves.
monti, Be careful my friend.
American Heritage Dictionary
lum·pen·pro·le·tar·i·at (lŭm’pən-prō’lĭ-târ’ē-ət, lŏŏm’-) Pronunciation Key
n.
1. The lowest, most degraded stratum of the proletariat. Used originally in Marxist theory to describe those members of the proletariat, especially criminals, vagrants, and the unemployed, who lacked class consciousness.
2. The underclass of a human population.
The second definition will get you called a racists (c; Excellent word!!
Funny Laugh, (@8:22)
Funny ideas also. You sure would be cutting off your nose to spite your face if you cut funding for police, fire and education in favor of ‘the resolution.’ Exactly what DO you think the resolution is going to do for you and how much do you think you are going to save by fully funding it?
Cutting education has already been addressed. However, cutting police? What are you smoking? Cutting fire and rescue? I sure hope your house doesn’t catch fire or that you don’t need emergency services. The real teeth of ‘the resolution’ is the additional police support even though the law enforcement component was adopted separately.
As for the programs for the elderly, I don’t think many little old illegal men and women were using the blue bird bus tours in the first place, so that won’t recoup much income.
Royce didn’t win and I am not so sure him sitting there waiting for Hilda Barg to give up her seat would have had any impact on the others. I have nothing against Royce at all but had he been elected, he has to be sworn in to become the Honorable Mr. Royce before his leadership would have any impact on county government. Yesterday he would have been an ordinary citizen.
Dolph
Anyone who has to resort to name calling - lipstick pig and so forth should not be raised to a higher level by a response from you.
They should simply be dismissed.
The problem here, One Voice, is that the issues are in Westgate / Sudley’s backyard right now. YOU should be concerned that it migrates to your little rich enclave in time. Your community will be at the level of Westgate and Sudley in time. Probably not in the very near future, but soon enough. With that said, I agree projects should be given equal funding and time for negotiating their funds. What shouldn’t happen is the rest of the county give off this air that I am better than you because I live in a certain part of the county that is not immediately affected, therefore your problem is your problem. This is a county wide problem which affects all equally in that the funding for schools and such have to suffer because of the lack of property tax paying citizens, which supports the projects we all want to see done.
When the ILLEGAL aliens are sent out of PWC, the better it will be for ALL!!!
One Voice,
You are right. That was not worthy of a response.
~~splash~~
The problem MEDIC is that a certain element thinks that there are no other issues facing the county and that theirs is most important. If anyone dares to bring up another issue the venom is released.
I am of the thought that I don’t have to touch every drop of the ocean to know it’s wet. I assume that illegals will negatively impact me closer to home at some point and are already in other areas (schools and such). Even thought I can’t see it. I support the resolution and agree it should be funded. I’ve said that over and over. Do I think we should fund it over other county priorities, NO, I don’t. Schools and public safety should come first. I can get to putting this over transporation, because hopefully this is short term. Although it doesn’t impact me, do I want to fund it? Yes, not just becuase it might impact me at some point, but because IT IS NEGATIVELY IMPACTING FELLOW CITIZENS RIGHT NOW. That that altruistic approach is so absent from (feels like) most of the posters here, makes be ill and angry.
My post is only for those that can’t or won’t see beyond their noses and notice that there are many issues and quit seeing the entire world as illegal alien apologists if someone tries to point out another issue. The tone here is nasty, nasty. That this nastiness is not helping the OTHER problem in PWC is too quickly dismissed. Many here are shooting themselves in the foot.
I just had a thought, maybe the LCD here is “nasty” regardless of the issue. Maybe we are more short of CSB mental health therapists than I realized.
Turn PW Blue: From the polls I have seen it is ranking at or near the top in importance. This issue will only balloon between now and this time next year. By next November, Americans will be so fed up with this crap that illegal immigration WILL be the make or break issue. I share your opinion that there are other problems that need to be addressed, but fixing the illegal immigration issue is paramount to the continued existence of this country, its security and the American culture.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/11/21/gop.immigration/index.html
One Voice…
good for you that you don’t have an ILLEGAL alien problem in your “nice and neat” neighborhood. However, that doesn’t mean that an ILLEGAL alien can’t t-bone you on your way to your posh library, or worse, a member of your family (happened to my mother-in-law, then they just took off, she was too disoriented to get a plate number). That doesn’t mean that little Johnny doesn’t get mugged by an ILLEGAL alien on his way home from his “nice and neat” high-school like my little bother did. Just because you live in a “nice and neat” little world doesn’t mean that sooner or later you (or your family) may have an unfortunate experience due to an ILLEGAL alien. The sooner ILLEGAL aliens are out of PWC the better it will be for all of us no matter what kind of neighborhood you live in.
Fed UP, I AGREE with you. Re-read my post.
One Voice…of course! No wonder you don’t think that it is a problem! You aren’t living in it day in and day out like the rest of us! It is easy for you to have your position when you don’t have bunk houses next to yours! YOU ARE RIDICULOUS!
Can you folks READ or does the dull roar in your ears blind you as well. I wrote it in English.
“I am of the thought that I don’t have to touch every drop of the ocean to know it’s wet. I assume that illegals will negatively impact me closer to home at some point and are already in other areas (schools and such). Even thought I can’t see it. I support the resolution and agree it should be funded. I’ve said that over and over. Do I think we should fund it over other county priorities, NO, I don’t. Schools and public safety should come first. I can get to putting this over transporation, because hopefully this is short term. Although it doesn’t impact me, do I want to fund it? Yes, not just becuase it might impact me at some point, but because IT IS NEGATIVELY IMPACTING FELLOW CITIZENS RIGHT NOW. That that altruistic approach is so absent from (feels like) most of the posters here, makes be ill and angry.”
Medic64: Not sure why calling someone part of the underclass of society would be considered racist. Every race/religion/sex/culture has its bums, cretins and bottom feeders. I have known plenty of all white, uneducated, ignorant rednecks that were the worst that humanity has to offer. They would definitely be considered lumpenproletariat. Not a race thing. Definitely a class and culture thing.
My goodness some of you are dense. In case you missed it, One Voice’s post about his “illegal-free enclave” was meant as a tongue-in-cheek example of what so many of you are doing with this issue. OV was trying (I guess unsuccessfully) to point out how silly this single-minded obsession with illegal immigration above all else can be.
Illegal immigration is an important issue and concern worthy of being addressed at all levels of government. But, One Voice’s point (I think–and OV, please correct me if I missed something too) is that there are a LOT of important issues that the PWCBOS will need to face as part of the budget cycle this year. The financial picture for the county is not a rosy, cheerful surplus-driven budget that can do everything everyone wants. There will need to be some tough choices made between seemingly equal investments in the future of the county. To so many of the commenters on this blog, it seems that the only thing we should be looking at is illegal immigration and all else is worthless noise. That is certainly not the case.
Park’d, Patriot, Monticup, et al, while illegal immigration clearly ranks as one of the top issues in the area, schools, public safety, and transportation also are competing for that attention. To use Park’d’s thought process, I bet if you had a referendum on whether we should build more schools to relieve overcrowding and raise teacher salaries to be competitive with surrounding jurisdictions, it would pass with overwhelming margins.
If there were people around colored green or bright blue, I would have a continual primitive awareness of the difference between us, way down on that watchful animal level which is a caveman heritage. But I would cherish the ones who came through as solid folk, and avoid the slobs and fools are bores as diligently as I avoid white slobs and fools and bores.
One Voice said: “Do I think we should fund it over other county priorities, NO, I don’t. Schools and public safety should come first.”
What in the world do you think has a MAJOR impact on these items? Hmmm….think really really really hard….ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION!!!!!
ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION is the root of alot of our problems. We must get rid of the “root”.
Before you say…we have always had problems with schools…yada yada yada…I am here to say…no we haven’t. When I first moved to this area almost 10 years ago….our schools were considered excellent establishments. Also, I never really heard of any crimes going on, I never saw the run down areas with trash all over like I do now. Only in the last 5 years…have I witnessed the decline of our area! Coincidence? I think not!
And it is not just our area! Cities around our entire country are suffering the same due to illegal immigration. This cannot be denied!
Turn PW Blue
Thanks. My whole point was if some of us can appreciate their pain without experiencing it first hand why can’ they be more open to other issues.
Their responses were a self-fullfilling prophecy, I guess.
Without good schools, it won’t matter if there are illegals here or not (even if you don’t have kids in the schools). The county will become a wasteland.
The Private Legal Fund created by the Board for the purpose of defending the County against litigation because of the adoption of the ‘Immigration Resolution’ has only $540. Can some of you that are so gun-ho about this resolution contribute some cash?
How can you have good schools when they are being flooded with kids that don’t speak English, gangs from south of the border, and a subset of a culture that generally has no regard for education in the first place? This is sort of a catch22. You guys want good schools yet you aren’t willing to do what it takes to get good schools. Cleaning out the burden on those schools is the first and best place to start. A school can never excel if it has to spend million of dollars of its budget on ESOL and gang enforcement. Honestly why are we even talking about this?? Fix the illegal problem and the rest of the problems will fix themselves or at the very least be greatly alleviated.
One Voice and Turn PW,
OK, I understand your position and I understand that other projects have to be funded.
Let’s look at a few things here, if the ILLEGAL aliens were to be removed from PWC:
1) Don’t you think the schools would be less crowded with ILLEGAL alien children and anchor babies? Wouldn’t this have a positive impact on the quality of education?
2) Less time would be spent by Police using the 287(g) tactics?
Wouldn’t this have a positive impact on decreasing crime since they would be on the street patrolling instead of researching the possible ILLEGAL status of a person?
3) Better neighborhoods for all. Wouldn’t this help improve people coming to PWC which in turn raises the tax base which in turn helps fund the projects you and others see as priority?
Once the multi family housing has been stopped, families that will take only their fair share and pay their way will inhabit those same houses increasing the tax base significantly.
I understand your post and I see your point, but if the ILLEGAL alien issue isn’t dealt with in a timely fashion, it will get a foot hold and be even tougher to remove later on. As Barney Fife use to say, “We gotta nip this in the bud.”
_________________________________________________
park’d, That was tongue in cheek, hence the smiley wink (c;
_________________________________________________
@ Turn PW Blue
“”"My goodness some of you are dense. In case you missed it, One Voice’s post about his “illegal-free enclave” was meant as a tongue-in-cheek example of what so many of you are doing with this issue. OV was trying (I guess unsuccessfully) to point out how silly this single-minded obsession with illegal immigration above all else can be.”"”
What you and One Voice fail to understand is that when your house is NEXT DOOR to a flop house, illegal immigration is the only issue. I would appreciate it if you would be so kind as to belittle us AFTER they move into your neighborhood.
As far as throwing more money at the schools, the most pressing issue in the school system right now is illegal aliens and the burden they place on the school system.
LOL park’d, I hadn’t read your post before I posted mine (c: Seems we are on the same page here. I am willing to show everyone else the book so they can read along (c;
Great minds think alike
Mando: I feel for you brother. The townhouse right next to mine runs a low traffic flop house as well. I have counted at least 10 people that live there and many guests coming and going. They drop trash in my front yard, wear a path in my side yard, park in my 2nd spot and generally are a pain in my a$$.
I agree. $14.2 million for Illegal immigration is fine with me. What’s not fine with me is delaying new schools. Illegal immigration funding buys a quick turnaround on staffing and tools necessary to enforce immediately.
Funding schools takes a bit more time and effort. If they can both fit, fine, if they both need to be shaved, fine perhaps Real Estate will perk up and more money will be available in the summer at the summer budget hearing in August.
The schools need to be built and the teachers for pete’s sake need to be paid a wage better than they are. scuz me, park’d, but PWC teachers are now lower than Manassas Park.
Both issues are necessary to improve PWC. The CIP/School funding issue is huge and must be put in place now to have the school by 2011.
@ park’d
I hear you. I’ve got 2 across the street from my house. Both with open screen doors. One had at least 8 kids in it for about 2 or 3 months. Multiple people complained (those kids had not one iota of parental supervision) and I think social services went out there too many times for the parents liking so they’re gone now. They’ve been replaced by maybe 6 or so adult men. The other one changes residency with the wind. I never recognize the same person for more then a month. At one point there were two todlers there and a freind of mine had to take them out of the street one day. Cars were stopped and honking their horns because the toddlers were playing in the middle of the street and not one adult in site. My freind took them to the back of the house where he heard some music and some guy was back there high as a kite. He assumed it was the father as the guy didn’t speak english.
I don’t give a flyin monkey fart if the Montclair library doesn’t have at least five copies of the newest Harry Potter book.
One Voice,
That is absolutely sickening that teachers in PWC are paid less than the Park.
One Voice said on 19 Dec 2007 at 3:27 pm:
Both issues are necessary to improve PWC. The CIP/School funding issue is huge and must be put in place now to have the school by 2011.
I couldn’t agree more with you on this. I’m sorry I want my cake and eat it to.
corr: TOO
“”"One Voice,
That is absolutely sickening that teachers in PWC are paid less than the Park.”"”
The issue with PWC schools isn’t the funding. The issue is the waste, bureacracy, and incompetence. For every extra dollar spent on the PWC school system, I’d be amazed if 1 cent of it went into teachers’ salaries.
Some have said that Woodbridge schools have seen a decrease in enrollment since the September 30, 2007 hard count which is what school funding is based on. If students dropped off the enrollment forms then the school still keeps the funding. Therefore the county has received the funds for some students that are not in school or possibily in the county as of this date. The cost savings of just a couple hundred students, which is the estimiation of the students withdrawn from PWC school since the September 30th count, will pay for this entire enforcement. Remember the cost of implementation is under $3 million. You would think the supervisors were dealing with $30 million in expenses with yesterday’s actions instead of the $3 million.
Just my Thoughts-
Mando (et al):
The school budget is posted on the PWCS Web site (www.pwcs.edu). I’d suggest you look at it before making ludicrous statements like the one above about less than 1% of the schools budget going to teacher salaries.
PWCPS administrative costs are a much smaller than comparable school systems, so saying “just cut the waste and everything will be fine” shows how little you really know about the school system’s budget and why this obsession with illegal immigration only is so detrimental to the health and vitality of our county. 81.2% of the school’s current budget goes towards instruction (far higher than the 65% bar set by Del. Frederick’s proposed bill). The bulk of the 81.2% is teacher salaries.
The overcrowding in our schools will not go away when the illegals go away. A school like Brentsville High School is at nearly 200% built capacity (if you take away the trailers). You cannot for an instant believe that half of those students are illegals, can you?
My daughter’s elementary school has 1100 students in a building designed for 850. I’m pretty confident that there aren’t 250 illegals (in fact, I’ve be surprised if there were any more than a handful (if that) given the demographics of the neighborhoods this school draws from).
I haven’t seen the 2007 stats, but in 2006 more than 50% of the students in ESOL programs in the county schools were born IN THE UNITED STATES, which means they aren’t illegals.
You seem to think that getting rid of illegal immigrants will be the miracle cure for all of the county’s ills. That’s just not the case. There is no panacea for all that ails us. Many of these issues will still be around and if we divert all of our attention and resources at fighting just this one issue, the others will become nearly impossible to overcome.
Trent A. Barton:
At a per pupil rate of just over $10,000 per pupil, you’d have to lose more than a couple of hundred. Also, keep in mind that losing a couple hundred students over a school system with over 72,000 students really doesn’t result in lots of money coming back. If you lose one fifth grader at an elementary school, for instance, there isn’t any savings you still have to have a teacher for the remaining 25-30 students. You still have a principal. You still have a gym teacher.
Mando, I felt that same way about her first post, but I see her point that she doesn’t have to live in those areas to know they are a problem. What she and Turn fail to realize is the impact the ILLEGAL aliens are having on the schools. It will not matter a hill of beans how much funding we give to the library or the schools or the transportation if the very people slowing down those trains are not removed from them. Remove the ILLEGAL aliens from the classroom and you will improve the quality of education. Yes, I agree there will still be ESOL, but at a manageable level. Remove the ILLEGAL aliens from the roads and they will be less crowded.
Turn, yes they may be US CITIZENS, but they are most likely anchor babies. Without parents putting forth the effort to teach , use and encourage English in the home, we will have to continue to pay for these CITIZENS. Yes, you still have those salaries for them, but if the class sizes are decreased, then that improves education and requires fewer teachers which gives more pie to those teaching.
____________________________
I am all for spending money to remove the ILLEGAL aliens. It has to be done, period. Once they have been removed, the class sizes will decrease, helping with the over crowding and allow us to have money for the other items that can be improved. I want the schools to have all the money they can, but until we curb the invasion, it doesn’t matter how much they have, it will never be enough to overcome the tide. We can continue to build the dam out of sand or we can start reinforcing it with concrete.
Right now, there is darn little any of us can do to remove illegal aliens from the county. If people are behaving themselves, there is very little Prince William County or the State of Virginia can do about their presence.
I have never heard so many erroneous statements made about the school system in one single setting. Do yourselves a favor and listen to Turn PW Blue. You may learn something.
As an aside, MJM 12/17/07
‘Brentsville District High School is one of a handful of Virginia schools selected to U.S. News and World Report’s just-released national ranking of top high schools.’
Doesn’t sound like a third world school system to me.
Mando/MEDIC
Finally you are beginning to understand that I can appreciate a problem that is not living next door to me. My only point was that many can’t see beyond the one issue of immigration as the only issue in PWC. It’s like one storm behind another.
I have listened for six months and become convinced that you all need the support and the understanding for what you are experiening. Fortunately for me I am not. I am, however, impacted, when I see fellow citizens so totally unhappy. I can project and think you should have the support you need. Clearly my support, emails to supervisors and delegates is unwanted by you unless I say and think exactly what you say and think.
Of course I understand what’s going on in the schools. I just don’t think the Feds are going to change their minds and stop allowing illegals in the school in time to build Kettle Run and give the teachers a raise for next years. Mando, MEDIC do you think that will happen in time? Does anyone??????
I have spent a lot of time with some of the folks that are working hard in Sudley/Westgate to provide ideas, resources and support to make what they do easier. Perhaps you don’t need this support. Let me know.
Mando, I promise not to make you read. It was a tongue in cheek post to try to pull some more thoughts out of your heads.
Clearly, you would prefer that I simply yell and stamp my feet and call people names and hate the situation rather than try to work with what we have to improve things for all of us. Okay, you win I stop e-mailing Frederick, Colgan, or any of the supervisors asking for support on this issue.
Merry Christmas.
It was all a marketing gimmick. - and a well orchestrated one too!
Stewart said it himself - “He does not understand why immigration became such a hot topic, but he would like to duplicate it, in future elections.”
Fitzsimmonds, Stewart, Stirrup, and the rest of the Replublicans made Immigration the ONLY topic to talk about. They made it so much, that all the other topics were ignored (and did not exist), only immigration. Stewart even sent out a mailer about it (the controversial mailer). When else has Stewart mailed out something about a BOCS meeting?
They were all in office while this happened, and they act like they were the challengers in the election.
So, if you look at my previous posts, you will see that I told you so - that they would abandon the immigration issues as soon as they can.
Even Chao said, how do you know that you have an Illegal Immigration problem? - answer - Ah, because they speak spanish.
How much is dollars do the use of county services? - Ah, we did not figure that out yet!
How much it cost to deny services - Ah, we did not figure that out yet!
And, what services are you going to deny - Um, The public Library, Drug rehab, and elderly servcies.
Library - ok
Drug Rehab - Ah, Yeah, I prefer that my tax dollars not be spent trying to get this Illegal Alien off drugs, instead I would prefer him to lead a derelict life stype, and not contribute.
Elderly Sercies - Ah, Yeah, kick the old geezer out on the street, and lets watch them suffer.
Get real folks - you were all taken for a ride - This illigal Immigration thing was all a gimmick.
As I said in the past, just enforce the laws that are already on the books.
Over crowding - already there.
Unkept yards - already there.
Derelict Vehicles - already there.
Commercial Vehicles - already there.
Verify employment - already there (E-Verify).
The PROBLEM is that WE hire contractors who hire Illegal Aliens - because WE have raised a generation of individuals who think they should not have to WORK -
When I was young (as is now), I mowed my lawn (parents). As I got older, I mowed neighbors lawns. Today - the ‘old man’ mows the lawn, not the teenager, or my neighbors have hired landscapers - er, ‘mexicans’. That, my friend is the Immigrant problem - is that our youth of today do not want to, nor are expected to do ANY LABOR AT ALL - they just sit around talking on their cell phone.
enforce the laws, and they will move.
One Voice,
I’m one person here in WestGate/Sudley that needs your support. I’ve learned a lot from you, and imagine others have too. Although, there are those seem very closed minded. I’m a very open minded indivual myself. I’m listening to you.
BTW-I have made my request to serve on my Supervisor’s Budget Committee.
Well, it’s official our BOS, Clerk of the Court, Commonwealth’s Attorney, and Sheriff have all been sworn tonight.
Lafayette - I sent you an idea, Frankly, your opinion is one of verrrra few here that I value.
Yeah about the budget committee. You could work for one of the supervisors, they would likely be delighted to be able to snag you!!!
Mando
When I see two toddlers playing in the street - I go out there will my cell phone, and video camera, and I call 911.
I report that there are two unattended toddlers playing in the street. Without parent supervision, and that I do not know the parent (that is the truth).
I stay there, with my video running, until the police arrive.
Simple. Problem solved.
off topic:
The BOCS meeting is being rebroadcast on Comcast right now. Assistant CXO Peacor is making her presentation.
Thanks, Princess Billy Bob. I was very close to running for Brentsville School Board rep this past cycle. Family commitments and a promotion at work put those plans on hold. I do, however, try to keep on top of what’s going on and active in what’s going on in community.
It frustrates me to no end to see so many people think that PWCS is some backwards, top-heavy, relic when the facts are so different. Given how much we have gutted the school budget over the last few years (lowest per pupil spending by a considerable margin in the Metro Washington region), it actually is quite a testament to the teachers and staff at our schools that so many schools and the division as a whole perform at such high levels while continuing to absorb new students and carry the burden of unfunded federal mandates like NCLB.
Don’t forget the unfunded federal mandate of illegal immigration. I love and respect all those teachers in PWCS. How they can do their jobs when half their classes don’t speak English and don’t care about education is beyond me. I simply would never be strong enough to teach in an environment like that.
Just like politicians they can’t answer the question.
“Of course I understand what’s going on in the schools. I just don’t think the Feds are going to change their minds and stop allowing illegals in the school in time to build Kettle Run and give the teachers a raise for next years. Mando, MEDIC do you think that will happen in time? Does anyone??????”
Turn PW Blue:
I wish you had run and I hope you will consider doing so in the future. You have good insight into the big picture and understand the issues.
Most of the time, Prince William County Schools exceed expectations over and over again. The staff and school faculties deserve recognition on a daily basis.
Park’d:
Many students who could be illegal want to learn and are courteous and cooperative. Like every other ethnicity, some want to learn, some do not.
I noticed the pride and skill of your Manassas Park High School band in the recent Christmas Parade. Manassas Park should be proud of these students’ accomplishments. They were definitely the most spirited, if not the most talented of all the local bands participating.
Princess–what are you saying, that illegality is an ethnicity? Read your post. It is true, however, that some illegal aliens want to work and some do not. They’re still here illegally.
Monticup,
I believe you know what I meant. I also know that you know that illegality is a non-issue in schools. Believe it or not, they blend right in and I seriously doubt if you could even pick them out.
Lafayette, good for you for volunteering to be on the Budget Committee. You’re one of the few regulars from your neighborhood who walks the walk. If anyone could organize a Civic Association for your neighborhood and surrounding ones without an association, you could. I think an association is the way to go. In the beginning it would require a lot of co-operation from the neighborhood residents, but the benefits would be worth it. It would give the neighborhoods a more unified voice to address many problems. Many older subdivisions lack HOAs; and although an HOA would be almost impossible to implement without everyone’s agreeing to it, a civic association is doable. I believe Supervisor Jenkin’s staff mentioned that older areas of Dale City are uniting (or have united) to do this.
To the poster who mentioned videotaping young children in the street, I’m sure CPS would be interested. But you’d better get them to safety as well.
link - “Crackdown Could Lead to More Foster Care Needs”
http://www.wtop.com/?nid=600&sid=1313771
anonymoustoo,
A sincere thank you. We are working on getting the neighborhood united. However, I don’t think all see the fact there have been changes for the better in the neighborhood. Uniting is what it will take. That’s why I like to keep an open mind and listen. I do also have other irons in the fire that aren’t put out here. I will continue to learn. You and I don’t always agree. I do feel there’s a mutual respect for one another, and that truly seems to be lacking in many around here lately.
Lafayette, if you decide to pursue forming an association, Sharon Bulova’s office (in FX. Co) has some info on a pilot program being tried in an older neighborhood in Springfield. I think the neighborhood has always had an association (voluntary) but the membership had fallen off over the years. There is info about the steps being taken on the neighborhood association’s website (King’s Park Civic Association) and its newsletter, The Gazette.
One voice, I do not think the feds will do it, but if we can keep the heat on the situation with the reform in place, they will self deport from PWC. Apparently they already are.
Medic:
Are you attempting to agree with me? That we need to fund the schools because self-deportation and/or change in federal law will not happen in time to fund the Kettle Run HS and to pay for the teachers salary increase next year?
One Voice, I am saying that if the resolution is properly funded it will increase the self deportation process already in effect. This will reduce the class size and increase the education level. This will increase the funding to the schools since they will have less overhead to feed those on free breakfast and lunch programs. It will also help ease the ESOL classes. I guess I am agreeing with you that funding will increase for the schools since they get the same budget amount and have less overhead.
MEDIC
The cash must be in the bank now because these things won’t happen in the next few weeks to generate cash to put into these projects for 09. Kettle Run HS funding can’t wait until self-deportation is over. So both the current year immigration money, next year’s immigration money and money for the schools must be funded.
At the end of all this, what I said has been agreed to by just about everyone. So it’s not what I said, it’s how I said it. My point.
One Voice,
Here are some PWC statistics for you: DISCLAIMER: ::I am not saying all of these people are ILLEGAL aliens::
Hispanic persons 5 to 14 years 1980 (sample) 808
Hispanic persons 5 to 14 years 1990 (sample) 1,584
Hispanic or Latino persons 5 to 14 years 2000 (sample) 5,392
66% increase for this age group
Persons 5 to 14 years 1980 (complete count) 29,825
Persons 5 to 14 years 1990 (complete count) 36,001
Persons 5 to 14 years 2000 (complete count) 48,043
16% increase for this age group
See a trend??
This is the problem we are facing. No wonder schools can not keep up, the overhead increases with all of the free services they have to provide. AGAIN, I am not saying only ILLEGAL aliens are using that service, but a good deal of them are I am sure.
My source is the US Census bureau. http://censtats.census.gov
I am not suggesting that the new HS wait until the self deportation is over. It can have some funding. I am not saying the school system should be left out of the budget or be cut. What my point is, as a business model, decrease overhead and profits will rise. One way to decrease overhead is to remove those who suckle the hind tit. Let’s put the students who’s parents pay their way on that tit and allow them to flourish. Sorry for the reference, but I am a farm kid from the Midwest (c;
This self deportation will also decrease the number of students in the schools which will help alleviate your overcrowding problem. This is step one of the plan. Step two is to make sure the funding is there for the schools to continue to operate at their levels. Once the overhead has been decreased, the profits can be diverted to other avenues and projects within the school which helps soften the strain on the budget.
I am not familiar with Kettle Run, which school is it suppose to help on overcrowding?
redawn said on 8 Dec 2007 at 9:06 pm:
I have a question. What happens to the donations for campaigns while given, but not running. Does it sit in a bank and accrue interest? Are they able to do what ever they want to do with it? How does it work?
http://www.vpap.org/
We continue to go in circles about which comes first - deportation or building. The cost of the school is $42Million. Money is appropriated over the three years of the project. The first year is all site work and design. Year two/three construction.
Immigration is salary and guns. Around $2million per year. The rest is for sending prisioners elsewhere. That has an immediate effect.
The overcrowding will help mostly Brentsville and maybe back fill from OP and Stonewall.
You may be from a farm from the midwest , but so is my brother in law (Wisconsin). He would never publicly speak so crudely - do not smear the reputation of those from the midwest. Your choice of wording is just that, your choice. Your choice to speak that way to me speaks volumes of your character.
It’s not what you do, it’s how you do it…….
/\/\3|)iç 64 (Winner of the BVBL 40k post award).
Kettle Run will take some of the burden off of Brentsville District High School. I’m not sure of their occupancy today. I believe it was about predicted to be at 147% occupancy. Turn PW said about 200% without the trailers. That they really had to fight to get them there. We need this school. Students from Brentsville District HS were given the option of attending Stonewall Jackson HS to avoid the extreme overcrowded conditions. Last year there were only 15 toilets for 800 girls. This is a health/safety issue in my book.
The self deportations are still happening over this way. Although, some of Patty’s neighbors moved to the City yet they are still bringin their children to Sudley Elem to get their education. They lived at the house with trees growing out of the inground pool. Did you see those pix? Nasty, and still working with zoning, and others to get this taken care of once and for all.
So One Voice, you resort to name calling, typical path for the liberals.
I have a very good character and can provide references. I have not called you any names. Maybe it was crude, but you do not know me so you have no say in regards to my character.
__________________________________________
Lafayette, You are my hero in this battle. I have viewed every single one of your pictures and even wished you safety while taking them.
I understand the school has to be built and there are overcrowding issues at all schools. Which is first the cart or the horse, the chicken or the egg. You have to admit that part of the overcrowding issue is the large number of ILLEGAL aliens in the school system. Remove them so we can see where the problem lies after they are gone. It may turn out that another area may need this school worse. Who knows? According to all of the apologists on this blog, people will be leaving PWC because we are “racists”. Presto, no need for a new school!! (sarcasm, which is rarely activated, deactivated)
BTW One Voice, I call it as I see it, I do not blow sunshine up your dress. If people do not like the way I say something, tough! Grow up and get over it. People know where I am coming from when I speak. I do not talk nice to someone’s face and bad behind their back, if I do not like you, I will not speak to you, period. This includes ANY communication (c; In the work environment, I will speak to people about business only. I have done it before and will continue.
So, you don’t like people that don’t know you leaping to conclusions. LOL LOL….. back at ya, babe. And I am a liberal. LOL LOL LOL Hardy har har…
Be crude, enjoy it. I choose to exclude that and those from my life.
Besides your planning concept for schools is weak. Don’t give up your day job, whatever that is.
I think many folks think that the resolution is going to do something it isn’t.
The services recommended for restriction for illegal immigrants simply are not high ticket items. The biggest instrument of change will be the 287(g) program and ability to remove illegal lawbreakers.
Schools have not yet been impacted by the resolution. They probably will not be. If a few children of illegal immigrants leave, the school budget will not be impacted that much. Free lunches are paid by the federal government. The same teachers will be needed. The overhead will not shift to any noticiable degree.
Schools need to be funded. Businesses and families are attracted to an area because of good schools. Overcrowding and trailers are not what we want as a public statement, regardless national recognition.
Princess Billy Bob,
I agree and have to break this out…( the only message I can think of and it had to start somewhere )
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z04r_tlWdRs
Students may not attend county schools if they reside in the city unless they pay tuition which amounts to big bucks.
Someone needs to report those children to both Sudley School and the Pupil Personnel office at Independent Hill if facts can be verified.
One Voice, You get a bit testy when you are challenged don’t you. It is ok, your safe behind the keyboard (c; Besides, with your logic, I do not wish to be in your life…seems a bit messed up at the moment. You will come around one day.
Billy bob, I know the free lunches are paid for by the gov’t, but the gas to cook them isn’t. The time to check them out isn’t, the trash bags are not. Everything adds up. I think there are more ILLEGAL alien children and anchor babies than you are giving credit for. Please see my previous census post.
Medic
You make me laugh. You simply can’t respect an opinion other than your own. No one said you had to agree or adopt it as your new mantra. Just simple respect is clearly beyond you.
Oh well. I was right and you know it.
MEDIC YOU MIGHT BE INTERESTED IN THIS COMMENT FROM PWCCONSERVATIVE FROM A MARSHALL THREAD. NOTE THE SECOND SENTENCE.
PWConservative said on 21 Dec 2007 at 12:04 am: i was merely pointing out communistic ideology, and to lafayette
I agree, posting such content is offensive and leads us to question the sincerity of the poster’s Christianity.
it has been interesting debating our idea’s but I for one am getting a little tired of the division.
To the Three Left-Leaning debaters. Merry Christmas and God Bless
One voice, You have the last word.
There is good in everyone.
I was going to let you have the last word here One Vocie, BUT, I see what the post you reference is about. You post half truths and only repost what you see fit. SO, in order to set the record straight:
# Lafayette said on 20 Dec 2007 at 11:38 pm:
This is from another thread.
This blog is great for discussion, however the last few days there’s been too much name called and intolerance of others for my taste. I hope that changes some
I know there’s a thread with reference to fistshaped dildo(I appreciate the warning and all). Wow, I can’t believe such Christians would even look at something like that. Let alone post it here. What is going on here? Some sort of illness I’m just not sure what you would call it. Hmm.
____________________________________________________
# PWConservative said on 21 Dec 2007 at 12:04 am:
i was merely pointing out communistic ideology, and to lafayette I agree, posting such content is offensive and leads us to question the sincerity of the poster’s Christianity. it has been interesting debating our idea’s but I for one am getting a little tired of the division.
To the Three Left-Leaning debaters. Merry Christmas and God Bless
____________________________
It seems obvious to all that can read the post was not directed at me as you would make it out to be.
I will let you spout your little diatribe now and it will be the last word.
j’accuse???????!!!!! LOL LOL LOL
“the lady doth protest too much, methinks”
/\/\3|)iç 64 said on 21 Dec 2007 at 12:17 am:
‘I think there are more ILLEGAL alien children and anchor babies than you are giving credit for.’
I don’t claim to know how many illegal alien children there are. The point is, in schools, no one knows. There is no litmus test and they blend in. It is truly an unknown quantity.
I have not attempted to minimize their numbers. I hope this clears up any confusion.
I agree Billy Bob, There should be numbers, but we can’t get them. I understand about not minimizing the numbers. The US Census data I posted showed a 66% increase in the Hispanic population. Couple that with the fact that there has been an ILLEGAL alien population explosions during that same time frame, it only stands to reason that there are a greater number of those not paying their fair share now than before.
________________________
Once those not paying their fair share start to, it will ease the burden on the rest of us. I received reduced lunch when I was growing up and my children did as well when they were growing up. It is a good program and should continue. The difference is, my parents, like myself, were working hard to make ends meet and they just couldn’t do it. We had 4 kids in my family and I had 3. We lived in So IL, which was and is a depressed area since the coal mines had to close down. Many factors come into play for those who need the help. I am all for helping those who need it and are willing to work to help pay their fair share.
Medic:
You numbers, on the surface, seem to be very telling. But you’re missing a large part of the equation.
Prince William has had a growing LEGAL hispanic population for quite some time. To make the leap from the Census data to the assumption that a large portion of those numbers are illegals is a logical fallacy. There is not any hard evidence (just anecdotal) to support your supposition.
Oh, and the data you posted actually shows a 240% increase in the 5 to 14 year old hispanic population from 1990 to 2000, not 66%, and a 33% (not 16%) increase in the overall population of 5 to 14 year olds (which includes those Hispanic children). So, yes, Hispanics now make up a larger portion of the 5 to 14 year olds in Prince William County, but the overall population of 5 to 14 year olds has been growing tremendously. Your numbers only prove that Hispanics make up a larger portion of that group, not that Hispanics are the only cause of this growth.
For a moment let’s go with your flawed assumption that many of those Hispanics are illegal. Taking their numbers out of the overall population, there was still a 24.9% growth in the number of 5 to 14 year olds in Prince William County from 1990 to 2000. The schools would still be overcrowded based on those growth numbers alone.
TPWB, I was not saying all of the Hispanics were ILLEGAL aliens. Let’s take an equal percentage to the numbers nation wide and see what they turn out to be. Besides, some in this age group would have already graduated by this time. Given what you say, it would seem PWC dropped the ball on the school issue long before today. They should have been working on the new school(s) 4 years ago.
TPWB, I also think the housing market slowdown is going to help as well. Builders can not fill these communities up with SFH buyers. They are slowing down the building of new ones as well.
MEDIC
We agree!!!!! - “They should have been working on the new school(s) 4 years ago”.
It has been pushed two maybe almost three years now.
During the late 90’s and early 00’s when the BOCS was dying to go from the highest tax rate in the region to the lowest they reduced the tax rate far too low. It sold well, but the long term result is bad. That was bad planning, like removing your principal thinking interest will make it up.
This problem is not new and certainly not the fault of most of the current BOCS members. Not at all. But they must not delay addressing this issue. We lost a year because of the election. It is almost humorous that they make the descision to ignore the problem becuase it’s an election year and everyone knows it and it only hurt the citizen again.
Medic:
You will get no argument from me that the schools screwed this up long before now. New school construction needs to be planned at least 5-10 years in advance and should be done in conjunction with overall comprehensive planning for growth in all segments of the county’s economy. Our previous Boards of Supervisors and School Boards dropped the ball, and we are now in a real struggle to catch up at the very point in time that money becomes tight.
We did cut taxes, waived or reduced proffers, and did all sorts of things to attract new growth then acted surprised when the roads were jammed and the schools got crowded. Well who the heck did we think was buying all those new homes (and, yes, I am one of those new buyers–I’ve been in PWC since ‘98).
Like Joseph in the Old Testament told the Pharaoh, we should have been saving and preparing in the boom years so that we could survive the lean years. The housing slowdown helps in that growth will slow but it hurts more because real estate values (and thus property tax revenue) are down.
Two other things have hurt us as well. First, the standing budget allocation agreement between the BOCS and School Board has got to go. Funding for the schools should be based on actual need, not a predetermined formula. In good years, it means the schools become lazy and inefficient because money is flowing like water. In lean years, it means drastic reductions that may or may not be justified by actual needs and priorities. In some years, the schools’ budget need may be really be 70% of the county’s revenue while in other years, the schools can operate on 48%. The second thing that has hurt is the limit on debt. When Stewart and his ilk talk about holding the line on taxes (and this county revenue), they are also putting a severe limit on the amount that can be invested in critical infrastructure. To keep the AAA bond rating, the county can’t devote more than 10% of the budget to debt and debt service for capital improvements. This means that new schools have to compete with new police stations, fire houses, libraries, and roads for even more limited funds. In fact, with the revenue sharing agreement in place, it is possible for the schools to have funds to build the buildings but not be able to because they can’t take on the additional debt.
I am not sure that the split is really the problem. It seem that the accounting structure needs to be adjusted to permit reserves for these things. These annual budgets are just that. We laugh if the spend it all up because of the year end and then we complain when there is no reserve.
Like the debt ceiling, there should be a reserve ceiling allowed. Look to GASB to maybe address this, if they haven’t already started. They are now mandating retire health care reserves. In a service industry where more that 80% of your expense is salary punctuated by blips of terrific capital expense there should be room for a limited reserve. Reserves do not do a lot for public trust though and can often be misused (SS) so it is a dilemma. But I question if the split is the actual problem.
We would not want to steadily build schools unless there is a need, but we should have a reserve to allow uninterrupted or at least one that will mitigate a slump like this.
TPWB, The formula should go. I remember my time in the Navy, the Division Officer would come into my office and ask what I thought I needed because it was the end of the fiscal year and we still had money in the budget. If we didn’t spend it that year, we would loose it the next. I had to come up with things I thought I needed to make my section run right. I spent money on things that could have been spent in other parts of the hospital. I understand the mentality if I do not spend all I am allotted I will not get it or have a hard time getting it back since I didn’t need that money. Things come up and one year may not require all of the funds, but the very next year, the reserve we spent up the previous yes to make sure we got our share the next, could be used. This causes folks to scramble to get the funding for improvements when the “emergency” arises.
Medic:
Exactly my point. When they fund the CIP, the five year costs of the school have to be desigated. When you are forced to spend it up there are no reserves. That is not the split.
The split does not address that particular problem it is just a planned funding stream. If they had to reserve some of it - that would be an improvement, just like it would have been in your example.