Driving liberals, dhimmis and illegal alien apologists absolutely insane since 2005...

Debate With John Steinbach, Part 1

By Greg L | 7 March 2008 | Zapatistas, Illegal Aliens, Prince William County | 14 Comments

This first segment has some interesting tidbits. According to Mexicans Without Borders, there aren’t illegal aliens, only people with “paperwork problems”. Perhaps best is the statement by Steinbach that “we [Mexicans Without Borders] have never, ever engaged in fear-mongering”.

I’m sure the following statement Mexicans Without Borders made to the Prince William County Human Rights Commission isn’t fear-mongering:

By denying certain residents of medical assistance puts the entire community at a health risk.

This resolution will also severely increase racial division among the residents of the county by pitting citizens against non-citizens and creating an atmosphere of privilege for the citizen class.

It will divide and destroy families by forcing the separation of citizen children from non-citizen parents and splitting apart families that are comprised of both citizen and non-citizens.

This measure creates an authoritarian, apartheid like county that would require residents to carry and produce citizenship credentials in order to engage in their daily lives.

And I’m sure that telling people at the Prince William Board of County Supervisors meetings that police are going to be stationed at the public libraries to arrest illegal aliens if they try to enter isn’t fear-mongering.  Or that people would be pulled over by the police and checked for legal status if they looked different.  Or that children would be barred from entering public schools.  No, when they made those statements, that wasn’t fear-mongering.

Nor would this statement from their website constitute fear-mongering:

The effect of this resolution is to instill in the Latino community an atmosphere of terror, desperation, and a feeling of discrimination. It is patently designed to divide the community by promoting xenophobia and hatred. The Woodbridge Workers Committee views this action as discriminatory and racist…

Or this one, from the same page:

This resolution will create an Apartheid-like system reminiscent of the pre-Civil War “Slave Patrols” checking for permits carried by slaves while traveling off the plantation.

No, they’ve never, ever engaged in fear-mongering. Saying that Prince William County is engaging in “the new apartheid”, that immigrants will be hounded by slave patrols, and that the Rule of Law Resolution is an attempt to terrorize innocent people isn’t fear-mongering.

Because for these folks, language means what you want it to mean, at the time a certain interpretation is convenient. Here’s what I’m talking about:

To be anti-capitalist anti-imperialist in the capital of the most terrorist country of world-wide history and not to question the commitments or challenges, to us would free the critics and outside the play.

To folks who can possibly warp their minds into thinking that this makes any sense, to engage in fear-mongering a critical requirement has to be met: You have to be a capitalist. Only capitalists can engage in fear-mongering. Everyone else is “speaking truth to power”.

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  1. Patty said on 7 Mar 2008 at 10:04 pm:
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    I just want to be clear on this. It sounds like what I’m hearing from John S. is that he had been working closely with Chief Deane to enable illegal aliens to reside in the County unlawfully. So John S. has implicated Chief Deane in aiding and abetting illegal aliens.

  2. mnd said on 7 Mar 2008 at 10:25 pm:
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    You know, given what has become of Rhodesia and South Africa, talking about Apartheid probably isn’t a good thing to do.

    Someone else on another forum made this comment:

    “It seems Apartheid wasn’t really a race-based policy after all; they were just trying to keep order among savages.”

    If the claim is that Mexicans are culturally unable to obey the law and we wish to avoid what happened in Rhodesia and South Africa, what is Steinbach’s suggested course of action?

  3. Dolph said on 7 Mar 2008 at 11:31 pm:
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    Part of Chief Deane’s objective was to educate the community as to what the resolution and his department would and would not do. He clearly stated that in BOCS meetings and written public communications. I would say he used community groups like MWB and HSM as well as churches, community associations, etc, to do as much outreach as possible.

    He is everyone’s police chief and must be as courteous and responsive to John S as he would be to you or me.

    His position on educating the community can be seen at this site. There are 4 or 5 different references.


  4. CJC said on 7 Mar 2008 at 11:42 pm:
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    Thanks for being our spokesperson. You are to be commended.

  5. Greg L said on 8 Mar 2008 at 12:59 am:
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    What Steinbach was referring to was the long-term effort by Mexicans Without Borders and Unity In The Community to lobby the chief for less enforcement actions against illegal aliens. In 2005 the PWCPD raided a day laborer site on route one and got about a dozen illegal aliens deported. MWB and UIC launched a lobbying effort with the chief to create the departmental policy that told officers they couldn’t ask the about legal status of suspected illegal aliens, which we overturned on the BOCS with the Rule of Law Resolution.

    After the resolution passed, they tried this again, but Deane told them his hands were tied and he really couldn’t help them. They did get the PWCPD to do some informational sessions with the illegal alien lobby — I’m not sure whether it was at Deane’s request or the request of MWB, but after the hysteria angle sort of backfired they then went back and tried to do some real public education on the Rule of Law Resolution. By then it was a little too late, as the initial stories about how the police were going to become the gestapo somehow had already run through the illegal alien population like wildfire. With the horses out of the barn already, it was too late to undo the damage.

    Even today there are people who believe that the Rule of Law Resolution makes it unlawful to speak spanish in Prince William County, and that they’ll be arrested and deported if they do. Others think that the Mercado Latino will get raided, and the customers will be hauled away in a paddy wagon. Just look at what illegal aliens say when they’re interviewed by the Washington Post — they say the craziest things, and they got them from the illegal alien lobby because in too many cases they couldn’t understand the initial news coverage.

    Bad rumors that appear plausible to whoever hears them are absolutely viral, especially if they’re the first information you get.

    Remember when Dexter Fox and his crew were speaking against 287(g) in Manassas in December 2006? That “blood in the streets” doom-and-gloom kind of rhetoric is precisely what got fed to Mexicans Without Borders, and they ran with it in order to get their base energized. It energized them so well, they packed up and ran away.

    It’s convenient when the opposition does something so utterly self-destructive. If they hadn’t done this and driven so many illegal aliens out before anything really changed on the ground, we probably would have had to work a lot harder to get to the point we’re at now.

  6. Dave in PWC said on 8 Mar 2008 at 9:40 am:
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    Great job Greg. I thought you echoed our thoughts and ideas very well and remained calm and poised throughout the entire segment. I would have interrupted the gentleman from MWB many times when he spouted his tired old rhetoric, you didn’t and I commend you for that.

  7. NoVA mom said on 8 Mar 2008 at 9:59 am:
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    I find it ironic that John S. states that it is “the law of the land” that education and health care is to be provided despite a person’s illegal status - but refuses to acknowledge “the law of the land” in regards to immigration laws. I have had enough of this garbage. I wish some state would have the guts to challenge that old law that states we need to provide an education to illegals.

  8. park'd said on 8 Mar 2008 at 10:13 am:
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    This man should be arrested for treason and tossed into Guantanamo. He’s lucky I am not the law or he’d be getting worse than that. Guantanamo is too good for what he truly deserves.

  9. Krutis said on 8 Mar 2008 at 11:24 am:
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    Everybody should feel lucky that park’d is not the law!

  10. silverfox said on 8 Mar 2008 at 11:28 am:
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    This man, John Steinbach, should be removed from his teaching position. This blog is frequently read by school board members and it should be their initiative to bring this before the administration and begin some investigation. Responsible governing is what we are asking for as a community. If it is REALLY about the children, let’s see some proof Manassas City School Board!

  11. Greg L said on 8 Mar 2008 at 11:45 am:
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    As much as we may disagree with Mr. Steinbach, it would be inappropriate to call for his removal absent any indication that his views are negatively impacting his performance as a substitute teacher. Requiring a certain set of political views in order to have a job in the public sector is what the other side is notorious for, and we really shouldn’t engage in the same tactic.

    If there was evidence that he was departing from the curriculum in order to present political views to students, then a legitimate complaint could be lodged. So far there’s no evidence at all this has happened. If parents were concerned by what their child heard or saw in class, then there’s reason to complain, but so far I haven’t heard anyone express such concerns. Just because this guy spouts off stuff we strongly disagree with doesn’t necessarily mean that he should be disqualified from the position he holds.

    There are others in the PWC school system (Steinbach teaches in Manassas) who are far more legitimate targets of your concern, particularly in the multi-cultural education and ESOL departments. I’ve seen tax dollars used on inappropriate materials, use of public resources to support ideologically-driven agendas, and public funds used to present seminars that are wasteful and counterproductive to the mission of the school system. The PWC schools website has had links to materials that are utterly inappropriate for our school system.

    It is important to focus on behavior, rather than belief. Collect evidence regarding how public employees behave and make a complaint, and you’ll be taken seriously. Make a complaint because you don’t like what a public employee does during non-work hours (as long as it doesn’t violate the law or the teacher’s contract), and you look pretty silly, at best.

  12. Anonymous said on 8 Mar 2008 at 12:07 pm:
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    If Deane and his staff are being unjustly characterized by Mexicans Without Borders as aiding and abetting illegal aliens in violation of their mandate from the BOS, perhaps the COP should be made aware of this. He might not take so kindly to the illegal population of our county and be far more energized in doing his job.

  13. AWCheney said on 8 Mar 2008 at 1:38 pm:
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    I just realized that my last comment (12:07) came up “Anonymous” because I was using my husband’s computer (mine’s in the shop). That was me.

  14. Bl said on 8 Mar 2008 at 2:28 pm:
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    Overpopulation, congestion, urban sprawl, pollution, crime, diminishing resources, lack of affordable housing, depressed wages, underground economic, fraudulent documents, identity thief, tax invasion, soaring crime rate, increased tax burdens, overcrowded schools leading to uneducated children, overcrowded prisons, inadequate health care, the balkanization of our communities and the overall decline in our quality of life are the result of unconstrained immigration! America cannot accept the worlds population. Too many people chasing too few resources is not sound economic, social or cultural policy. This is not racism but pragmatism! Every industrialized nation, even China, has taken steps to end illegal immigration and to limit legal immigration to only that which is prudent, demonstrably necessary, and above all other concerns, in the best interest of their native population. Its insane to suggest that America should not do likewise.

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