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More MS-13 Graffiti

By Greg L | 16 November 2008 | Crime, Prince William County | 35 Comments

This week some MS-13 gang-bangers decided to vandalize my community as a means of marking their turf.  Gang graffiti is visible from Sudley Manor Drive on multiple brick walls and privacy fences behind the town homes on Quail Run Lane extending all the way to Copeland Drive.  Given that the Virginia State Police estimates that 90% of MS-13 members are illegal aliens, I guess this can just be chalked down to illegal aliens doing the jobs that Americans don’t want to do, which seems to happen with disturbing regularity in this neighborhood.  What else showed up is somewhat unusual, however.  I haven’t seen MS-13 get involved in politics before.

First, the disturbing way these miscreants trashed our community:

This is different.  Would this qualify as an endorsement?

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  1. Fair and Balanced said on 16 Nov 2008 at 1:50 am:
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  2. TedKennedysSwimInstructor said on 16 Nov 2008 at 8:03 am:
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    Obama will simply extend the Fairness Doctrine to MS-13 and this will become the norm.

    Obama - our first affirmative action President!

  3. freedom said on 16 Nov 2008 at 10:26 am:
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    Of course, it’s possible that the “MS 13″ graffiti was the result of insecure, unpopular, “non-member-of-anything” kids seeking recognition and attention from their peers as “big-shots.”

  4. DeMann said on 16 Nov 2008 at 10:43 am:
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    maybe it’s just the only thing that they know how to spell using OUR national language.

  5. InDaHoodBridge said on 16 Nov 2008 at 12:02 pm:
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    agree with freedom that it is likely a copycat (of both the gang and the recent slew of such acts)…pretty plain-jane tags paired with the political tag. Either that or you have least artistically inclined gang members around.

  6. Anchor Baby said on 16 Nov 2008 at 2:35 pm:
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    Looks wannabe to me.

    Interesting to note how similar the color and ‘penmenship’ looks. I think it’s some bored teenagers that need a strong parental figure.

  7. Loudoun Insider said on 16 Nov 2008 at 3:28 pm:
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    Are you people experts in graffiti penmanship? Regardless of who did this they should be publicly flogged for it.

  8. chicko said on 16 Nov 2008 at 3:29 pm:
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    just a bunch of bored teen’s I think. This doesnt look “authentic” to me, but i could be wrong. All gang bangers and wanna-bees are retarded anyway so who knows. Instead of spray painting the neighborhood wouldnt it be nice for them to sit around the house all day watching re-runs of “american me” on TV?

  9. InDaHoodBridge said on 16 Nov 2008 at 3:47 pm:
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    Loudown Insider:
    Wouldn’t it be “spraymanship”? And are you qualified to judge someone’s “spraymanship” expertise? (see how this goes round-and-round and contributes nothing?).

    To your worthwhile comment: Agreed. None of the 3 of us who posted doubts as to the membership of the offenders suggested civil and criminal penalties (or a good ol’ fashioned flogging) were not in order. We were simply forwarding a valid supposition that the offenders are not who you may think (based on the lack of the normal artistic quality of MS tags, the political reference, the slew of other similar events and the likelihood of deception-by-mimicry).

  10. InDaHoodBridge said on 16 Nov 2008 at 3:48 pm:
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    looks like we now have 4 doubters.

  11. Wolverine said on 16 Nov 2008 at 3:57 pm:
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    Add me to the list of doubters. That grafitti looks too simple to be genuine MS-13 stuff. I vote for a couple of stupid Americano kids. That said, find ‘em and book ‘em.

  12. Greg L said on 16 Nov 2008 at 5:21 pm:
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    There is no such thing effectively as a “wannabe”. Consider this a “gonna be” if anything. If we do not take effective measures to suppress street gang organization in our neighborhoods, our children are going to lean a lot from these ethnic-based criminal organizations that we’d rather they didn’t embrace.

    Considering we’ve seen Surenos 13, South Side Locos, South Side 13, MS-13, and Mexican Mafia graffiti all within a half-mile of this recent tagging, anyone who thinks we don’t have a real gang problem right in our neighborhood is deluded. I’ve personally intervened to defend victims of attacks one block from this location on two occasions.

    We have a problem, and folks chalking this up to “wanna be’s” are in my opinion part of that problem. It is nonsense to wait until these supposed “wanna be’s” murder someone in my neighborhood before people consider this warning worthy of their attention.

    I prefer to not wait until someone dies (likely an immigrant by the way, who are much more likely to become victims of MS-13) before I take this seriously. One life lost to street gangs is one too many, and I’m not waiting for the next C. J. Angelos-style tragedy before advocating for stronger enforcement, community vigilance, and for parents to be on the lookout for gang behavior in their children and their children’s friends and acquaintances.

  13. Benton said on 16 Nov 2008 at 5:34 pm:
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    Agree. There is no point in analyzing actions like this - or dismissing them. It indicates a problem period and should not be taken lightly.

  14. Vigilant1 said on 16 Nov 2008 at 6:41 pm:
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    This particular “signing” does not appear to be of the same type as months ago. This looks like the way it is printed that is quited possible from a “wanna be.” The letters and number printing style is too “Anglo.”

  15. freedom said on 16 Nov 2008 at 6:46 pm:
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    Wait, wait, wait Greg….cool your jets just a bit. Just because I suggested that the perpetrators of this graffiti may, repeat may not be members of MS-13 and instead may be “member-of-nothing” big-shot wannabes does not in any way imply that we do not have a gang problem. Further, that suggestion does not imply that I favor coddling or accepting the the presence gangs. In fact, I would suggest that if the perps were indeed wannabes, that signals “interest” and therefore IS “gang behavior.”

    Lots of kids simply feel as though they don’t “fit in” with the favored crowd and are either unwilling or unable to “make the cut” with legitimate and highly regarded school organizations, e.g., the football team. These kids, often seek an alternative to that, something that raises their status among other wimpy peers as being “cool,” maybe even “gutsy” because it’s illegal.

    Greg, you are no more strenuously opposed to the presence of illegal aliens and or gangs in our neighborhood than I am. Whether MS-13 members did the graffiti this time or not, we must combat gangs and discourage the presence of illegal aliens. Regardless of whom the perpetrators are, they must be sought, caught and prosecuted.

  16. Vigilant1 said on 16 Nov 2008 at 6:47 pm:
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    Catch them (who ever they are) and make them pay dearly for what they have done ) and I don’t mean so many hours of “community diservice.) Jail them!

  17. Truth Seeker said on 16 Nov 2008 at 7:00 pm:
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    Thank you for pointing out the obvious.

    BTW Greg-That is not MS13 graffiti. These were probably the same kids that got picked up by the police for all the vandalism and graffti in the Sudley/
    Westgate area. Hopefully, the kids responsible for the vandalism will receive stiff sentences that will teach them all a lesson.

  18. Anchor Baby said on 16 Nov 2008 at 7:30 pm:
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    Agreed with Freedom on all counts.

  19. concrete4 said on 16 Nov 2008 at 8:43 pm:
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    “Wanna be” taggers are usually more “artsy fartsy”…..
    This could be the real thing (from what I’ve learned about gang graffitti) -
    Whoever it is, they need to be prosecuted.

  20. InDaHoodBridge said on 16 Nov 2008 at 10:19 pm:
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    Also agree with Freedom on all accounts…again, none of us who doubt this is MS13 want a feather-gloved approach. We just want all possible offenders considered!

  21. Loudoun Insider said on 16 Nov 2008 at 11:08 pm:
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    This is an interesting debate. Here’s my solution, if the perps are MS-13, turn them over to the cops. If the perps are “wanna-bees” turn them over to MS-13. Let’s see who gets treated better.

  22. Anchor Baby said on 16 Nov 2008 at 11:20 pm:
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    Sounds like my view on our criminal justice system.

    Instead of spending $50K/prisoner as we currently do lets negotiate a contract with the Mexican government. We ship them our criminals and $40K/prisoner. Whatever they don’t spend on the prisoner, they get to keep.

    You know how fast crime would drop??

    I know, its just a pipe dream, but…

  23. InDaHoodBridge said on 16 Nov 2008 at 11:21 pm:
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    Loudoun Insider: now THAT is the solution…love it!

  24. NoVA Scout said on 17 Nov 2008 at 6:35 am:
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    AB’s approach is reminiscent of Kinky Friedman’s (candidate for Governor of Texas) approach to border security - put $10 million in a Swiss bank account for every Mexican general or official with responsibilities in the Mexican states contiguous with the US. Withdraw $100,000 for every illegal immigrant who gets picked up on our side.

  25. Love The USA said on 17 Nov 2008 at 6:49 am:
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    If they are “wanna be’s” they are in BIG trouble! By doing this they are “dissing MS-13. I know enough about gang grafitti to know that “wanna be’s” are in the initiation phase. There really is no such thing as a wanna be anyway. And of course most MS-13 gang members are teenagers! They are also most likely illegal aliens.

  26. Wolverine said on 17 Nov 2008 at 3:20 pm:
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    As a long-time member of Neighborhood Watch in Sterling Park, I’ve seen enough MS-13 graffiti (also that of the rival 18th Street Gang) to feel certain that what you have here is a bunch of stupid kids yanking your chains because of your openly expressed concerns over the llegal immigrant and gang problems. That does NOT mean that these kids shouldn’t be given the max when caught. We have had somewhat of a hiatus in the graffiti problem in Sterling Park (thanks to the anti-gang task force and tougher local law enforcement actions), but we are now once again going through another graffiti phase. This time much of it is vulgar language sprayed on houses, commercial buildings, walls, and even the construction sign for our new Sheriff’s Office substation. Yes, we have gangs, and yes, they like to do the graffiti thing. However, we also have a certain number of young Americano fools in NoVa who think it is fun and funny to get everyone else all stirred up. Maybe I’ll be proven wrong in your case and ours; but, whatever the situation is, we have to go after these “artistes” hammer and tong.

  27. Maureen said on 17 Nov 2008 at 5:09 pm:
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    Wolverine I too have seen plenty of gang graffiti and most of it is plain, like in these pictures. No one can say for certain that MS-13 did or didn’t do this. It is always best to take this seriously and be on the look-out for anything else going on.

    BTW- that area is known for having gangs.

  28. 40 years in Woodbridge said on 17 Nov 2008 at 5:45 pm:
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    That is exactly why school aged children know that you do NOT pretend to be with that gang that will lead to very serious and detrimental consequences for the poser at the hands of the real gang members.

    I worked in a very heavily gang infested area for about 15 years and had my share of interesting interactions with variety of gangs (to include this one) and the police. I can tell you that from my experience the usual markings are plain with very little “artistic” nature. They range from an inch to large writings like the ones in the pictures.

    There are always a few with an “artistic” nature that do special taggings usually memorializing one of their own such as the Altmed building, special event or just to show off their “talents”.

    If you have gang graffiti you have gang activity of one type or another and they are sending some type of message, new members to the area, new or increasing power in the area, sending message of fear or they are sending a message to opposing gangs.

  29. Wolverine said on 17 Nov 2008 at 5:48 pm:
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    Well. Maureen, I don’t exactly disagree with you. Perhaps our gang “artistes” have had more or different artistic talent than your gang “artistes.” When the gang stuff turned out to be simpler or possibly incomplete, it was probably because they decided their possibility of being spotted was too great or someone actually scared them off in mid-tag. Also, I cannot recall here having seen a situation in which so much authentic gang graffiti showed up all at once in the same neighborhood. Our gangs have been pretty selective and choosey about how much they need and where to put those symbols which warn off rivals.

    I just finished almost a year of lying in wait for an elusive tagger who insisted on scribbling his messages all over a certain important structure in our community. It started out with graffiti that was, according to our law enforcement, clearly gang markings. It then degenerated into stuff that began to appear to all of us to be kid-style pranks. All of it has since disappeared, so it is possible to fight back — so long as they, gangsters or pranksters, know you never quit waiting for them.

    Around here we never take anything less than seriously and are always on the lookout. Moreover, our Neighborhood Watch motto has always been: “We don’t care where you come from or what your citizenship or immigration status may be. We see you doing wrong and you are going to go down.”

  30. Tim said on 18 Nov 2008 at 11:34 pm:
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    I have a blog that deals w/ MS-13 issues.
    It is located at www.msthirteen.com
    Check it out.

  31. hnfhrfasdj said on 24 Nov 2008 at 9:43 am:
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  32. antiracist said on 26 Nov 2008 at 5:53 pm:
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    anchor baby
    you’re stupid

    MS 13 has absolutely nothing to do w/ Mexicans

    do some research about a topic b4 you come up with some racist b.s. again

  33. seirra said on 31 Mar 2009 at 10:33 am:
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    i think that ms13 is the worst gang to be in my town lumberton nc dats tha worst gang to be in thats my opinon.

  34. maria said on 3 Jun 2009 at 11:23 am:
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    LoL Demann…but dats not even graffiti

  35. bri lopez said on 27 Oct 2009 at 8:37 am:
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    no it has nothing to do with mexicans…yall do research

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