Comments on: HOA vs. Medal Of Honor Recipient http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/ Blog-Fu for Prince William, Manassas and Manassas Park politics. Thu, 24 May 2012 17:58:56 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.3 By: Old Soldier http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90603 Old Soldier Wed, 09 Dec 2009 16:41:04 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90603 Virginia Veteran Wins Battle to Keep His Flagpole in Yard http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,579773,00.html Once again, Common sense won out over anal retentive rule freaks. Virginia Veteran Wins Battle to Keep His Flagpole in Yard

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,579773,00.html

Once again, Common sense won out over anal retentive rule freaks.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90553 Anonymous Mon, 07 Dec 2009 11:21:49 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90553 So Watchdog, having been awarded fewer and less prestigious medals than the Colonel which rules do I get to ignore? BTW - you need to get more familiar with HOAs. They tend to be made up of people on power trips and/or retired people with nothing better to do. Personally I would have said let him have the flag pole. It's a nice touch, but if I have been elected to basically be the law enforcement for and by the community it's a different story. He put the pole on property he doesn't own. So Watchdog, having been awarded fewer and less prestigious medals than the Colonel which rules do I get to ignore?

BTW - you need to get more familiar with HOAs. They tend to be made up of people on power trips and/or retired people with nothing better to do. Personally I would have said let him have the flag pole. It’s a nice touch, but if I have been elected to basically be the law enforcement for and by the community it’s a different story. He put the pole on property he doesn’t own.

]]> By: KBlowhard Watchdog http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90551 KBlowhard Watchdog Mon, 07 Dec 2009 02:45:25 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90551 I've been following this story - the Col.'s son in law has been in contact with a local radio station about the story. The argument isn't about the flag, it's about the flagpole. The HOA has said that if he were to put the flag on a pole that is attached to the house, it's not an issue. Col. Barfoot HAD received permission to erect the flagpole before he moved into the development, but he became unable to move into the development. When he did move into the development, he assumed that he still had permission of the HOA and erected the flagpole. The flagpole is one that will not make noise, which was the primary concern of the HOA according to the son in law. The ENTIRE community, less the members of the HOA board, stand behind Col. Barfoot. This vet deserves to be allowed to keep his flagpole up. My question is - if the board was willing to grant him permission previously, what happened? Change of board members? Does it matter? This gentlemen deserves to live the rest of his life by going out every morning and raising the flag he fought so hard to defend. And if these stuffy HOA members have their heads so far up their a$$ that this is all they have to be worried about, they need to rethink their priorities. I’ve been following this story - the Col.’s son in law has been in contact with a local radio station about the story. The argument isn’t about the flag, it’s about the flagpole. The HOA has said that if he were to put the flag on a pole that is attached to the house, it’s not an issue. Col. Barfoot HAD received permission to erect the flagpole before he moved into the development, but he became unable to move into the development. When he did move into the development, he assumed that he still had permission of the HOA and erected the flagpole.

The flagpole is one that will not make noise, which was the primary concern of the HOA according to the son in law. The ENTIRE community, less the members of the HOA board, stand behind Col. Barfoot.

This vet deserves to be allowed to keep his flagpole up. My question is - if the board was willing to grant him permission previously, what happened? Change of board members? Does it matter? This gentlemen deserves to live the rest of his life by going out every morning and raising the flag he fought so hard to defend. And if these stuffy HOA members have their heads so far up their a$$ that this is all they have to be worried about, they need to rethink their priorities.

]]> By: Groveton http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90549 Groveton Sun, 06 Dec 2009 13:52:29 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90549 While I support Col. Barfoot, this seems like another one of those questions of political philosophy. Presumably, the Col Barfoot bought his home after the rules were written. On first blush, you would think that conservatives would think that rules are rules and you have to follow the rules. However, Col Barfoot is reputed to be the most decorated American war verteran still alive with a Medal of Honor on top of a long list of commendations. And he's 90. So, good hearted conservatives say, "the rules can be suspended in this case". Oddly, that's roughly the same thought that Gov. Kaine has ..... http://www2.timesdispatch.com/rtd/news/state_regional/state_regional_govtpolitics/article/kaine_backs_barfoot_in_flagpole_dispute/309537/ In my opinion, this is another case where the Common Sense Party trumps the pure ideology of either the conservative or liberal cause. People with physical challenges are accorded some special priveleges like special parking spaces. You have to provide those spaces whether the parking lot is owned by the state or private enterprise. This is proper and appropriate. I support letting Congressional Medal of Honor recipients build free standing flag poles even if it violates HOA restrictions. Some classes of citizens deserve special rights. Physically challenged citizens should be helped by the rest of society even if it involves a very minor inconvienience to the rest of society. Ditto CMH winners. Col. Barfoot earned the right to create what some residents of Henrico County eveidently consider an eyesore - a flag pole flying an American flag. While I support Col. Barfoot, this seems like another one of those questions of political philosophy. Presumably, the Col Barfoot bought his home after the rules were written. On first blush, you would think that conservatives would think that rules are rules and you have to follow the rules. However, Col Barfoot is reputed to be the most decorated American war verteran still alive with a Medal of Honor on top of a long list of commendations. And he’s 90. So, good hearted conservatives say, “the rules can be suspended in this case”.

Oddly, that’s roughly the same thought that Gov. Kaine has ….. http://www2.timesdispatch.com/rtd/news/state_regional/state_regional_govtpolitics/article/kaine_backs_barfoot_in_flagpole_dispute/309537/

In my opinion, this is another case where the Common Sense Party trumps the pure ideology of either the conservative or liberal cause.

People with physical challenges are accorded some special priveleges like special parking spaces. You have to provide those spaces whether the parking lot is owned by the state or private enterprise. This is proper and appropriate. I support letting Congressional Medal of Honor recipients build free standing flag poles even if it violates HOA restrictions. Some classes of citizens deserve special rights. Physically challenged citizens should be helped by the rest of society even if it involves a very minor inconvienience to the rest of society. Ditto CMH winners. Col. Barfoot earned the right to create what some residents of Henrico County eveidently consider an eyesore - a flag pole flying an American flag.

]]> By: Citizen12 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90546 Citizen12 Sat, 05 Dec 2009 22:57:42 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90546 Ahhhh the HOA ..... "Unlike a municipal government, homeowner association governance is not subject to the constitutional constraints that public government must abide by." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeowner_association HOA Rules: What You Must Know About Flag Restrictions July 2008 http://www.hoaleader.com/public/139.cfm Ahhhh the HOA …..

“Unlike a municipal government, homeowner association governance is not subject to the constitutional constraints that public government must abide by.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeowner_association

HOA Rules: What You Must Know About Flag Restrictions
July 2008

http://www.hoaleader.com/public/139.cfm

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90545 Anonymous Sat, 05 Dec 2009 21:32:24 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90545 The HOA can tell you that you CANNOT fly it on property you don't own. The Colonel wouldn't even get into court. The HOA can tell you that you CANNOT fly it on property you don’t own. The Colonel wouldn’t even get into court.

]]> By: Ray B. http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90544 Ray B. Sat, 05 Dec 2009 21:03:10 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90544 Actually, in terms of rules - every HOA or other entity that dictates how the Flag of the United States of America is to be flown or not to be flown is in violation of US Code Title 4...and that Title clearly says only, repeat only, the President of the United States can set different rules (i.e. when to fly at half-mast). The Colonel could make a case in the Federal Circuit Court in Richmond and win on that one short Title alone. Personally, I find it silly as hell HOAs place a flag pole & flag being used properly under the Law of the Land in the same nuisance category as pink flamingos. Still serving to my Oath 11 years into retirement.... Actually, in terms of rules - every HOA or other entity that dictates how the Flag of the United States of America is to be flown or not to be flown is in violation of US Code Title 4…and that Title clearly says only, repeat only, the President of the United States can set different rules (i.e. when to fly at half-mast). The Colonel could make a case in the Federal Circuit Court in Richmond and win on that one short Title alone.

Personally, I find it silly as hell HOAs place a flag pole & flag being used properly under the Law of the Land in the same nuisance category as pink flamingos.

Still serving to my Oath 11 years into retirement….

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90543 Anonymous Sat, 05 Dec 2009 20:53:18 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90543 My my, aren't we touchy. Obviously you don't care. If you did you would have enough sense to know not to advertise that you thnik rules apply to everyone else, but maybe not so much to you. I don't need to confirm my beliefs with people like you. Especally since you pretty much are admitting you are one of the old guys I was talking about. "Guidlines" lol My my, aren’t we touchy. Obviously you don’t care. If you did you would have enough sense to know not to advertise that you thnik rules apply to everyone else, but maybe not so much to you. I don’t need to confirm my beliefs with people like you. Especally since you pretty much are admitting you are one of the old guys I was talking about.

“Guidlines” lol

]]> By: Old Soldier http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90542 Old Soldier Sat, 05 Dec 2009 20:09:43 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90542 I like to think of rules more as guidelines... if you're trying to confirm your own beliefs to make yourself feel better, go right ahead. Personally, I really don't give a damn what you think. You have me confused with someone who cares... I like to think of rules more as guidelines… if you’re trying to confirm your own beliefs to make yourself feel better, go right ahead. Personally, I really don’t give a damn what you think. You have me confused with someone who cares…

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90540 Anonymous Sat, 05 Dec 2009 19:02:39 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90540 Hey USN blah-blah, I took a little more serious oath. Do you remeber that one? Recite it to yourselfm (and you damn well better be at attention just like you were the day you took it). Now tell me which rules I get to ignore. Old Soldier have you forgot your training? The rules weren't put in place for you to negotiate. They were put there for you to obey, just like LAWFUL orders. Some of you guys get old and think that the fact we served gives us some special privilege. It doesn't. Hey USN blah-blah, I took a little more serious oath. Do you remeber that one? Recite it to yourselfm (and you damn well better be at attention just like you were the day you took it). Now tell me which rules I get to ignore.

Old Soldier have you forgot your training? The rules weren’t put in place for you to negotiate. They were put there for you to obey, just like LAWFUL orders.

Some of you guys get old and think that the fact we served gives us some special privilege. It doesn’t.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90539 Anonymous Sat, 05 Dec 2009 17:39:38 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90539 He still appears to be very capable, I think it would be wise to leave him alone and treated with some respect, he surely earned it. He still appears to be very capable, I think it would be wise to leave him alone and treated with some respect, he surely earned it.

]]> By: Old Soldier http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90538 Old Soldier Sat, 05 Dec 2009 16:24:47 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90538 Anonymous, just ignore the rules that are stupid or don't make sense and you'll do just fine. Anonymous, just ignore the rules that are stupid or don’t make sense and you’ll do just fine.

]]> By: USN 69-73 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90537 USN 69-73 Sat, 05 Dec 2009 15:39:50 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90537 Hey Anonymous Dig a hole & plant a pole. Then fly the U.S. Flag, stand back, hand solute, & repeat after me: I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, One Nation Under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Parade Rest Fall Out In God We Trust, and may the Col. fly his flag forever. Hey Anonymous
Dig a hole & plant a pole. Then fly the U.S. Flag, stand back, hand solute, & repeat after me: I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, One Nation Under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Parade Rest

Fall Out

In God We Trust, and may the Col. fly his flag forever.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90536 Anonymous Sat, 05 Dec 2009 15:23:25 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90536 I served, but got lesser medals. Which rules do you think I should be allowed to ignore? I served, but got lesser medals. Which rules do you think I should be allowed to ignore?

]]> By: Disgusted http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90535 Disgusted Sat, 05 Dec 2009 13:18:48 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90535 zuzu said on 5 Dec 2009 at 12:04 am: "I don’t think we’ll see the likes of this country, as it was then, ever again." In many respects, I don't want to see it as it was. I don't want to see the predominant poverty and low education levels preceding WW II. I don't want to see the open racism and discrimination. I don't want to the backwards technology in medicine and science. I like where we are and want to keep moving on. It's getting better! What, I think, zuzu wants are examples of selflessness demonstrated by Mr. Barfoot. All one has to do is dig a bit and see that the same dedication is demonstrated every day in Iraq, Afghanistan, and all the other postings of our military. Their professionalism and sacrifice astound me. AND ALL OF THEM VOLUNTEERED!! Our military men and women all had better choices than in Mr. Barfoot's day, yet they decided to risk it all for our country. Our country is much better today than it ever has been, because of these people and their willingness to volunteer and it will continue to be. Where do you think that spirit came from? Our way of life and society fostered it, warts and all. Don't let all the fussing you see on this site and all the other similar sites fool you. As I like to say, if it ain't worth arguing about, it ain't worth a damn. zuzu said on 5 Dec 2009 at 12:04 am:

“I don’t think we’ll see the likes of this country, as it was then, ever again.”

In many respects, I don’t want to see it as it was. I don’t want to see the predominant poverty and low education levels preceding WW II. I don’t want to see the open racism and discrimination. I don’t want to the backwards technology in medicine and science. I like where we are and want to keep moving on. It’s getting better!

What, I think, zuzu wants are examples of selflessness demonstrated by Mr. Barfoot. All one has to do is dig a bit and see that the same dedication is demonstrated every day in Iraq, Afghanistan, and all the other postings of our military. Their professionalism and sacrifice astound me. AND ALL OF THEM VOLUNTEERED!! Our military men and women all had better choices than in Mr. Barfoot’s day, yet they decided to risk it all for our country. Our country is much better today than it ever has been, because of these people and their willingness to volunteer and it will continue to be. Where do you think that spirit came from? Our way of life and society fostered it, warts and all. Don’t let all the fussing you see on this site and all the other similar sites fool you. As I like to say, if it ain’t worth arguing about, it ain’t worth a damn.

]]> By: zuzu http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90534 zuzu Sat, 05 Dec 2009 05:04:14 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90534 I wish I'd been part of the Greatest Generation like Col. Barfoot because this generation, MY generation scares the living hell out of me. I don't think we'll see the likes of this country, as it was then, ever again. I wish I’d been part of the Greatest Generation like Col. Barfoot because this generation, MY generation scares the living hell out of me. I don’t think we’ll see the likes of this country, as it was then, ever again.

]]> By: Raymond Beverage http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90532 Raymond Beverage Sat, 05 Dec 2009 03:19:43 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90532 Well, since the rule of the land is in the U.S. Code, and the US Flag is in Title 4 which stipulates the when, where, and how it can be displayed...and the only person who is authorized under law to change that when, where and how is the President of the United States (as in ordering half-mast), seems to me the HOA is in violation of Federal Law. No Commonwealth/State/Territory/District can overide that law - and no individual or group of citizens can either. One of the things that turned me off to HOAs was my intent 15 years ago when I bought my house in Manassas was to run up the Colors in my front yard since I served 18 years as a Marine Brat, then 23 years in the Army earning my way from one mosquito wing, to three up & three down. What kills me is when an HOA considers a free-standing flag pole in the same category of somebody putting pink flamingos in the yard! Those boards forget their PRIVILEDGE to make rules - not a RIGHT nor LAW - is because the Colonel and my fellow Veterans of all Services (to include their families who put up with our call in life) signed on to defend their right...regardless of a shooting war or not. Thus endeth the lesson....Master Sergeant (E-8) of 23 years; and 12 years after hanging up the spurs...still standing by my Oath! Well, since the rule of the land is in the U.S. Code, and the US Flag is in Title 4 which stipulates the when, where, and how it can be displayed…and the only person who is authorized under law to change that when, where and how is the President of the United States (as in ordering half-mast), seems to me the HOA is in violation of Federal Law.

No Commonwealth/State/Territory/District can overide that law - and no individual or group of citizens can either. One of the things that turned me off to HOAs was my intent 15 years ago when I bought my house in Manassas was to run up the Colors in my front yard since I served 18 years as a Marine Brat, then 23 years in the Army earning my way from one mosquito wing, to three up & three down.

What kills me is when an HOA considers a free-standing flag pole in the same category of somebody putting pink flamingos in the yard! Those boards forget their PRIVILEDGE to make rules - not a RIGHT nor LAW - is because the Colonel and my fellow Veterans of all Services (to include their families who put up with our call in life) signed on to defend their right…regardless of a shooting war or not.

Thus endeth the lesson….Master Sergeant (E-8) of 23 years; and 12 years after hanging up the spurs…still standing by my Oath!

]]> By: Old Soldier http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90531 Old Soldier Sat, 05 Dec 2009 02:21:44 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90531 RLD, Following your logic, we wouldn't be a Country or a have a Constitution because a revolution was a violation of the rule of law. I'm guessing you would have been with the Brits of the time who were for the rule of law and against the revolution. RLD,

Following your logic, we wouldn’t be a Country or a have a Constitution because a revolution was a violation of the rule of law.

I’m guessing you would have been with the Brits of the time who were for the rule of law and against the revolution.

]]> By: cdubbs http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90530 cdubbs Sat, 05 Dec 2009 01:38:48 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90530 You know what? Rule of Law? When the Federal Government deports all the illegal aliens like it is supposed to do, puts all the tax cheat politicians behind bars, puts the terrorists in front of military tribunals, has hearings on the Ft. Hood massacre and climategate, and repeals Kelo, then maybe, just maybe I might see my way clear to thinking that the HOA might have a point about a lone flag pole. You can fix a lot of potholes and reseed a lot of common space with the money they are spending on retaining lawyers for this. If it is in the rules, all the people who voted for "hope and change" ought to be backing this guy if for no other reason than wanting to change things. For the rest of us MOH trumps HOA any day of the week. You know what? Rule of Law? When the Federal Government deports all the illegal aliens like it is supposed to do, puts all the tax cheat politicians behind bars, puts the terrorists in front of military tribunals, has hearings on the Ft. Hood massacre and climategate, and repeals Kelo, then maybe, just maybe I might see my way clear to thinking that the HOA might have a point about a lone flag pole. You can fix a lot of potholes and reseed a lot of common space with the money they are spending on retaining lawyers for this. If it is in the rules, all the people who voted for “hope and change” ought to be backing this guy if for no other reason than wanting to change things. For the rest of us MOH trumps HOA any day of the week.

]]> By: anonymous http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90529 anonymous Sat, 05 Dec 2009 00:30:20 +0000 http://www.bvbl.net/index.php/2009/12/03/hoa-vs-medal-of-honor-recipient/#comment-90529 Here is some info that his MOH citation does not tell you. (From the book Medal of Honor he is on page 16). Later is his life Van Barfoot would be hailed as one of the most significant Native American heroes of WW2. He took part in the landings at Sicily and Salerno and Anzio In May of 1944 Barfoot's unit was in a defensive position near Carano, during which Barfoot conducted day and night patrols to probe the German lines, mentally mapping out the terrain and minefields in front of the enemy positions. On May 23rd his company was ordered to attack. As the lead squads approached the German minefields, they came under heavy fire. Because he knew the lanes through the minefields so well, Barfoot asked for permission to head a squad.... He was given the option the choice of returning to the States for the ceremony or receiving the medal in the field, he chose the latter so that his men could be present. Lt General Alexander Patch awarded him the medal in Epinal France on Sept. 28th 1944. Here is some info that his MOH citation does not tell you.

(From the book Medal of Honor he is on page 16).

Later is his life Van Barfoot would be hailed as one of the most significant Native American heroes of WW2.

He took part in the landings at Sicily and Salerno and Anzio

In May of 1944 Barfoot’s unit was in a defensive position near Carano, during which Barfoot conducted day and night patrols to probe the German lines, mentally mapping out the terrain and minefields in front of the enemy positions.

On May 23rd his company was ordered to attack. As the lead squads approached the German minefields, they came under heavy fire. Because he knew the lanes through the minefields so well, Barfoot asked for permission to head a squad….

He was given the option the choice of returning to the States for the ceremony or receiving the medal in the field, he chose the latter so that his men could be present.

Lt General Alexander Patch awarded him the medal in Epinal France on Sept. 28th 1944.

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